Author Topic: 600D/T3i Raw Video  (Read 186831 times)

Critical Point

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #700 on: June 14, 2013, 10:49:27 AM »
Damn ! Imagine what would have meant to have a faster SD controller and shoot 1080p with the 600D. F*** you Canon !

Anyway, you should try to make 24 fps out of 12 fps with twixtor, see what that will produce.
600D & GH2 / PC.

Andy600

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #701 on: June 14, 2013, 10:53:46 AM »
I never understand this attitude towards Canon  ??? The SD slot was perfectly OK for recording until raw video (not a Canon feature) was made possible. Don't forget, the 600d is a consumer DSLR.
Colorist working with Davinci Resolve, Baselight, Nuke, After Effects & Premier Pro. Occasional Sunday afternoon DOP. Developer of Cinelog-C Colorspace Management and LUTs - www.cinelogdcp.com

Critical Point

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #702 on: June 14, 2013, 10:58:48 AM »
Yes, I know, I know, 600D is a good little camera for H.264, but damn, look at that RAW quality out of a 600D !
600D & GH2 / PC.

Andy600

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #703 on: June 14, 2013, 11:04:14 AM »
Yes, I know, I know, 600D is a good little camera for H.264, but damn, look at that RAW quality !

You have a 600d for decent H.264 and ability to use Picture Styles to get the most from the camera's DR and a GH2 for resolution. Get a cheap 50d for raw video ;)

We're at the budget end of things on these cameras and non of them will be all things to all people but they can all do amazing things when you think about it.
Colorist working with Davinci Resolve, Baselight, Nuke, After Effects & Premier Pro. Occasional Sunday afternoon DOP. Developer of Cinelog-C Colorspace Management and LUTs - www.cinelogdcp.com

Viente

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #704 on: June 14, 2013, 11:12:05 AM »
I've sold 600D for about 500USD and got 50D for 300USD and never regret about this :)

frontloop

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #705 on: June 14, 2013, 11:19:36 AM »
For RAW Video the 5DIII is the right camera, and the price is a joke for this quality. I have the 600D and i'm happy with the 20 MB limit, i don't need 10 x 32 GB SD Cards to get the shots ;)

AriLG

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #706 on: June 14, 2013, 11:28:31 AM »
Yes, I know, I know, 600D is a good little camera for H.264, but damn, look at that RAW quality out of a 600D !
Considering the price I (we) paid for the camera, the amount of data generated by the RAW output (not as skull smashing as the 5D Mk III), the quality achieved thus far (first I thought the lower resolution was simply "not there". after comparing countless times RAW vs H264 with my own camera - I do not not think so anymore) - I (WE) should be grateful for what we have. it's nice to have "more" but think of what has been achieved up till now....

One thing, though : workflow is a pain  :-\ 

If I were to shoot full day of something meaningful, as of now I have to devote at least ANOTHER working day just to prepare the material for editing.

(OTOH, coming to think about it - and Philip Bloom talked about it at great length - RAW is pain, PERIOD)
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Critical Point

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #707 on: June 14, 2013, 11:48:01 AM »
Get a cheap 50d for raw video ;)
Neah, for raw I'll buy myself a nice black magic pocket cinema.

But just wondering, will it also be a pain in the but with the b.m.p.c. post work as is with raw on canon ?
600D & GH2 / PC.

Andy600

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #708 on: June 14, 2013, 11:51:15 AM »
Neah, for raw I'll buy myself a nice black magic pocket cinema.

But just wondering, will it also be a pain in the but with the b.m.p.c. post work as is with raw on canon ?

The BM Pocket CC doesn't shoot raw video yet and it will not ship with raw recording features afaik. It's a concept and you don't know what additional equipment you may actually need ;) ....but yes, I still want one too :)
Colorist working with Davinci Resolve, Baselight, Nuke, After Effects & Premier Pro. Occasional Sunday afternoon DOP. Developer of Cinelog-C Colorspace Management and LUTs - www.cinelogdcp.com

Critical Point

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #709 on: June 14, 2013, 12:28:38 PM »
The only worry I have, is that the demand will be so high, that they won't be capable of meeting the market demand and the price will go up immediately after release.
600D & GH2 / PC.

robrock_68

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #710 on: June 14, 2013, 12:45:00 PM »
The BM Pocket CC doesn't shoot raw video yet and it will not ship with raw recording features afaik. It's a concept and you don't know what additional equipment you may actually need ;) ....but yes, I still want one too :)


Where are you seeing this information? Everything I've seen on the camera, including sample footage from the "previews" sent to certain people, show raw recording is functioning on these cameras, and will ship with the feature fully functional. 

Andy600

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #711 on: June 14, 2013, 01:06:12 PM »

Where are you seeing this information? Everything I've seen on the camera, including sample footage from the "previews" sent to certain people, show raw recording is functioning on these cameras, and will ship with the feature fully functional.

Where is this raw footage? I've only seen Prores and I haven't seen any official BM announcements about final release specs
Colorist working with Davinci Resolve, Baselight, Nuke, After Effects & Premier Pro. Occasional Sunday afternoon DOP. Developer of Cinelog-C Colorspace Management and LUTs - www.cinelogdcp.com

CFP

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #712 on: June 14, 2013, 02:44:39 PM »
I haven't seen any official BM announcements about final release specs
Did you see this: Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera | Technical Specifications? Is this not official? :o

But I totally agree with you. The 600D is a great camera and we should be happy with what we have. Of corse, the H.264 video looks way worse than it could if Canon wouldn't want us to have that poor image quality. But it still looks better than most of the camcorders in this price range.

But I'm also thinking that Canon shouldn't waste so much potential of their DSLRs. It makes me sad ...

Look at the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera: It isn't impossible to create an amazing camera with high dynamic range, professional video formats and interchangeable lenses for under 1000 €. And we also know that the Canon DSLR could have all these features and more if Canon would allow us to have them. Actually the Canon DSLR could be even better than the Blackmagic cameras since they have much bigger sensors.

Now where Magic Lantern has unlocked all these stunning features on the Canon DSLR, they are just one step away from being the best cameras in the affordable film industrie. And it is sad that Canon wastes this potential completely :(

robrock_68

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #713 on: June 14, 2013, 03:11:26 PM »
Where is this raw footage? I've only seen Prores and I haven't seen any official BM announcements about final release specs

Final release specs are on the site, and the camera is still scheduled for production release in late July. From what I can gleen, the firmware is still a work in progress, so I guess they better get their butts in gear for the release dates. All point to being able to shoot Cinema DNG (Raw) on high speed SD cards, which is the whole point of the camera and pricepoint. If they don't deliver, then, well, too bad for them. I did find that there are a few "DNG" sequences out there, but they are only available to view as compressed streaming files, and until the firmware is finalized, you won't see camera files released to the public

N/A

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #714 on: June 14, 2013, 09:07:26 PM »
The pocket cine looks amazing for the price. And for the same price, one could buy two 600D's or 50D's. Either way, we are the ones who benefit from these types of innovations.

I just wonder how sturdy the pocket cine will be. I've put my poor 600D through hell and it still runs like a champ. Not to mention, I imagine with it being so small, it could get lost or stolen quite easily.
7D. 600D. Rokinon 35 cine. Sigma 30 1.4
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guy01

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #715 on: June 14, 2013, 09:45:59 PM »
I think most people will agree that finding out about the limit on the sd card controller really hurts when you purchased a uhs-1 card.  I knew I wouldn't benefit from uhs, but I had no idea how little speed I was getting from those cards.
 :-[

Critical Point

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #716 on: June 14, 2013, 10:12:13 PM »
Well, no matter how good the pocket cinema will turn out to be, I ain't selling my 600D. I am going to buy a pocket cinema camera, but I'm also going to keep the 600D.
600D & GH2 / PC.

Andy600

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #717 on: June 14, 2013, 10:16:11 PM »
@CFP yes, I've seen those specs and they do include compressed CDNG but weirdly it omits the data rate for CDNG, only Prores is shown (@220Mbps). BM also said in several interviews when it was announced that raw recording might not be available when the camera starts shipping. They could of course be holding back showing raw BMPCC footage publicly to gain the maximum impact from advertising just before it is released but you have to ask yourself why? When most who will get one have probably pre-ordered. TBH I think BM will be shipping on the date they committed to this time but I won't be surprised to find that raw video is in a later FW update.

I'm was waiting to see some real world footage from users to make my mind up about buying one but the 50d bombshell made me rethink. I would still love to get one because I like what I have seen but I'll sit on the fence a little longer.
Colorist working with Davinci Resolve, Baselight, Nuke, After Effects & Premier Pro. Occasional Sunday afternoon DOP. Developer of Cinelog-C Colorspace Management and LUTs - www.cinelogdcp.com

Jonit

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #718 on: June 15, 2013, 11:55:47 AM »
I made a quick benchmark of a SanDisk Extreme 45MB/s. After formatting it to exFAT file system, it gives stable 20+MB write speeds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HI4XZPAMoZk

jordillonch

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #719 on: June 15, 2013, 01:42:40 PM »
I made a quick benchmark of a SanDisk Extreme 45MB/s. After formatting it to exFAT file system, it gives stable 20+MB write speeds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HI4XZPAMoZk


Hi Jonit,

You just read my mind, yesterday I did two tests with a 64 GB Sandisk Extreme 45MB/s





I also did a test in the computer, with those results:



Are we sure those cards are 45 MB/s??? Maybe I also have a bottleneck on my SD card reader, has somebody else tried the 45 MB/s cards on their compurters? I recommend the h2testw app (http://flashfakecentral.wordpress.com/testing-flash-memory-chips/h2testw-english/), but you can try just transfering big files from the computer to the SD and check the transfer speed.

CFP

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #720 on: June 15, 2013, 02:16:06 PM »
I think it's quite pointless to post benchmarks of your SD cards in this thread.
Everybody understood that the SD-Controller is limited to 21 Megabyte/s write speed.

@ jordillonch: Your card reader probably doesn't support UHS-1 so it has the same limitation like our cameras.
The SanDisk 45 Megabyte/s cards actually are that fast. Here's a benchmark I found on Amazon:

[Spoiler][/Spoiler]


@ Andy600: That's interesting. I wasn't aware of the possibility that the Cinema DNG recording might be added with a later firmware update.
Thank you for sharing this thought. But I just used it as an example to show that it is possible to create a good video camera even for such a low price. In my opinion Canon creates good cameras for stills but they waste a lot of potential on the video side, just to protect their expensive camcorders. I mean, look at the 5D Mark III. Canon could have done what Magic Lantern does without any problems.

Anyway. I'll stay with my 600D and its H.264 videos, waiting to see how well the 70D and BMPCC will perform ...

jordillonch

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #721 on: June 15, 2013, 02:20:20 PM »
I think it's quite pintless to post benchmarks of your SD cards in this thread.
Everybody understood that the SD-Controller is limited to 21 Megabyte/s write speed.

@ jordillonch: Your cardreader probably doesn't support UHS-1 so has the same limitation like our cameras.
The SanDisk 45 Megabyte/s cards actually are that fast. Here's a benchmark I found on Amazon:

[Spoiler][/Spoiler]

Thanks men!

caser

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #722 on: June 15, 2013, 04:19:46 PM »
"Crop35.com @Crop35com
Now You can edit @autoexec_bin ML RAW files directly in #Premiere and #AE  http://bit.ly/1biobfP  with #gingerHDR plugin from @19lights."

I installed the lasted version of Ginger HDR from 19lights.com and it works fine so far.  It imports to Premiere Pro cs6 the .raw file without having to convert to .dng (I was using raw2dng.exe) then importing to Lightroom to convert to PSD 16bit then importing to Premiere.

I was having problems with Premiere crashing with the PSD files, which were also auto converting to 30fps from 20fps. 

Now I just import the raw file itself without converting...the time it saves is hours and hours.

I simply cannot believe how easy this is compared to before.  I feel that something HAS to go wrong somewhere, but not at all!!!!

Such a surprise.  I bought this 600D on Craigslist for $350 I think just days before Magic Lantern announced raw recording.  It has been really fun so far.


caser

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #723 on: June 15, 2013, 04:24:53 PM »
Oh I also had several files larger than 4GB that had broken up and I thought they would be useless because raw2dng.exe didn't seem to be able to handle it, or I couldn't figure it out, but now I just import the file into Premiere like any other file.

I am still in shock a little bit this morning....

1%

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Re: Uncompressed 600D Raw Video
« Reply #724 on: June 15, 2013, 06:00:13 PM »
The broken up files will combine in terminal, rawanizer and I guess ginger hdr.. might give it another go since the dev fixed it.