Author Topic: The HDMI thread - tips, tricks, workaround and solutions for external monitors  (Read 18143 times)

dpjpandone

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I wanted to start a thread where I could keep some notes about some of the workarounds I've been using for reliable raw capture while an external monitor is connected.

The following tips apply to 7D, and possibly others, please feel free to add your own camera specific tips below:

1. For the best experience (at the cost of monitor resolution) I advise to use the "force-VGA" option in the "advanced" menu. This limits the hdmi output to 480p and all of the cropmarks, global draw overlays, and even playback via MLV_PLAY works perfectly. This mode does not seem to tax the cpu any more than using the camera's LCD screen as it's the same resolution.

2. If you need to use 1080i because you are pulling focus, or some other reason where monitor resolution is critical, you should disable as many of the overlays as possible for the best performance.


3. for the BEST performance I recommend you set global draw to" "Don't Allow" in the MLV menu. This will clear all the overlays when you hit record, and show the full native 3:2 image from your sensor on the hdmi monitor. If your monitor supports custom cropmarks or framing guides, you can use those instead. I recently bought a marshall vlcd-56md  that has custom scaling and custom cropmarks, they are very nice features to use with ML Raw. My Zacuto EVF also does this, as well as most of the offerings from small HD. If your monitor doesn't have these features, you can always use anti-glare screen protector film to mask off the active recording area on your monitor. This way you can still see through to check your settings.

4. Do lot's of testing of your settings, and check the recorded result on your computer before you go shoot with these settings. Make sure you're not recording a lot of pink frames or a torn image. Something I've recently discovered is that when i'm using HDMI and I set the canon Q menu to 1080 24p, Almost every other frame is torn, and the resulting footage is unusable, but if I set canon Q menu to 1080 30p, and use FPS Override to set my frame rate to 24, (or 23.976) the recorded image is no longer torn, but I still get some pink frames. The only settings I have found to work reliably with no tearing or pink frames with hdmi monitor at 1080i is to set the region to PAL so that 1920 25p becomes available in canon Q menu. Then I use exact framerate FPS override to get 23.976. There is no tearing, and I get very few pink frames (if any). 


Hopefully, we can add tips and tricks for other cameras below and have a nice thread that can save new users some headaches, and possibly even provide some useful information that may lead to new developments to improve external monitor usage.

Ethan_Reitz

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I've been having bad tearing issues recently using the 5d mark ii and I'm going to see if setting the "force vga" option does the trick on my camera as well. Thanks for the information - it gives at least a good starting point to identify the issue.

I have the feeling less and less people are using the mark ii for serious work. That's understandable given the better performance with the mark iii. Still you can get a great image from the mark ii and I'll still be using it for a while yet to come.

Francis Frenkel

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I have the feeling less and less people are using the mark ii for serious work. That's understandable given the better performance with the mark iii. Still you can get a great image from the mark ii and I'll still be using it for a while yet to come.

I still use my mark2 for "serious" work !
The difference with the mark3 are very small in most situations !
http://vimeo.com/102640727

Francis
Francis Frenkel
www.ffrenkel.com

budafilms

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I wanted to start a thread where I could keep some notes about some of the workarounds I've been using for reliable raw capture while an external monitor is connected.

The following tips apply to 7D, and possibly others, please feel free to add your own camera specific tips below:

1. For the best experience (at the cost of monitor resolution) I advise to use the "force-VGA" option in the "advanced" menu. This limits the hdmi output to 480p and all of the cropmarks, global draw overlays, and even playback via MLV_PLAY works perfectly. This mode does not seem to tax the cpu any more than using the camera's LCD screen as it's the same resolution.

2. If you need to use 1080i because you are pulling focus, or some other reason where monitor resolution is critical, you should disable as many of the overlays as possible for the best performance.


3. for the BEST performance I recommend you set global draw to" "Don't Allow" in the MLV menu. This will clear all the overlays when you hit record, and show the full native 3:2 image from your sensor on the hdmi monitor. If your monitor supports custom cropmarks or framing guides, you can use those instead. I recently bought a marshall vlcd-56md  that has custom scaling and custom cropmarks, they are very nice features to use with ML Raw. My Zacuto EVF also does this, as well as most of the offerings from small HD. If your monitor doesn't have these features, you can always use anti-glare screen protector film to mask off the active recording area on your monitor. This way you can still see through to check your settings.

4. Do lot's of testing of your settings, and check the recorded result on your computer before you go shoot with these settings. Make sure you're not recording a lot of pink frames or a torn image. Something I've recently discovered is that when i'm using HDMI and I set the canon Q menu to 1080 24p, Almost every other frame is torn, and the resulting footage is unusable, but if I set canon Q menu to 1080 30p, and use FPS Override to set my frame rate to 24, (or 23.976) the recorded image is no longer torn, but I still get some pink frames. The only settings I have found to work reliably with no tearing or pink frames with hdmi monitor at 1080i is to set the region to PAL so that 1920 25p becomes available in canon Q menu. Then I use exact framerate FPS override to get 23.976. There is no tearing, and I get very few pink frames (if any). 


Hopefully, we can add tips and tricks for other cameras below and have a nice thread that can save new users some headaches, and possibly even provide some useful information that may lead to new developments to improve external monitor usage.

Hi. Do you know how to watch the bars (16x9 or whatever) when you press REC? Only appears the icon yellow, red or green and you lost your real margins. That are very different from the monitor. I thinks this is most importan because who operate the camera don't see the same as the person who is in the external monitor.

reddeercity

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I've been having bad tearing issues recently using the 5d mark ii
What build are you using ? Setting ? More info  as I never seen this problem with the 5D2 , 
I have been using ML Raw since May of 2013 on my 5D2 never a  problem .

Quote
I have the feeling less and less people are using the mark ii for serious work.
There is a lot of people who still use there 5D2 as I do for Serious work  and Its the second most popular camera .
Its the most stable of all Camera's , been rock solid with hdmi since Feb,2014 . As the 5D3 is still a work in progress .
You don't hear of people really having any big problem  with the 5d2 , other then wrong setting or slow CF cards.

If this is a indications , I made a short video on New Years Day January 2014  tittle
"Magic Lantern 5D Mark ii MLV 14bit Raw + Audio ~ New Raw Format 2014"
Its feature on the 5D2 Camera-specific discussion page .
Just check my Vimeo & YouTube Statistics as its posted to both but the vimeo post  has the embed from Magic Lantern.

Vimeo.com as of August 8th 2014
960-Total downloads   (Week of Jan 13, 2014 "824")
101,696-loads
6,610---plays
YouTube
plays-9005
I'm not saying everyone is using 5D2 for paid work but I answer a lot of question on my vimeo site for
Semi Pro to Pro users .  ;)
 



 
 

dpjpandone

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Hi. Do you know how to watch the bars (16x9 or whatever) when you press REC? Only appears the icon yellow, red or green and you lost your real margins. That are very different from the monitor. I thinks this is most importan because who operate the camera don't see the same as the person who is in the external monitor.

Make sure you have "global draw" set to "allow" in the mlv menu.

Ethan_Reitz

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@reddeercity thanks for all your great info. I've been watching your tutorials and posts here for a while.

I'm certainly going to keep using my 5d mark ii for a while to come and I intend to get paid ;) So there you go. Nice to hear of others doing the same.

As for the tearing: big problem which ruined several shots.

magiclantern-Nightly.2014Jul08.5D2212 is the version I am using. And yes, I'm aware of the warnings. I enjoy the bleeding edge and don't whine when things get messy. I obviously do, however, look for workarounds, fixes or info.

I think the tearing is in fact linked to my monitor as it seems to be gone when using the "force-VGA" option in the "advanced" menu suggested above. Thanks @dpjpandone Your suggestion seems to have done the trick for the 5d mark ii as well.

I'd be interested in hearing anyone elses experience.

I'm using a small lilliput monitor btw. I don't have the model number just now. Will post it also. Cheers!

reddeercity

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@Ethan_Reitz  Your welcome  :D
Yes I see the problem, I'm still using NB feb 16th 2014 build .
It the only one I can get 1872 horizontal the new builds are limited to 1856.
I also Record the HDMI(Ninja) for backup as well as monitoring (Zacuto Evf) without issue .
So it sound like the tearing problem is with the new builds , I suggest try some older builds and see
if the problem is still there.
One thought thou , what is your frame rate you are recording raw (24p or 25p) as I do know
this can be a problem with Ninja hdmi recorder.
Because in the HDMI stream ntsc 60i 422 has a embedded 23.976 fps .
So if you are set internally to 25p instead of 24p it could cause problem, just a thought . :)
 

budafilms

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Make sure you have "global draw" set to "allow" in the mlv menu.

You are my man of the month ;)
Works. Continous recording MLV 1920x1080 25P with HDMI Mirror mode.

Thanks!

dpjpandone

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I think the tearing is in fact linked to my monitor as it seems to be gone when using the "force-VGA" option in the "advanced" menu suggested above. Thanks @dpjpandone Your suggestion seems to have done the trick for the 5d mark ii as well.


Ethan,

I have been trying some different edmacs on my 7D that show GREAT IMPROVEMENT with the tearing/hdmi issue. I will borrow a 5D2 asap from my friend to see if the same changes will help. I know how bad it sucks to use your monitor in 480p..... 

dpjpandone

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Hey guys,

something else I learned was that auto lighting optimization, highlight priority, and high iso noise reduction have a negative impact on performance when using HDMI. Disable all of these in the canon menu.

I usually have these off, but I rented a B-cam last week and forgot to check those settings, I ended up with some torn frames again.... turned them off and it went away!

exR

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I still own one of those crappy 600D/T3i's. I know, that I can normally only get 480p out of the HDMI port. But at that doc here and in some other threads I've read something about higher resolutions. I'm not sure if they were talking about higher resolutions through HDMI or internal. My question:

Is it possible with the help of ML to get a higher res videostream out of the HDMI port, like "1728x1156", or not?