Canon 70D

[janoschsimon]

we need incamera wavelet compression just like red 

keep up the great work guys :-)

[draco]

Can raw video go out hdmi?

[emvee]

Thanks for the explanation Walter 

[kekorr]

From where I can get off the alpha? video raw is awesome

[Makadamia]

It's a closed very early alpha. No admissions anymore.

Truly awesome, keep up the good work

[DigitalVeil]

Sorry if this sounds like a newbie question, but just so I'm clear, is the reason that the 70D won't be able to record RAW video at 1080p because the SD controller can only write at around 40 mb/s and RAW requires faster writing speeds?

Correct, but that's only 1 of 2 reasons.  The other reason is the sensor.  Due to the way raw video is recorded (reading only 1 of every 3 lines) the maximum resolution you can read from the sensor is 1856x1044.  So even if it had a CF slot that could write 100MB/s, it still couldn't shoot full 1080p.  Which sucks, because the video these cameras shoot is already pretty soft, upscaling it will make it even softer.

Speaking of that, I wonder if the 3x crop mode will allow the full 1920?  It wouldn't matter for this camera, but it might matter for the 7D Mark II (same sensor).  If so, you could use a really wide-angle lens to get a full 1080p image at a reasonable FOV.

[ikemikek]

So will this ML be able to override Canon's 29:59" recording limit? They have it programmed so it can't record any longer than that.

[walter_schulz]

Top of page -> User Guide -> FAQ

[AntoineLavenant]

I really wonder how can Canon put some much limitations to its cameras when they have the Panasonic GH4 as a competitor ! 

[Aaberg]

@AntoineLevanent EU customs laws. Google it.

[AntoineLavenant]

@Aaberg I'm not talking about the 29 minutes regulation. I meant the video compression, the writing speed, etc etc.  Also DigitalVeil was talking about 1856x1044 maximum.

[DigitalVeil]

I really wonder how can Canon put some much limitations to its cameras when they have the Panasonic GH4 as a competitor ! 

Canon owes the ML devs a ton of money.  If it wasn't for ML they would surely lose a lot of sales to their competition.  Right now, the 7D Mark II and GH4 are only $100 apart, and with the 7D2's lack of ML, the GH4 craps all over it.  Even with a ML port the GH4 is probably still the better deal.  I've never bought a camera over $1K but if I was choosing between the 7D2 and GH4, I'd unfortunately probably choose the 7D2 purely because of the investment I've made in Canon lenses.

Look at this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nH5fafQQddg

If you ask me, I'd say the compressed GH4 footage still looks better than 5D3 raw, and obviously destroys the compressed 5D3 footage despite a bit rate that's only slightly higher.  Canon's compression is so disgusting, you'd think in a 1080p YouTube video, 91Mbps 1080p footage would look better than 100Mbps 4K footage.  But no, the GH4 can record 4x the amount of pixels at almost the same bit rate with much better detail.  And not to forget after all that, the GH4 literally costs half of what the 5D3 costs.  The only advantage the 5D3 has is sensor size.  If the 5D3 didn't have ML? lol.

Yes, I understand the whole "cinematic" argument but IMO it's easier to soften in post than it is to sharpen.  Removing detail will usually work better than adding fake detail.  Still photography is a whole different story, and obviously DSLRs are made for photography first.  But I can't advise any aspiring videographer to choose any Canon camera over a GH4 or a Black Magic or a Sony for video production.

[AntoineLavenant]

DigitalVeil => Yeah, totally agree. Right now, to me the lenses are the major argument for Canon. Sometimes I wonder if I should sell my 70d+lenses and go to a gh4...
I already saw some comparison of gh4 vs 5DmkII and it's crazy how sharp the gh4 is.
Still love my 70d and thanks to Nikfreak work, it will soon be a lot better ! 

[GARoss]

It's hard to argue against the GH4 for video. But, certainly an argument could be made for the 5mk3 for photography. They are different animals. In this case you can't have your cake & eat it too. I wish that wasn't true but it's not.

I take vastly more photos than video. That's why I bought the 70D with hopes ML would bring RAW video to it. That would be having your cake & eat it too. 

[ShootMeAlready]

Ive been biting my tongue. But here goes a little bit.

Ive seen great video shot on a 550D, h264, and with very little gear.  Check out the link, and "Portrait of Macerata" clip at the bottom.  The other clips he explains how he did it with very little gear.
http://philipbloom.net/2013/09/13/part3/

Ive seen great video shot with a 600D, H264 with just a monopod as in the clip bellow.  Thes guys have a whack of tutorials on how to shoot cinematic with DSLRs.
https://vimeo.com/51671122

Ive seen great video shot on a 60D in H264.
https://vimeo.com/15529823

So aps-c H264 is extremely competent.

Dont tell me the 5DMIII is crap compared to a GH4.  The GH4 is a different tool.  You can shoot 4k also on a galaxy not phone camera that's sharper than a 5DMIII ... so what?
Cinematic film, rarely needs a 4K sharpness infact most cinematographers soft focus more often than sharpen for film. 
The skin tones on a GH4 always suck, and its bokeh is ugly.  Its just not that kind of tool, its well lit master shots are great. Its DR in the well lit master shot is great.
You can crop it in post great.    The 5DIII bokeh, low light noise, shallow DOF, RAW colour, are all fabulous with right glass/skill. 
And for general 35mm film, the aps-c sensor size sensor is the king, its what's in a RED ONE. 
Film set guys complain about the FF cameras, because the DOF is so shallow, it requires a lot of takes to nail it.
You want to get it done, an aps-c camera is your bread and butter.   
I like all three of these 70D, GH4, and 5DIII but each for its own strength, neither does it all. 

Walter is right, sorry for tangential stuff. 

[DJHaze596]

That Comparison sucked, and call me crazy but the second shot inside the shade looked like the 5D was sharper and had more detail overall.  Yes the GH4 shoots 4k but that doesn't mean its good at it.  I would gladly take the 5D Mark III RAW Video and High ISO performance over the crappy High ISO and Highly Compressed footage from the GH4 not to mention the crappy Lens lineup too. I was surprise Dave Dugdale sold all his canon gear to shoot GH4 and A7s.  It makes no sense,  RAW gives you so much more Possibilities in post.  Only thing you can do with the 4k Footage is crop.

[Walter Schulz]

Please keep topic and don't go astray. This is about 70D.

[TomJ]

You want to get it done, an aps-c camera is your bread and butter.   

It certainly is mine. T3i, 7D, T4i and now the 70D (and I'm on my second 70D body already...)

Shooting the pilot for a comedy series this Sat with it (yes, I'm that confident of its abilities). When ML is alpha, open invite to any devs who worked on it to drinks for a night, on me, if ever in Colorado (or south India where I normally am this time of year..., currently stuck in this bloody frozen hell...)!

[timovd]

Great work, Nikki. Bought my 70D in December 2014. Some experience with ML on other EOS systems (mainly for headphone monitoring and audio meters). Really looking forward!

[Toni_m_m]

When will all this be part of source?

[Walter Schulz]

Top of page -> User Guide -> FAQ -> Last one (section Troll Questions)

[Jackeatley]

That Comparison sucked, and call me crazy but the second shot inside the shade looked like the 5D was sharper and had more detail overall.  Yes the GH4 shoots 4k but that doesn't mean its good at it.  I would gladly take the 5D Mark III RAW Video and High ISO performance over the crappy High ISO and Highly Compressed footage from the GH4 not to mention the crappy Lens lineup too. I was surprise Dave Dugdale sold all his canon gear to shoot GH4 and A7s.  It makes no sense,  RAW gives you so much more Possibilities in post.  Only thing you can do with the 4k Footage is crop.

IMHO you couldn't be more wrong there, I've just bought a GH4 after shooting ML Raw and i'm very impressed, I can see why with a speedbooster Dave Dugdale did what he did. The high sensitivity performance is not bad at all, it is average, alot better than any canon bar the 5d3 1Ds and 6d. With the correct curves in camera and careful exposure the amount of latitude in post in very very good. I've tried a 70d, it was like digging up the garden with a small trowel and a broken wrist as a opposed to the JCB that is the GH4.

Detail and sharpness in a 5D image is deceptive, Your probably looking at aliasing and god knows what other nasties, I doubt that's real detail.

Yes the GH4 is compressed, but its done so well the resulting image if your doing it right is truly stunning, my mouth dropped when I pulled out the card and watched on a nice display after my initial test. I also love not worrying about batteries getting killed and changing 64gb cards every 15 mins, in fact its bliss.

But there's still a place in my heart for the canon raw, it is such a nice image in every department other than the aliasing and rolling shutter issues.

But don't kid yourselves folks, IMO as a video camera goes, the 70d does not hold a candle next to a GH4, sorry.

[DJHaze596]

IMHO you couldn't be more wrong there, I've just bought a GH4 after shooting ML Raw and i'm very impressed, I can see why with a speedbooster Dave Dugdale did what he did. The high sensitivity performance is not bad at all, it is average, alot better than any canon bar the 5d3 1Ds and 6d. With the correct curves in camera and careful exposure the amount of latitude in post in very very good. I've tried a 70d, it was like digging up the garden with a small trowel and a broken wrist as a opposed to the JCB that is the GH4.

Detail and sharpness in a 5D image is deceptive, Your probably looking at aliasing and god knows what other nasties, I doubt that's real detail.

Yes the GH4 is compressed, but its done so well the resulting image if your doing it right is truly stunning, my mouth dropped when I pulled out the card and watched on a nice display after my initial test. I also love not worrying about batteries getting killed and changing 64gb cards every 15 mins, in fact its bliss.

But there's still a place in my heart for the canon raw, it is such a nice image in every department other than the aliasing and rolling shutter issues.

But don't kid yourselves folks, IMO as a video camera goes, the 70d does not hold a candle next to a GH4, sorry.

I'm far from wrong,  You're comparing JPEG vs RAW.  RAW will always be better and i would NEVER Shoot JPEG even if i was running out of space.  Correct me if i'm wrong but did you just say the GH4 is better than the 5d3 1Ds and 6d ISO performance?  The 6D and 5D Mark III Blow away the GH4 in Low Light.  GH4 vs 70D High ISO would be a more proper Comparison to which the GH4 is a tiny bit better.  Yes Video Compression is getting better but the point is, it's still compressed,  You're still limited regardless but if you shoot in RAW,  You gain a lot more Data to play with let alone sharpness. 4k Video is not a standard yet so until then it's almost pointless. 

[Audionut]

Lets get back on topic please.

This thread is for ML 70D discussion only.  Off-topic banter (even about the 70D) doesn't fast track porting of ML to the camera, so bear that in mind.

The 70D owners club.

[DigitalVeil]

Has anyone with a pre-alpha build of ML tried setting ALL-I compression with 3.0x bit rate and the bit rate overlay on?  I'm curious if the camera actually reaches 270Mbps, and if it can do so without the encoder stopping.