Author Topic: 7D Raw Thread  (Read 432622 times)

arrinkiiii

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #225 on: August 18, 2013, 09:56:10 PM »
Aliasing on the lines of the court and the basketball pole and the frame... I don't know the workflow for RAW video but It looks like exporting error.

Indeed, aliasing is in the table, the lines of the court, etc.. thank god that i use tripod  ::)  7D got moire and aliasing, that the VAF can fix that, at least most of. 

http://www.mosaicengineering.com/products/vaf/7d.html

Exporting error? i don't think is that, but the flicker in the exposure in some images yes, maybe from ACR. I use raw2dng im going to try different app to see if exist any differences. 

Ozgur

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #226 on: August 19, 2013, 02:01:39 AM »
I know I'm late to the party, but I might as well put my video from last week up. I was still using RAW burst mode at the time:


Irrelevant but I was at the parl you shot your little video the other week. Cool place :)

tonybeccar

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #227 on: August 19, 2013, 05:39:31 AM »
Nice!! Was it shot at 2.5k?

I have a question.. WHY do we have a lot of alisasing and moire on 7D, same as 5D2 and others... I mean, the 7D when shooting H264 does NOT have that HUGE amount of moire.. it just has a tiny biy, which makes it completely usable!! But the raw.. it just makes the footage not usable at all if you do a wide-shot..

I'm thinking.. if it makes the same extact line-skipping to get to 1920x1080 as the H264 does... then, why?? And, it could be possible to fix it right??

Thanks!!

vnguyen972

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #228 on: August 19, 2013, 06:57:24 AM »
First tried the raw method with continuous shooting... still low resolution but it's a beginning of a great thing :) I can't wait for once the Live View frozen issue got fixed
Love my EOS7D!

britom

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #229 on: August 19, 2013, 07:02:58 AM »
I can't wait for once the Live View frozen issue got fixed

I'm dying slowly too...
7D Builds with RAW support: http://bit.ly/14Llzda

britom

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #230 on: August 19, 2013, 08:29:37 AM »
Test build (16/08/2013) :


- Added bolt_rec.mo, autoexpo.mo, ettr.mo
- Updated dual_iso.mo and pic_view.mo

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ifyeas56ltuqhg1/P-PeTt1Llz

USE AT YOUR OWN RISK! :)
7D Builds with RAW support: http://bit.ly/14Llzda

ted ramasola

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #231 on: August 19, 2013, 08:31:24 AM »
--edit: question answered.

Thanks for the update Britom
5DmkII  / 7D
www.ramasolaproductions.com
Texas

arrinkiiii

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #232 on: August 19, 2013, 10:23:11 AM »

britom

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #233 on: August 19, 2013, 03:53:06 PM »
I start to to panning with freeze Lv... i call it blind-pan

Lol I do the exact same thing :D
7D Builds with RAW support: http://bit.ly/14Llzda

mityazabuben

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #234 on: August 19, 2013, 07:38:22 PM »
Sorry, but cant find a guide how to shoot in RAW. Maybe add it in a first post?

arrinkiiii

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #235 on: August 19, 2013, 09:31:25 PM »
Sorry, but cant find a guide how to shoot in RAW. Maybe add it in a first post?

If you already have the raw module install just go to M tab in ML menu and load raw module. Go to video tab in ML menu and activate the raw, choose your frame size and you are good to go.

 

chroma

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #236 on: August 19, 2013, 09:40:38 PM »
Nice!! Was it shot at 2.5k?

I have a question.. WHY do we have a lot of alisasing and moire on 7D, same as 5D2 and others... I mean, the 7D when shooting H264 does NOT have that HUGE amount of moire.. it just has a tiny biy, which makes it completely usable!! But the raw.. it just makes the footage not usable at all if you do a wide-shot..

I'm thinking.. if it makes the same extact line-skipping to get to 1920x1080 as the H264 does... then, why?? And, it could be possible to fix it right??

Thanks!!

I did my first RAW tests with my 7D over the weekend and let me tell you as a Former Red One Owner, the 7D sensor is miles ahead of the original Red M Sensor.  I shot using the 2.35:1 - 1472x626 (which is slightly more total pixels than traditional 720p).  It blew my mind.

I rendered out these images from AE CS6 to CineForm 444 1080p24 avi's and compared to similarly transcoded Red files.  Here's the Truth:  The Canon 7D footage is deeper, richer and definitely more Film-like than the Red One (and I don't say this lightly: I'm one of those guys that shot in 65mm Super Panavision and did own the Red).  In the end, the Red One is too bulky, gets WAY TOO HOT and the RAW images are just way too...RAW (takes too long to grade a Red Image).  And with Magic Lantern RAW for the 7D, the Red is WAY TOO EXPENSIVE.  I can't believe how little tweaking the 7D RAW footage needed to look so....RICH!

Magic Lantern is really doing something truly special here.  My hat's off to all involved.  This really does change the game.  These great software guru's have proved to me that at this level Bit depth becomes truly more relevant than pixels.

Man, I wish I could write code!  I know the 7D is a struggle because of it's hardware architecture, but let's hope the ML folks stay at it!  It's definitely worth it!

BTW, I use the VAF filter on my 7D and there's ZERO ALIASING.  Get a VAF filter and forget about it.  You won't regret it.  It's a wondrous optical device.

stevelucky

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #237 on: August 19, 2013, 10:09:54 PM »
I did my first RAW tests with my 7D over the weekend and let me tell you as a Former Red One Owner, the 7D sensor is miles ahead of the original Red M Sensor.  I shot using the 2.35:1 - 1472x626 (which is slightly more total pixels than traditional 720p).  It blew my mind.

I rendered out these images from AE CS6 to CineForm 444 1080p24 avi's and compared to similarly transcoded Red files.  Here's the Truth:  The Canon 7D footage is deeper, richer and definitely more Film-like than the Red One (and I don't say this lightly: I'm one of those guys that shot in 65mm Super Panavision and did own the Red).  In the end, the Red One is too bulky, gets WAY TOO HOT and the RAW images are just way too...RAW (takes too long to grade a Red Image).  And with Magic Lantern RAW for the 7D, the Red is WAY TOO EXPENSIVE.  I can't believe how little tweaking the 7D RAW footage needed to look so....RICH!

Magic Lantern is really doing something truly special here.  My hat's off to all involved.  This really does change the game.  These great software guru's have proved to me that at this level Bit depth becomes truly more relevant than pixels.

Man, I wish I could write code!  I know the 7D is a struggle because of it's hardware architecture, but let's hope the ML folks stay at it!  It's definitely worth it!

BTW, I use the VAF filter on my 7D and there's ZERO ALIASING.  Get a VAF filter and forget about it.  You won't regret it.  It's a wondrous optical device.

I'd love to see some of your graded (and ungraded if you're interested) tests.

tonybeccar

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #238 on: August 19, 2013, 10:40:20 PM »
I did my first RAW tests with my 7D over the weekend and let me tell you as a Former Red One Owner, the 7D sensor is miles ahead of the original Red M Sensor.  I shot using the 2.35:1 - 1472x626 (which is slightly more total pixels than traditional 720p).  It blew my mind.

I rendered out these images from AE CS6 to CineForm 444 1080p24 avi's and compared to similarly transcoded Red files.  Here's the Truth:  The Canon 7D footage is deeper, richer and definitely more Film-like than the Red One (and I don't say this lightly: I'm one of those guys that shot in 65mm Super Panavision and did own the Red).  In the end, the Red One is too bulky, gets WAY TOO HOT and the RAW images are just way too...RAW (takes too long to grade a Red Image).  And with Magic Lantern RAW for the 7D, the Red is WAY TOO EXPENSIVE.  I can't believe how little tweaking the 7D RAW footage needed to look so....RICH!

Magic Lantern is really doing something truly special here.  My hat's off to all involved.  This really does change the game.  These great software guru's have proved to me that at this level Bit depth becomes truly more relevant than pixels.

Man, I wish I could write code!  I know the 7D is a struggle because of it's hardware architecture, but let's hope the ML folks stay at it!  It's definitely worth it!

BTW, I use the VAF filter on my 7D and there's ZERO ALIASING.  Get a VAF filter and forget about it.  You won't regret it.  It's a wondrous optical device.

Wow, it's so great to read this from someone with your background!! Can't imagine what you'll think about the 5D3 then, hehe.

I'm interested in knowing about the Cineform 444.. it must be the equivalent to ProRes 444 right?? I'd like to know how much disk space have you saved with the convertion and how much quality did you loose (if any).. does it convert the 14bit to 10bit or something???

Regarding the VAF filter.. I'm impressed.. all the tests I've seen are like the original footage (withour vaf) but ALL blurred out, I mean, the lines the sensor skipped are still not there.. they just blur everything.. there are NO vibrations of course but the details are lost anyway...

Again, would love to see some test footage of yours :)

Thank you very much! Have a good day!!!

chroma

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #239 on: August 20, 2013, 12:47:24 AM »
Man, I'd love to have a 5D3, but then my Tokina 11-16 2.8 would be useless...

I've been with CineForm from nearly the beginning (I had a JVC GYHD100 and the only way you could transcode the files to PC was with CineForm).  It's a great codec and a great product with patient, competent support folks.  The 444 CineForm avi is 12-bit, so there's only a little loss in going from a 14-bit original (a huge PLUS).  The 422 CineForm avi is 10-bit and in most instances it's indistinguishable from the original.  File sizes are very good and you can choose from 5 quality settings (Low, Medium, High, FilmScan 1 and FilmScan 2) I tend to use FilmScan 1, the perfect balance of pristine quality and manageable file size. (sorry, sounds like a sales pitch, trust me, I'm not on their payroll, just a very pleased customer!)

With the VAF, yes it's true you can't get something for nothing, if the lines are skipped, they're skipped,  but it really doesn't appear to have a "blurred" quality to me.  Overall, very little trade-off, way more up-side.  BTW, In Canon's native 1080p24 H.264 format, you can resolve about 760-800 lines of resolution.  In ML RAW with a smaller frame 1472x626 I'm getting at least that performance already....Interesting.

Shot some more today.  I just wish the Live View wouldn't freeze when you start recording, probably an easy bug to work out.  The image is just plain VIVID compared to the Red.  Red One images were very dull and lifeless out of the camera.  You really had to finesse the life back into a Red shot.  And let's be honest here, the Red has some serious aliasing issues of it's own.  A moving/panning chain-link fence shot in 4K, downsampled to 1080p with Redcine-X was NASTY looking, distracting and unnatural.

I'm not positive about this yet, but everything I've shot and seen in the 7D ML RAW format seems to have less rolling-shutter "tearing" than the H.264 7D footage.  More testing by myself and others needed though!  It could be that it's exactly the same, but the H.264 compression makes those rolling-shutter artifacts more pronounced.  Either way it's a potential plus.  Anyone noticed this on the 5D3 or other cameras using ML RAW?

Working on getting some of these tests up.  I just hate truncating them to H.264 for Vimeo or YouTube, doesn't really do a ML RAW shot justice.  I'd be happy to send interested ML'ers the CineForm files, but they're 1GB+ so that's not realistic.

Hitchck

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #240 on: August 20, 2013, 01:29:14 AM »
Maybe I'm just the last one to notice this, but it seems like false color overlays continue to work during raw recording. I've just been switching to the "small hd" mode, which allows me to track and focus reasonably well. Of course the downside is that you only get monochrome on screen, but that seems like a small price to me for raw video...

If this is common knowledge, then sorry for sounding redundant. I'm figuring there are at least a few people out there who aren't aware of this

kh3naz

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #241 on: August 20, 2013, 01:38:35 AM »
For those interested here are some comparison between h264 , 1728 x 576 , 2.5k and 2.5k graded

Right click and choose to view the images for full size

1080p H264


1728 x 576 RAW


2.5k RAW


2.5k RAW Graded

arrinkiiii

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #242 on: August 20, 2013, 01:57:09 AM »
@chroma

Its nice to ear about that. Maybe you can put some pic's for comparison. Red raw Vs 7D raw  :D

@Hitchck

What you trying to say is you can record raw in the 7D with your Small HD LCD and not have the freeze bug?

@kh3naz

Raw is just wonderful  ;D

@ML Team

Nice upgrade on the web site  ::)

stevelucky

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #243 on: August 20, 2013, 02:00:01 AM »
Maybe I'm just the last one to notice this, but it seems like false color overlays continue to work during raw recording. I've just been switching to the "small hd" mode, which allows me to track and focus reasonably well. Of course the downside is that you only get monochrome on screen, but that seems like a small price to me for raw video...

If this is common knowledge, then sorry for sounding redundant. I'm figuring there are at least a few people out there who aren't aware of this

That's actually a really great catch. I've never seen that before. It's a bummer to lose focus peaking, but at least I can see what I'm shooting. Thanks!

stevelucky

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #244 on: August 20, 2013, 02:04:23 AM »
@Hitchck

What you trying to say is you can record raw in the 7D with your Small HD LCD and not have the freeze bug?


No, he's saying that you can turn on the false color overlays and still see what you're shooting while shooting raw. It definitely works, though the false color overlays aren’t quite real-time.


arrinkiiii

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #245 on: August 20, 2013, 02:21:17 AM »
-Maybe im doing something wrong or understand wrong. I turn on the false color overlay and change to Samll HD but my Lv stay freeze wend i record raw video.


-It work now! I turn off and on the camera and worked.

Thank you  :D

crazyd

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #246 on: August 20, 2013, 03:56:45 AM »
we can turn off the zoom x10 funtion to avoid some freeze bug . The False color funtion still has some freeze bug ( we change setting number but nothing happen ) just press preview again. I think this is great idea for using LV on 7d in this time. Thanks you again for your discover.!

Sorry for my bad english.!

tickerguy

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #247 on: August 20, 2013, 05:36:28 AM »
AFAIK you can't set the camera's bootflag using a card with 64 GByte capacity.
I had the same benchmark problem with the non-bootable alpha 2 version.

My advice: Buy a cheap slower card (up to 32 GByte) and use this one for initialization and first tests.

Ciao
Walter

Yes you can.  It works on my 64GB card.

vnguyen972

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #248 on: August 20, 2013, 08:27:58 AM »
Maybe I'm just the last one to notice this, but it seems like false color overlays continue to work during raw recording. I've just been switching to the "small hd" mode, which allows me to track and focus reasonably well. Of course the downside is that you only get monochrome on screen, but that seems like a small price to me for raw video...

If this is common knowledge, then sorry for sounding redundant. I'm figuring there are at least a few people out there who aren't aware of this

Wow... nice find! I can see now!! lol

Thank you!
Love my EOS7D!

aaphotog

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Re: 7D Raw Thread
« Reply #249 on: August 20, 2013, 10:09:11 AM »
Just hit the zoom button that you would normally use for focusing. It'll bring you to a X5 zoom. It will then capture 2.5k raw images.
I have a 5d3 so I could be wrong. hitting the zoom button on my camera may SAY 5x, but in actuality is only recording a 3x crop. ALSO, when you do hit the zoom button, it will NOT record 2.5k. You actually have to go back into the raw recording menu and change the recording size from whatever resolution you have it set to to 2.5k. Hitting the zoom button, simply gives you the option to do it. It doesn't do it for you.