Author Topic: MLV App 1.14 - All in one MLV Video Post Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]  (Read 1097111 times)

zalbnrum

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Re: MLV App V1.0 - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2050 on: September 29, 2018, 09:52:43 PM »
Thank you for your answer.

In between tried it and got it. In "receipt mask setup" you check which settings are copied and which aren't from selected clip and not the other way around. Stupid me. Sorry for spam.

70MM13

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Re: MLV App V1.0 - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2051 on: September 30, 2018, 06:28:23 PM »
What an excellent idea!

This would be amazing for interesting effects!

If you already captured all this data, it's best to keep it, i.e. rather than exporting one frame out of 25, I believe it's better to average all of them in a way that minimizes temporal aliasing.

Somewhat like this: http://tessive.com/the-time-filter

I have yet to experiment with this, but any of these should give much better results than keeping just one frame out of 25:
- 180-degree averaging (i.e. average half of the frames in each group)
- use variable weights when averaging, such as a Gaussian bell curve

e.g.

- 180-degree averaging: weights = [  0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 ] / 13  # i.e. average 13 frames out of 25
- "Gaussian" weighting (just an example): [ 0.001 0.002 0.004 0.008 0.014 0.023 0.034 0.047 0.061 0.075 0.087 0.095 0.098 0.095 0.087 0.075 0.061 0.047 0.034 0.023 0.014 0.008 0.004 0.002 0.001 ]



To get the above "Gaussian" weights in octave:
Code: [Select]
w0 = [  0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 1 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 ] / 5;
w1 = conv(w0,w0)(25-12:25+12);
w2 = conv(w1,w1)(25-12:25+12);
w3 = conv(w2,w2)(25-12:25+12);
printf("%.3f ", w3);

Of course, the processing time will be much higher.

I hope to be able to perform this kind averaging on the camera's image processor at some point...

masc

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Re: MLV App V1.0 - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2052 on: October 01, 2018, 08:49:36 PM »
And finally here is v1.1: https://github.com/ilia3101/MLV-App/releases/tag/QTv1.1

New in v1.1:
- Fixed dual iso issue
- More speedup to dual iso
- Reworked audio loading
- Now creates MAPP v2 files (this speeds up second+ loading dramatically)
- Some scripting fixes from @Danne (OSX only)
- Copy mask
- Added PNG 16bit export
- Added jp2000 export in .mov container
- Improvements on IGV demosaic
- Linear gradient, with Exposure and Contrast sliders
- Simple 2D median denoiser
- Help dialog, as a first simple version of a user manual
- New vertical stretch factors 0.333 and 3.0
- Even more fixes...



Minimum OS (unchanged):
- OSX 10.8.5 Mountain Lion
- Windows 7
- Ubuntu 14.04 LTS
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ilia3101

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2053 on: October 01, 2018, 11:30:49 PM »
Wow

reddeercity

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2054 on: October 02, 2018, 05:38:39 AM »
Is there any support for External Grading monitor or output to a secondary calibrated monitor ?
Without it it's just a guessing game even with scopes , not knowing if the color or exposure is right , etc. ...
That's what keeps me from using this app plus a few other little annoying things
like can't resize the side panels no drop & drag on the main viewing window ,

Too much on the right side panel , Exposure & White balance should be with the "Raw Adjustment"
too many Debaying/postprocessing options there should not be in RAW adjustments
(maybe hidden dropdown menu, not all cam need this) , maybe in it's own separate window .
Plus I thing the color correction & raw adjustments panel should be on the bottom of the main viewing window
instead of the right side of the window this would give the most view area without loosen access to the grading tools .

It was bit confusing trying to quickly correct a file & export flat "CLog" like grade.
One more quick thought , maybe have different window configuration , e.g. color grading , postprocessing , raw adjustments
this would only bring up tools for certain operation and keep the workspace clean & uncluttered 
Just my own opinion , take it with a gain of salt .
Edit: on Windows 7pro , checked out the 64bit windows version

theBilalFakhouri

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Re: MLV App V1.0 - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2055 on: October 02, 2018, 09:12:57 AM »
I did a quick check and it seems doable, if we want it for export only. For playback the change would be huge. We only have to think about, how to bring it into export settings, that everyone is able to understand what it does. ;) Maybe: "Timelapse frame skip [xx frames]+-" or something (that makes me not really happy, better ideas?)...

Maybe a better idea to create a new tab (On/Off) like RAW Correction and name it "Time-Lapse"  under these settings or ideas:

"Leave 1 frame every xx frames" or "Skip xx frames every 1 frame" and under this setting make a time-lapse duration calculator to make the users know how many seconds will be the video in the end at current skipping frames setting.

"Averaging" (Check box). And other settings related to it .. as a1ex idea .

If the Time-Lapse was shot @ 23.976 FPS we can make a setting to leave first few seconds as normal video then speed it up like the Vlog. In general speed up Time-Lapse over time.

This what I am thinking right now if there are more settings to Time-Lapse to play with or it's good to be here.. Share your Ideas Human Beings  :D

Of course maybe this isn't that easy to do ,, but These are an Ideas to say or to talk about :D

bouncyball

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2056 on: October 02, 2018, 09:17:41 AM »
@reddeercity

Thanks for feedback

Is there any support for External Grading monitor or output to a secondary calibrated monitor ?
Nope, but it's nice feature to have.

Exposure & White balance should be with the "Raw Adjustment"
Can't agree. I think it is in right place.

too many Debaying/postprocessing options there should not be in RAW adjustments
Can you be more specific. which one?

1st versions of the raw correction section had the drop down list boxes not radio buttons. Ilia did that button stuff in cocoa version and it looked so nice that we desided to do the same in QT. Now I think earlier version was more compact and maybe more easily perceptible. But anyway @masc put so much effort into those radio buttons ;) (they are not natively supported in QT) That I could not say just: hello, let's go back to the original one :D

Plus I thing the color correction & raw adjustments panel should be on the bottom of the main viewing window
instead of the right side of the window this would give the most view area without loosen access to the grading tools .
This is the lightroom's style of right panel which is a bit overloaded but I used to it now. Besides you've got two simple hotkeys for panel hiding/showing. "S" for session panel and "E" for edit panel. And you can manipulate with them as quickly as it gets.

It was bit confusing trying to quickly correct a file & export flat "CLog" like grade.
You mean there are many options grayed out and can't be altered?

regards
bb

masc

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2057 on: October 02, 2018, 09:18:26 AM »
Thanks @reddeercity for your message!
Is there any support for External Grading monitor or output to a secondary calibrated monitor ?
Not yet, but I could imagine creating a second window which you can drag wherever you want - if that helps.
Without it it's just a guessing game even with scopes , not knowing if the color or exposure is right , etc. ...
For now, you only could drag the program itself on your calibrated monitor.
That's what keeps me from using this app plus a few other little annoying things
like can't resize the side panels no drop & drag on the main viewing window ,
Drag & Drop for importing files on main viewing area? That could also be added, that would not be to difficult.
Too much on the right side panel , Exposure & White balance should be with the "Raw Adjustment"
Disagree: Exposure and WB is done after debayering, so not on RAW data.
too many Debaying/postprocessing options there should not be in RAW adjustments
All what you find in RAW correction is done before debayering - so on RAW data. If you find it there, it isn't done in post.
(maybe hidden dropdown menu, not all cam need this) , maybe in it's own separate window .
Plus I thing the color correction & raw adjustments panel should be on the bottom of the main viewing window
instead of the right side of the window this would give the most view area without loosen access to the grading tools .
This is surely a question of taste. We decided to make it in a way like Adobe did with Lightroom - which I always loved when working on photos and where I always was very sad that there is no tool for video like that. In general our concept was and is: right: edit, bottom: audio, left: session. To get maximum viewing area just type A+S+E. Type it again and you're back ;)

It was bit confusing trying to quickly correct a file & export flat "CLog" like grade.
One more quick thought , maybe have different window configuration , e.g. color grading , postprocessing , raw adjustments
this would only bring up tools for certain operation and keep the workspace clean & uncluttered 
Hm - that would be another concept, where we discussed about nearly a year ago. These days we decided for colapseable groups. So you can always hide what you don't need and see what you need - with just a few simple clicks. Your idea is not bad, but a complete redesign of the main SW modules would be the result.
Just my own opinion , take it with a gain of salt .
Edit: on Windows 7pro , checked out the 64bit windows version
No problem - thank you! These messages are very important for us! ;)
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bouncyball

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2058 on: October 02, 2018, 09:26:51 AM »
@masc: Haha I always liked that our thoughts always matched before any words ;)

masc

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2059 on: October 02, 2018, 08:25:42 PM »
@masc: Haha I always liked that our thoughts always matched before any words ;)
LOL.

@reddeercity: dropping MLVs on viewer area was not straight forward but works now... :)
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Danne

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2060 on: October 02, 2018, 10:17:58 PM »
Drag and drop into main window. Very cool.
I also like the lightroom resemblance with the sliders. Easy to follow.

clanlee

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2061 on: October 03, 2018, 01:43:05 AM »
Thank you to the developers for all their great work on this application.

Would it be possible to see more than just one of Histogram, Waveform, Vector scope and Parade?  Would it be possible to adjust the size to make it larger?

Thank you.

reddeercity

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2062 on: October 03, 2018, 07:38:24 AM »
LOL.
@reddeercity: dropping MLVs on viewer area was not straight forward but works now... :)
Great ,
Thanks for the detail explanation , Will unfortunately I don't like the Light Room feel , I never used and never will .
If I need to do post work on a cr2 etc. ... I use UFRaw .
I come from a Video production & News broadcasting back ground , etc. ... I uses to programs like
Autodesk Smoke for Mac , Avid Media Composer , Blackmagic Resolve , FCP & FCPX , Apple Color , Apple Motion etc...
So I look for quick easy workflow (Smoke is still my favorite  , love working with DPX files  :-*)
To me it feels like a photo app doing video , I do understand that you like the interface as is and that fine
I was just trying to help improve this app , in my opinion this has great potential but it's in it infancy (no disrespect intended)
But before I go , I do hope you guys consider making resizable windows at the very least .
My 2cent

IDA_ML

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2063 on: October 03, 2018, 09:12:29 AM »
I have been playing around for several hours with version 1.1 and I love it!  Especially DualISO processing working fine now, is an enormous step forward keeping in mind the DualISO capabilities of our cameras in the high-resolution crop modes providing stunning quality aliasing free video with excellent fine detail and enormous dynamic range - really beatiful results that I have never seen from any other prosumer camera, even from the latest extremely expensive models from SONY shooting at 4K.  They are only comparable with those from professional cinema cameras like Arri Alexa. 

I have been using Lightroom a lot in the past, processing thousands of DNGs for hours and days to make a short film (just a few minutes long) but I had lots of problems with it.  The nastiest one was that it would randomly fail to record a processed DNG frame from the video sequence causing hick-ups in the video.  I had to find the skipped frame, fish its DNG out and process it separately with exactly the same settings, then put it back in place. It was a pain and that happenend on all the versions starting from 5.4 all the way up to 6.0 CC.  I was wasting so much time in this process that I finally gave up.  I would just make a copy of the frame next to the missing one and place it in the gap, renaming it accordingly.  This would not eliminate the hick-up but would make it less obvious.

Now, that I started using MLVApp on a regular basis, I thought - My God, what a relief!  I just let MLVApp run overnight and when I wake up in the morning, the room is pleasantly warm (yeah, it runs at 100% CPU power !!!) but I have all my files processed and converted to ProRes422, ready for mounting, cutting and finishing the movie. 

Fantastic work, guys!  Keep going!

whysodifficult

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2064 on: October 04, 2018, 10:10:39 PM »
Hello,

Please, can someone please tell me why MLV App changes the colors drastically when i open MLV in it? I twisted all knobs and couldn't match the original colors. I updated to version 1.1. The same.

The first screenshot is the real colors and that's how MlRAW Viewer 1.5. sees them (correctly) and the second one is MLVApp:






Thank you!

masc

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2065 on: October 04, 2018, 10:20:05 PM »
Hello,

Please, can someone please tell me why MLV App changes the colors drastically when i open MLV in it? I twisted all knobs and couldn't match the original colors. I updated to version 1.1. The same.

The first screenshot is the real colors and that's how MlRAW Viewer 1.5. sees them (correctly) and the second one is MLVApp:

Thank you!

Please define "real color" and "original color". How do you want to know what is "real"?! And without a sample MLV nobody will be able to help you (some frames are enough, you can shorten the clip). Each processing software will give you different colors.
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masc

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2066 on: October 04, 2018, 10:23:15 PM »
Would it be possible to see more than just one of Histogram, Waveform, Vector scope and Parade?  Would it be possible to adjust the size to make it larger?
Each scope needs some time to calculate. Showing 2 scopes, means double calculation time. Resizing the scopes is possible in principle - but also here, we did some tricks to accelerate the calculation. Making it larger will drop framerate dramatically again. In histogram each 2nd point is interpolated already now - so it won't get more precise.
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whysodifficult

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2067 on: October 04, 2018, 11:22:42 PM »
masc,
thank you for reply,
obviously real means how it looks in life.
This is how Colorcast-2, Footage see it and also a photo - all are about the same and about matching how i see the place in life with my own eyes: In Colorcast and Footage I changed exposure and a bit saturation to match colors to real ones. Maybe i should switch some parameter in MLVapp, but adjusting say saturation doesn;t help, leaving green color as was.









In fact, they are all different, yes, but not THAT much different as MLVapp, and in them i can adjust colors. How can i do it in MLVapp?

This is MLV, i don't know how to shorten MLV, so i picked the shortest one - 110 mb

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1wb1kdXkshjXmZvJn3zhIw7M7GPLtjMhP/view?usp=sharing

whysodifficult

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2068 on: October 04, 2018, 11:58:36 PM »
Just a thought, not for MLVapp, just general for MLVs, maybe someone sometime will do something similar:

You open MLV in app, choose the frame, click, it makes one DNG of this frame and automatically opens it in Lightroom, after making all adjustments the app somehow copies all them from Lightroom into itself and applies to all the video, then you can export to any format. Would be ideal for me...))

I came from photo and just can't handle or even understand editing in video apps, say, Resolve or Premiere, there's too small window of the video in them, and too complicated knobs, also slower than lightroom as i recall.

I can easily adjust what i need precisely in Lightroom on whole screen. Also presets. I tried to make LUTs of them, but they look much worse and imprecise in video apps than original presets in Lightroom.

But i can't process all videos through Lightroom, because it's difficult and slow to export MLV to DNGs, import them all in Lightroom, synching them, exporting, importing in App, exporting as video. Too much hassle. But all these apps that deal with MLVs unfortunately not so strong as Lightroom in adjustments.

Danne

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2069 on: October 05, 2018, 12:40:46 AM »
Speaking of color. Checking processing.c there is this for the 5D mark II:
Code: [Select]
/* Measurements taken from 5D Mark II RAW photos using EXIFtool, surely Canon can't be wrong about WB mutipliers? */
static const int wb_kelvin[]   = {  2000,  2500,  3000,  3506,  4000,  4503,  5011,  5517,  6018,  6509,  7040,  7528,  8056,  8534,  9032,  9531, 10000 };
static const double wb_red[]   = { 1.134, 1.349, 1.596, 1.731, 1.806, 1.954, 2.081, 2.197, 2.291, 2.365, 2.444, 2.485, 2.528, 2.566, 2.612, 2.660, 2.702 };
static const double wb_green[] = { 1.155, 1.137, 1.112, 1.056, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000 };
static const double wb_blue[]  = { 4.587, 3.985, 3.184, 2.524, 2.103, 1.903, 1.760, 1.641, 1.542, 1.476, 1.414, 1.390, 1.363, 1.333, 1.296, 1.263, 1.229 };

How are these figures calculated? There should be a set for all cams right?

bouncyball

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2070 on: October 05, 2018, 08:48:15 AM »
Please define "real color" and "original color". How do you want to know what is "real"?! And without a sample MLV nobody will be able to help you (some frames are enough, you can shorten the clip). Each processing software will give you different colors.
Unfortunatelly @whysodifficult is right. I'm having this issue very often with 5D3 clips. That's because of the pale reds and blues, sometimes even greens. The bad thing is that nothing helps: WB+tint, saturation, vibrance. Color just wrong and that's it.

Without calibration or color correction it's gonna stay the way it is.

I mean I can really get very good results out of mlvapp (in opposite to mlvp, sorry) but it never matches the real vivid reds or blues in the scene at least for 5D3. In the WhiteBalance branch of mlvapp the color matching is the best, but as we all know, this branch has other issues and also lags quite behind of master.

regards
bb

masc

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2071 on: October 05, 2018, 09:07:24 AM »
Speaking of color. Checking processing.c there is this for the 5D mark II:
Code: [Select]
/* Measurements taken from 5D Mark II RAW photos using EXIFtool, surely Canon can't be wrong about WB mutipliers? */
static const int wb_kelvin[]   = {  2000,  2500,  3000,  3506,  4000,  4503,  5011,  5517,  6018,  6509,  7040,  7528,  8056,  8534,  9032,  9531, 10000 };
static const double wb_red[]   = { 1.134, 1.349, 1.596, 1.731, 1.806, 1.954, 2.081, 2.197, 2.291, 2.365, 2.444, 2.485, 2.528, 2.566, 2.612, 2.660, 2.702 };
static const double wb_green[] = { 1.155, 1.137, 1.112, 1.056, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000, 1.000 };
static const double wb_blue[]  = { 4.587, 3.985, 3.184, 2.524, 2.103, 1.903, 1.760, 1.641, 1.542, 1.476, 1.414, 1.390, 1.363, 1.333, 1.296, 1.263, 1.229 };

How are these figures calculated? There should be a set for all cams right?
Ilia answered this question here:
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=20025.msg204676#msg204676
And as I understood: no, these numbers are for all cameras.

Just a thought, not for MLVapp, just general for MLVs, maybe someone sometime will do something similar:

You open MLV in app, choose the frame, click, it makes one DNG of this frame and automatically opens it in Lightroom, after making all adjustments the app somehow copies all them from Lightroom into itself and applies to all the video, then you can export to any format. Would be ideal for me...))
You could ask Adobe to do so. Their RAW engine is not open source and nobody knows what they are doing.

... in video apps, say, Resolve or Premiere, there's too small window of the video in them, and too complicated knobs,...
Thank you. This is exactly what I think.

I can easily adjust what i need precisely in Lightroom on whole screen. Also presets. I tried to make LUTs of them, but they look much worse and imprecise in video apps than original presets in Lightroom.
This is surely a color space problem. The colors could be interpreted differently.

obviously real means how it looks in life.
This is how Colorcast-2, Footage see it and also a photo - all are about the same and about matching how i see the place in life with my own eyes: In Colorcast and Footage I changed exposure and a bit saturation to match colors to real ones. Maybe i should switch some parameter in MLVapp, but adjusting say saturation doesn;t help, leaving green color as was.

In fact, they are all different, yes, but not THAT much different as MLVapp, and in them i can adjust colors. How can i do it in MLVapp?

This is MLV, i don't know how to shorten MLV, so i picked the shortest one - 110 mb
You can shorten a MLV by clicking on CutIn & CutOut in MLVApp and export it as MLV.

Colorcast and Footage brings the same color - yes. They both use Apple RAW engine. MLVApp is different, Resolve is different, Lightroom is different,  MLVProcuder is different,...
In MLVApp you can adjust the colors e.g. with a LUT (*.cube), if the sliders are not enough. Then it should bring more or less the same as other programs, because the algorithm behind the LUT is mostly identical.

It is not way off... a little different yes:

Edit: WOAH... again a colorspace problem: the pictures look completely different in my photoprogram as here in the browser. (especially the sky)
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bouncyball

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2072 on: October 05, 2018, 09:32:04 AM »
Here is my example, it is pure color space and calibration issue (look at the red color):

mlvapp <- wrong




darktable <- correct




Edit: second pic a bit oversaturated, but anyway color is different.

Boscom

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2073 on: October 05, 2018, 10:02:29 AM »
I'm using MLV App on 5D2 footage and it works great. Thanks for all the hard work you guys have put into it and continue to do so.

Is there anyway of improving the highlight recovery? There tends to halo's around certain highlights when the slider is reduced.. It looks to me as if the highlight range is a little broad ?

Lightroom's highlight recovery works better on the exported DNG's.
Sorry about the rubbish image, but it shows what the issue is. Left, no highlight adjustment, Right  -100%





masc

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Re: MLV App - All in one MLV Video Processing App [Windows, Mac and Linux]
« Reply #2074 on: October 05, 2018, 10:24:49 AM »
Is there anyway of improving the highlight recovery? There tends to halo's around certain highlights when the slider is reduced.. It looks to me as if the highlight range is a little broad ?

Lightroom's highlight recovery works better on the exported DNG's.
Sorry about the rubbish image, but it shows what the issue is. Left, no highlight adjustment, Right  -100%



Try it the other way: Exposure -1..-2 and Lighten up to 50 or something. Then drag Light Strength until the highlights are not clipped. With that I mostly get perfect results. (btw: highlight recovery is something different: recover clipped data in green channel)
Nobody knows what Adobe really does - it isn't open source and mostly there is no description about. We developped our own algoritms which more or less do something similar. Everybody is welcome to play around with the code and improve it.
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