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Hey, I'm using a 5DM2, so fat32 and files capped at 4GB with auto rollover. Funny thing, even using raw_rec the error occurs at the same frame (using in camera viewer) as mlv_rec and seems to be build dependent, like the Apr 27 build always errored at frame 848 and a different build always errors at frame 835 for both raw_rec and mlv_rec.

I'm not too worried that the in-camera viewer stops playing at the frame error, but wondering if the lost frames after mlv to dng conversion is going to be a problem?

@g3gg0
Yes, mlv_play. So far I've used 4 builds Feb16, Apr 24, Apr 27, Apr 29 and it happens with all of them. Also, if the .idx is present (in the same folder as the .mlv file) when using MLV Converter 1.9.2 for WINDOWS conversion stops where the error occurs, if the .idx file is not present, conversion completes, but some frames are not converted (missing), about 5 for a 60 sec video.

The error seems to consistently occur at around 45 secs (give or take) when processing 60 sec videos (I've just been using 1 min long videos for my tests, so I don't know if the error would repeat for longer videos). It's never occurred with any of my 30 sec video shots and always with my 60 sec long shots.

I don't know yet if the error is dependent upon the ML settings yet, but I'll keep playing and see what's what and report back any new findings.

I would like to help get MLV working well, so if there is anything specific you want me to try toward that end, just let me know :-)

Is there any way to log an error that flashes across the screen when I view an MLV recording for the the first time in-camera (when it's building the .idx file)? It says something about a corrupted header I believe. The error repeats even if I delete the .idx file and view the mlv again as it recreates the .idx file.

It happens on a few different builds, Feb 16 and Apr 29 for sure on 5DM2.

i don have any problem with PDR
all pink dots are remove very well. this is my first mlv raw video shot wit 650D. this video was made just to see how PDR n audio works..

Sorry @andy kh, my response was meant for @Aborgh, I'll update my previous post

EDITED: By the way, video looks great!

How do you guys solve the pink dots with the newer MLV format?
I can't get PinkDotRemover to work on my mac with the MLV format

If I were you I would really keep trying to figure out what's wrong with the PDR Tool not working. I know I had some trouble at first too. I mean even things like some of the app settings you can select were backwards or didn't do anything (like selecting EOS-M didn't work for EOS-M cameras, but the 650D setting did and some video resolutions didn't work as well as others because the focus points are hard coded). And even though some things in the app were a little quirky, development kind of petered off and new versions weren't released with the fixes, we just kind of picked up the work arounds in the threads.

Also, which version are you using? 0.8 was the latest last I checked, but it's tricky to find the download. To help narrow down what's what, I suggest you try shooting RAW (not mlv) at 720p and see how the tool works, that's the scenario which seemed to yield the best results for me. Taking this approach of process of elimination will help us help you. I know it can be aggravating and time consuming, but taking a step-by-step approach with these kinds of things works well, especially in an online help setting.

And take it from a guy that's been developing apps for over 25 yrs, please include ALL relevant info when asking for help, why? Two reasons...

1) We need that info to better help you and it won't take 6 posts to get it (things like Operating System, App Version, Camera Model, Installed ML Version and Settings, Video Details, just to name a few!).

2) Forum folks are tired of reading such posts without this info included and end up not even bothering to reply rather than go through this back and forth info gathering for the dozenth time.

I'm not trying to knock you, you're a filmmaker, not a software developer, I recognize that, just trying to advise you on how to get better help in resolving your dilemma

Yeah, I like to shoot 720p@24 fps raw and you can't with mlv on the 650D, ergo my less than complete answer to @Aborgh above... Although I can appreciate the mlv sound feature for at least syncing video with external recording and I guess using the in camera audio itself if recorded with external mic, as the internal audio with built-in mic is nothing to speak about other than for syncing to external recording, which is actually highly desired for some run-and-gun type filmmakers who don't always use a clapboard.

I recently upgraded to 5DM2 and so now using MLV

pink dot remover wont work with mlv. first you wil have to convert to raw. or you can use mlvmystic if u want to convert mlv to dng. make sure you check chroma smooth.

Thank you for posting additional correct info, I never tried it with MLV 

Right, just upload a sample DNG without any processing (without chroma smoothing).

FYI, I experienced the same thing using 2x2 (didn't try other settings), but the highlights were green. Unfortunately I've already deleted the video, as it was just a test. If it occurs again, I will upload a sample.

EDITED: OK, I deleted, but still in trash can, so here they are...

Control Image: http://filehosting.procypher.com/download.php?d=20140427&f=MLV_TEST_2_NS_A001_261640.dng
2x2 CS Image: http://filehosting.procypher.com/download.php?d=20140427&f=MLV_TEST_2_A001_261640_2x2.dng

How do you guys solve the pink dots with the newer MLV format?
I can't get PinkDotRemover to work on my mac with the MLV format

Hello, the Pink Dot Issue has nothing to do with the RAW video format (raw or mlv), it has to with the unique focusing system the 650D and a few other canon cameras use known as Hybrid Focusing (uses a combination of contrast and phase-difference, which makes it very fast and accurate, but introduces the pink dots to ML RAW video).

As far as pink dots being embedded in ML RAW video, this will probably never change, as I don't foresee ML devs trying to remove pink dots in-camera for raw video as that wouldn't be considered a unified solution, which is a primary aim for this dev community regarding the ML project (and rightly so IMO).

Don't know what you mean by "can't get it to work". As far as getting the PDR Tool to run, if it's a java based app (which I believe it is), make sure you have Java JRE or SDK installed.

If the app is running, but not actually removing the pink dots, make sure you are using the correct resolution video (I think it only works for 720p, but not 100% sure) and note whether your are shooting 1x or 3x crop mode, there are two separate tools, one for each format. Also there is a Chroma Smoothing app available in which the video resolution and crop mode would be irrelevant, but not sure it works as well as the PDR Tool.

I would strongly suggest reading the entire thread(s) for pink dot removal, as there are a few quirks with each of the apps and you will only discover them after reading the entire thread (however long it is :-)

EDITED: Also see @andy kh response below.

@tonybeccar

Nice job! Love the conversion app, works great 

Is there any way to save the Chroma Smoothing setting under DNG Options? I looked through the Config.ini file and didn't see the parameter for this feature. I would like to be able to save this setting to None, right now it defaults to 2x2 and I'm afraid in a rush one day I'll forget to update it to None.

I tried saving and loading the settings, but it seems like Chroma Smoothing isn't included in the ini file. I would be glad to manually add the parameter to the ini file myself, just would need to know the parameter name.

Thank you!

Thank you @reddeercity for your quick response and sharing your extensive knowledge of ML features with all of us!

Great video by the way, as always of course Looking forward to playing with the 5DM2 and your future post...

Hello, I recently picked up a 5DM2 (upgrade from 650D with ML) and have Feb 16 2014 build installed as per @reddeercity... my question is how to get 3x crop mode working. I saw this post http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5441.0 but it focuses on the 5DM3 and seems like a kind of convoluted procedure, has the process to engage 3x crop mode been streamlined or is it just different for the 5DM2 from what's posted for the 5DM3 or is it not available for the Feb 16 build or am I doing something wrong when I'm trying to follow the posted procedure?

Thank you!

Yeah, coming out with the 700D so soon after the 650D really perplexed a lot of people. If you do a side-by-side comparison of the two there's little difference or improvement with the 700D.

Here's a breakdown where the reviewer calls it a tie between the two: http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon-EOS-650D-vs-Canon-EOS-700D

What's your opinion on why they came out with the 700D so quickly?

Yes, Canon does not natively shoot raw, but this is a ML forum and raw is what we are talking about, else we would be discussing this in a Canon forum.

So far for me raw has worked out well on the 650D, but other 650D users have had some hiccups. But as far as the 5D goes, professionals are relying heavily on their ML raw features on a daily basis and feature length films have been made using solely a 5D with ML RAW, so I can't agree with you that it's far from being guaranteed. ML RAW works, especially on the 5DM3.

Now Black Magic has it's own issues as far as RAW goes, and if you compare any BM and even most RED cameras to a 5DM3 using raw, the 5D delivers better images. I'm not going to go into detail of those comparison here for two reasons, one, this is a 650D thread, and two, you can find such comparisons elsewhere on the web.

I certainly agree with you that 4K is where the industry is heading, but right now the only viable viewing medium is a movie theater as there really are no mass produced 4K televisions available to speak of, and so if the theater is what you're aiming for, there are simply too many disadvantages of a 4K compressed image from a crop sensor to make sense right now for such a medium.

Let me say I've enjoyed our discussion on this matter and will be glad to read your response, but I won't reply any further to this specific topic any more, NOT anything to do with you, just thinking the moderators may not appreciate this lengthy of an off thread-topic discussion ;-)

I guess it's what you plan on using it for... Home videos, school plays, weddings, ok h.264 is fine. But for filmmaking, doesn't cut the mustard IMO. I've seen and have done my own native h.264 vs ML RAW and there really isn't a comparison, raw is tremendously better. I've even compared h.264 1080p vs raw 720p upressed to 1080p and the raw was just blew away the native h.264.

See comparison here: https://vimeo.com/85974454

The drawbacks of h.264 for fillmaking are just too overwhelming to consider it a high value option, variable bit rate compression, low dynamic range, embedded picture style, etc.

As far as the GH4 which has a four thirds sensor vs full frame in the 5D, you will get images that have a shallower depth of field, greater dynamic range, and better low-light sensitivity with the larger sensor of the 5D, this is simply due to the laws of physics as it pertains to light waves, not the camera so much... What the camera does with those light waves is another story which is why raw is so desirable, because with raw the camera does just about nothing to them, of course sensor quality being another factor in the equation. So taking all this into consideration, for filmmaking anyway, I don't see h.264 video and the smaller sensor on the GH4 as being worthwhile option even with 4K.

Of course this assessment is simply from a technical point of view, not quality of content.

Yeah, my friend is getting the GH4, but 4k what? H.264? I'll pass...

 

So many emotions...

That's the trade-off for that 40mbs SD card controller.

Fortunately there's all kinds of software available for removing the pink dots from the 650D.

It's always better to save up a little bit more and get a 7D or a 5Dmkii though. You're talking about 200-300 bucks but a UNIVERSE of difference.

And the last software versions I used for removing the pink dots worked pretty good, except one worked better for normal mode and another worked better for digital 3x crop mode. Maybe there are newer versions, but it looked like the development on those apps was petering out the last I looked a while back.

You can get 5DM2 for a decent price used on ebay or wherever, but personally I'm looking to get the 5DM3 except they're still a little pricey. I'm thinking they'll come down in price (at least a little I hope) once the 5DM4 comes out, but if you consider Canon's release cycle for the 5D it probably won't be until next year at the soonest.

i am so disappointed using magic lantern after buying 650D.now i cant control audio and unlike other camera it gets pink dots while shooting raw which takes double time in workflow.

Yeah, the pink dots are due to the 650D's hybrid focusing system (phase and contrast detection is utilized), which offers faster and more precise auto-focusing, but affects the ML RAW output as such.

Writing a file with 128 Kbyte on a medium with 512 byte block size: 256 write operations have to be handled.
Writing a file with 128 Kbyte on a medium with 128 Kbyte block size: 1 (one) write operation.

Less overhead.

If the card is used to store small data files there will be unused disk space allocated by each file.
Writing a XML with 1 Kbyte -> 128 Kbyte allocated.
127 Kbyte unusable for other files.

Not an issue when used within a cam IMO.

Ciao
Walter

Exactly... Why I recommend 128KB moreso with using RAW is that each RAW 720p frame is almost 1 MB in size, so you only write 8 blocks of data per frame. If you were to format 4096 Byte block size (the default and most commonly used) then you would need to write roughly 250 blocks of data per frame with each block consisting of its own header and other components along with the data. Using a larger block size allows you to eke out every last bit of performance in order to help get 720p RAW continuous and when formatted exFAT which allows over 4 GB file size you can literally fill the card with one continuous shot however large the card. Now managing a huge file in post, well that's something you need to consider depending upon the post processing resources available to you :-)

Do i just format my card as exFAT and then the proceed as usual, or is there an extra step?
thanks guys.

Also, would any one be kind enough to share their workflow?

Yeah, I just use a windows machine and format the card exFAT with 128 KB block size (only use this large block size with cards you will use raw video or else you will waste a lot if space).

See my ML RAW work flow videos here: https://vimeo.com/jamesdesira/

Is any one getting 1280x720 continuous mlv? I'm only getting exactly 1:50 seconds of footage with a san disk extreme 80mb/s uhs-1 class 10 32gb card. Is there any way to get 720p continuous mlv? Would a 90mb/s card help or am i already over killing it because of the controller speed limit?
Thanks guys.

So far as I have seen, no one is getting continuous raw using MLV for more than 2 mins or so at 720p. The non-audio version of raw (the original ML RAW) can deliver continuous raw ad infinitum using fast SD cards (95 MBps) formatted exFAT. The max in-camera SD write speed has been determined to be about 41 MBps for this camera, so that's the limit and usually requires a fast SD card (rated 95 MBps) to meet such write speeds as the card's rating usually denotes the read speed with about 45-60 MBps actual write speeds.

I have to say not really, I did adjust the white balance a little bit in post due to the overcast day, but I'm guessing because the scene didn't really have any warm colors to begin with it didn't have a warm tone to it. I don't know what your post processing work flow consist of, but shooting raw will almost always require color correction unless you are gong for some kind of artistic look to your video.

If you look at my Snow Fall video comparing raw to h.264 you can notice that the raw has a greenish tone to it, which could have been accounted for in post, but that wasn't the point of the video, so I just applied a very light amount of color correction to both videos for additional comparison reasons.

But you can readily see the difference in color tones between raw with no in-camera color processing and the h.264 which although I shot it flat (cinema picture style), still had some in-camera color processing done to it like white balance and picture style being applied to it.

my raw video despite whatever white balance setting i use, turns out very warm. I only converted to .dng files for now, but i wanted to know if there is a way to fix that since I guess it could be fixed in adobe after effects but is this normal?

Hello, when using any ML RAW format (probably all raw formats) no white balance is applied nor picture style. I'm not a raw expert, but basically raw is a dump of the sensor information without any processing (or very little anyway) by the camera, so everything you want to do to the video style needs to be done in post. But, many videographers will take a reference pic/image of something pure white in the environment they are shooting video to help set up the correct white balance in post considering every light source emits a different color temperature (even sunny days compared to cloudy days), especially fluorescent lights.

You can certainly browse this forum or google for more info regarding raw video color correction and the color temperature of light.

Yeah, I was going to mention that also, but I wasn't sure if you were using MLV because you didn't mention anything about audio. I had the same experience, RAW works continuously but MLV doesn't for 720p@24fps.