Canon 5d MKII RAW Quality

[joshtay11]

To be honest, I'm a little dissatisfied with the quality I'm getting out of ML's RAW for the 5d MKII.  My footage doesn't seem to come out as clean as others' MKII RAW footage has come out.  Is anyone else having any problems?

Here are some samples, maybe someone can help me figure out what I'm doing wrong!!

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Actual video clips:

Thanks!
Josh

[Kharak]

What are your RAW settings?

Are you recording RAW or MLV?

What raw2dng or other converter are you using and what version?

EDIT: Got super slow connection, so took me awhile to see your video.

It doesn't look bad to me.

The aliasing in the roof and other straight lines is a well known issue with the 5D II because of it none existing VAF filter.

What lens were you using. Didn't happened to be a 16-35 ?

[reddeercity]

I have no problems as long as i don't under or over  exposes.
What picture profile are you monitoring though Live view ? 
Whats your workflow ?
I see your file on vimeo is 1880x800, did you use Resolve ?
over all its not bad, but to help out we need some info
on your setting, like shutter speed, ISO, lens etc...
It dose look overexposed in spots, if your on Adobe workflow
did you adjust the image with the ACR plugin ?

[coolerinc]

I've got these artifacts too and 30% of shots are bad IMHO.

[joshtay11]

Kharak:  I left my RAW settings at default when I loaded the module.  The only thing I changed was resolution to 1880 x 800 at 2.35:1.  The files come out as .raw so I don't think I'm recording in .mlv.  I'm not sure I know how to, haha.  I'm using raw2dng for conversion.  I was using the Rokinon 24mm t1.5.

reddeercity:  I was using the Neutral pp.  After clearing my user settings, I haven't gotten around to reloading the technicolor picture styles.  My workflow is CF card - .raw file to desktop/ext hard drive - .raw file to raw2dng - .dng files to Lightroom/ACR (tried both) - export .jpg highest quality to new folder - create image sequence in quicktime 7 - export as prores (HQ) - Import to Premiere cs6 - export as Prores (HQ).  Didn't use Resolve.   Settings were 320iso 1/50 24fps for inside shot  &  160iso 1/50 24fps for outside shots.

Thanks for y'all's help!
Josh

[reddeercity]

I see there is a few problems here.
First, you have to many step to before you edit.
Really you should not save your raw as Jpeg !
You are going From 14bit raw to 8bit jpeg then 10bit 422 HQ mov.
By doing this workflow you will introduce Artifact, Banding, etc.....
I don't have Lightroom, i use Adobe After Effects CC or Photoshop CC
If you are using Lightroom i would Export as a 16bit Tiff.
Import in to Premiere Pro as a tiff image sequences, or if you like
to use video files, import your sequences in to adobe media encoder and
export to ProRes 4444. it make no sense to use a 422 codec when they both have the same bandwidth.
quick times 7 has problems with gamma shift etc.. try no to use that .

When you are using ISO's with numbers like 160, 320, make sure there are the Magic Lantern digital ISO's
or use the native analog ISO's eg. 100, 200, 300, all the way up to 1600 .
the non magic lantern digital ISO's(160,320 etc.)  which are not very clean.
So it would be better to use ND filter at 200 ISO then to use 160 ISO that has digital gain.
Remember you have at least 11 to 12 Stops of Dynamic Range to play with in post.

I hope i didn't make things more confusing, you are on the right track just need to
work with raw more   

[joshtay11]

reddeercity:  Awesome! Thanks for the feedback.  It does make sense, I was just shooting at isos at multiples of 160 because I know that's when Canon's non raw footage is best.  I will try all this and report back!

Thanks again
Josh

[joshtay11]

reddeercity:  It also seems that the dng files that I import into Adobe Camera Raw are 8-bit.  At least that's what it says in the info for each clip underneath the image...  Is that a problem?

Josh

[reddeercity]

reddeercity:  It also seems that the dng files that I import into Adobe Camera Raw are 8-bit.  At least that's what it says in the info for each clip underneath the image...  Is that a problem?

Josh

Just click on that tab and should open up a box with more options and choose 16bit.

[joshtay11]

reddeercity:  Awesome, just tried this.  For some reason or another, Premiere Pro and Media Encoder say they don't support 16bit TIFF, but I successfully loaded the 16bit TIFFS in After Effects.  Does that get the job done just as well?

Thanks for all your help and input

[reddeercity]

reddeercity:  Awesome, just tried this.  For some reason or another, Premiere Pro and Media Encoder say they don't support 16bit TIFF, but I successfully loaded the 16bit TIFFS in After Effects.  Does that get the job done just as well?

Thanks for all your help and input

If you have AE just convert the raw file
With raw2cdng & import them directly
And make your adjustments to the
Native DNG then,save your project
As a "CS6" then you can import
The CS6 AE project in a new premiere pro
Project .
I made video about that a few days ago
And posted , just do a search here or on
YouTube for "RedDeerCityTV"

[dude]

Premiere CS6 does not import 14 bit Files.
So going from AE (i never tried to save as a pp project, just saved the comp in ae and opened ae sequence in premiere.
There you are, 14 bit, and the possibility to change the values in acr.

[1%]

Yea, after trying that is my new workflow. AE project inside premiere... nested. After rendering the preview it edits pretty well and you can always go back into AE and change things. CC breaks this?

[reddeercity]

Yea, after trying that is my new workflow. AE project inside premiere... nested. After rendering the preview it edits pretty well and you can always go back into AE and change things. CC breaks this?

all my adobe produce are CC i have not problem

[mva]

Yea, after trying that is my new workflow. AE project inside premiere... nested. After rendering the preview it edits pretty well and you can always go back into AE and change things. CC breaks this?

Where do you do correction, grading, sharpening, noise reduction, etc. in this workflow? Anything outside of ACR?

[bnvm]

I would do all grading in AE and noise correction in ACR and AE if needed. Also I tried this dynamic link technique and it does work well and is easy to use but there is a penalty in premiere reading AE comps compared to using an intermediate file.

[mrnv45]

on my mac forsome reason i cant open anykind of media in Resolve.. anytime a folder with loose or multiple media is present it shows 2 and freezes and closes.. everytime. Desktop/hardrive it dont matter

here is a video i did with the similar workflow of the lightroom-quicktime stated above.  but i rendered all mind in prores444 videos and edited in FCPx

now my MASTER files look AMAZING.. the export does not have that Punch or Clean look the masters do.

[1%]

Where do you do correction, grading, sharpening, noise reduction

Everything in AE, prefer to actually not have shifts from ACR and can change it at any time, But now without the step of rendering a real version before editing is saved unlike AE -> vegas

[dude]

You really have to watch out, using this workflow, because if you want to do cc in premiere, there are some effects (like levels ) which do not support 16 bit.
is there a reason why you do cc in ae?
for me, i am pretty excited about magic bullet in premiere. full 32 bit compatible, masks and everything.

[dariSSight]

You really have to watch out, using this workflow, because if you want to do cc in premiere, there are some effects (like levels ) which do not support 16 bit.
is there a reason why you do cc in ae?
for me, i am pretty excited about magic bullet in premiere. full 32 bit compatible, masks and everything.

What's the best workflow your using?

[dude]

Pretty much the same- ACR import, put same locations (like inside a house, outside in the garden, whatever) in one comp, safe project. for each comp i create a h264 proxy.
open premiere, go to import via dynamik link, select the kompositions from the ae project i want (funny sidenote- you can choose comps from different ae projects if you want).
so now i have the h264 proxys in premiere. cut them and do what i want. then toggle the proxys off in ae, so i have the full resolution in premiere for doing colour correction via magic bullet, which i reeeeally love. render out, done. you can always go back to acr for several corrections.so if you already know which look you re going for, there is no need for luts or something like that. AND- with acr you only will see the first frame, so using this method you can always go back to acr if your cc does not match like the end of the clip.
one thing i did not try out (but have to tomorrow...) is how the footage holds up against warp stabilizer in premiere. i did it on the proxys, not sure if they will be the same when turning the proxys off...
 (and- you re not able to do time remapping AND stabilizer together, so maybe stabilizing in ae, and doing time remapping in premiere will work... i don t know.
but that s very special.)

one more trick- when you open footage from the same location/day/ same light situation and stuff in acr, you usually will  save a colour preset so you can apply it to the next clip. but if you did your acr corrections, just hit the button "save acr preset", so the next file you will open has exact the same settings.

[1%]

is there a reason why you do cc in ae?

You can do everything else too, ie pull chroma key ,etc. AE is pretty much like premiere anyway. Premiere makes some MPEG2 proxies tho by itself. MB also works inside AE, I never got the color warning for it... does premiere even have it?

there are some effects (like levels ) which do not support 16 bit.

[dude]

yes, like ae, you get a little yellow warn signal next to the effect when applied.
in some cases, like vignette, it does not matter. but when you try to add levels, it really fucks up your footage

ok, keying i a good reason, but you also can do it with mb colorista II.
but you also can key in the ae comps , or do split screen or whatever, and it shows up in premiere.

[joshtay11]

Wow, lots of good information.  Thanks so much! 

[johnny5d]

When I go and open my tiff files in AE and make a movie in Avidnxhd 1920x1080 the movie image is stretched. The original record footage was 1880x800 and in the rendering preview window the video looks good and not stretched...

Can some one help me out ?