Author Topic: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release  (Read 17579 times)

deletedAcc.0021

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Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« on: August 23, 2013, 11:27:26 PM »
I know there are quite a few users using the nightlies successfully, just wondering how close the dev's think we are to a feature freeze and releasing the next beta / stable.

1%

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2013, 12:36:32 AM »
Its a ways off still I think with the new ML raw format coming.I'm also liking rolling release better.

xNiNELiVES

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2013, 09:33:44 AM »
Its a ways off still I think with the new ML raw format coming.I'm also liking rolling release better.


Rolling release?

nanomad

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2013, 10:51:00 AM »
I know there are quite a few users using the nightlies successfully, just wondering how close the dev's think we are to a feature freeze and releasing the next beta / stable.

We can either keep developing or do a "feature freeze" and and work on the bugs only. Most of the ML devs would probably prefer to keep developing altough I think that having a "stabler" ML version is not a bad thing per-se (think of professionals doing paid gigs).

So, here's a proposal for you. Once the scripting engine gets fixed open a new thread. Pick one nighlty build. Test the hell out of it on many bodies and report bugs. This build (with the fixes) will eventually became the new 2.4. We can tag the bugs you open as 2.4-blocking so we know what's left to do.
EOS 1100D | EOS 650 (No, I didn't forget the D) | Ye Olde Canon EF Lenses ('87): 50 f/1.8 - 28 f/2.8 - 70-210 f/4 | EF-S 18-55 f/3.5-5.6 | Metz 36 AF-5

tron

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2013, 12:51:23 PM »
The new DUAL_ISO and I guess raw video are such important features that they should be a part of it. So it will have to be the very latest of everything. In addition 5D3 is running 1.2.1 firmware for many months now. But I feel all these features together require a lot of time to finalize...

Michael Zöller

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2013, 01:39:07 PM »
Well...we cannot have the *very latest* stuff and stability at the same time, can we?
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deletedAcc.0021

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2013, 01:55:11 PM »
Nanomad's got something there.  I think there are a lot of people who would love to use the newer features, but continue to use 2.3 because its "stable" and are a bit nervous about trying "untested" releases.  Although, looking at the number of downloads, I would say some of the nightlies and Tragic Lantern are becoming well tested.

I myself have been using nightlies and / or 1%'s releases commercially since the beginning of the year and found them very stable and have had no ill effects while on a shoot.

Like Nanomad said, choose a nightly and list it as 2.4 beta, and maybe some of the reluctant 2.3 users can benefit from some of the newer features.


Stedda

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2013, 02:11:50 PM »
I'd much rather have new features as they come out. Ive yet to have a single issue doing this.

Call it what you want, it doesnt really matter.
5D Mark III -- 7D   SOLD -- EOS M 22mm 18-55mm STM -- Fuji X-T1 18-55 F2.8-F4 & 35 F1.4
Canon Glass   100L F2.8 IS -- 70-200L F4 -- 135L F2 -- 85 F1.8 -- 17-40L --  40 F2.8 -- 35 F2 IS  Sigma Glass  120-300 F2.8 OS -- 50 F1.4 -- 85 F1.4  Tamron Glass   24-70 2.8 VC   600EX-RT X3

deletedAcc.0021

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2013, 02:47:21 PM »
I'd much rather have new features as they come out. Ive yet to have a single issue doing this.

Call it what you want, it doesnt really matter.

And your one of those (like myself), that can continue to use the nightly releases, and the reluctant 2.3 users can benefit from some of the newer features by upgrading to a 2.4 beta if you will.

1%

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2013, 04:50:44 PM »
I think we should fix the bugs before talking about stable. It kinda stables out on its own when  new features die down.

tron

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2013, 10:49:44 PM »
Nanomad's got something there.  I think there are a lot of people who would love to use the newer features, but continue to use 2.3 because its "stable" and are a bit nervous about trying "untested" releases.  Although, looking at the number of downloads, I would say some of the nightlies and Tragic Lantern are becoming well tested.

I myself have been using nightlies and / or 1%'s releases commercially since the beginning of the year and found them very stable and have had no ill effects while on a shoot.

Like Nanomad said, choose a nightly and list it as 2.4 beta, and maybe some of the reluctant 2.3 users can benefit from some of the newer features.
What do you mean choose a nightly? Any nightly? isn't the latest or at least one close to the latest the one with the most bugs fixed?

deletedAcc.0021

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2013, 11:00:14 PM »
What do you mean choose a nightly? Any nightly? isn't the latest or at least one close to the latest the one with the most bugs fixed?

No, just because its a newer release doesn't mean it doesn't have bugs.  Newer releases may contain new features that are untested and buggy.

tron

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2013, 11:07:18 PM »
No, just because its a newer release doesn't mean it doesn't have bugs.  Newer releases may contain new features that are untested and buggy.
So you know which nightly relase out of 300 has the least number of problems? interesting  ::)

ted ramasola

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2013, 11:25:09 PM »
So you know which nightly relase out of 300 has the least number of problems? interesting  ::)

when you have followed the nightlies, you know which works best for you and which bug you can live with. The way I understand open source is, -it's never finished.

If there is a bug that's affecting my own needs I report it and help in isolating it so a dev who probably does not have my own particular camera model can try and sort it out.

When that particular bug is sorted out then I hereby annoint THAT as MY stable release.   :) It might not be the stable release for others but for me that currently is.
Until the next feature discovery is stable I STAY with MY STABLE release.

Case in point is Dual ISO and Crop modes recording.  :)

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tron

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2013, 11:29:25 PM »
May be the bug you can live with is not the same bug I can live with and ... vice versa. +1 to the fact that you mention: "MY release" This is 100% understandable. But should a  single forum member make the choice for ALL of us?

deletedAcc.0021

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #15 on: August 24, 2013, 11:36:33 PM »
So you know which nightly relase out of 300 has the least number of problems? interesting  ::)

Actually I do,  I've been testing nightlies since December of last year and compiled my own code from them.  I know which versions of the nightlies and of Tragic Lantern that work best for me with the features that I use.

Obviously as 1% said, there is not a new stable release in the near future.  Just too many new features in the works. And the 2.3 users who are skeptical about trying "bleeding edge" code will just have to wait.  I just thought it would be nice to designate a proven nightly as a safe alternative for those waiting for a next stable release.

ted ramasola

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #16 on: August 24, 2013, 11:37:08 PM »
May be the bug you can live with is not the same bug I can live with and ... vice versa. +1 to the fact that you mention: "MY release" This is 100% understandable. But should a  single forum member make the choice for ALL of us?

If that forum member happens to be the only developer willing to share his compile version to the the community then do you have a choice but to take whats offered? Unfortunately this is a developers forum that offer to share their code for free on their own unpaid time.

This is not like some "societies" where most citizens just lay back and have a sense of entitlement and demand every convenience from their government.

You contribute your knowledge, you contribute your time by taking part in testing if you don't do code, you give feed back, you wait for results.
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deletedAcc.0021

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #17 on: August 24, 2013, 11:38:08 PM »
May be the bug you can live with is not the same bug I can live with and ... vice versa. +1 to the fact that you mention: "MY release" This is 100% understandable. But should a  single forum member make the choice for ALL of us?

There are bugs in 2.3.

And no single member was making the choice .... the thread was directed to developers (read the title)

tron

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #18 on: August 24, 2013, 11:40:25 PM »
There are bugs in 2.3.

And no single member was making the choice .... the thread was directed to developers (read the title)
Read nanomad's reply to you: "So, here's a proposal for you. Once the scripting engine gets fixed open a new thread. Pick one nighlty build."

deletedAcc.0021

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #19 on: August 24, 2013, 11:46:21 PM »
Read nanomad's reply to you: "So, here's a proposal for you. Once the scripting engine gets fixed open a new thread. Pick one nighlty build."

I think nanomad was referring to a community picked nightly.

I can't pick a nightly for cameras I don't use.  I know what I would recommend for the 600D.  Once again, this was directed to the dev's, so their recommendation is what counts not mine.

tron

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #20 on: August 24, 2013, 11:50:23 PM »
I think nanomad was referring to a community picked nightly.

I can't pick a nightly for cameras I don't use.  I know what I would recommend for the 600D.  Once again, this was directed to the dev's, so their recommendation is what counts not mine.
I agree with you on this 100%. Your request is reasonable. However, the thread was turning to a dangerous point if someone who was not a developer were to chose a specific built. I would also prefer the developers to make a choice. We - simple members - can help as much as possible by testing and ... testing.

Audionut

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #21 on: August 25, 2013, 05:09:48 AM »
when you have followed the nightlies, you know which works best for you and which bug you can live with. The way I understand open source is, -it's never finished.

If there is a bug that's affecting my own needs I report it and help in isolating it so a dev who probably does not have my own particular camera model can try and sort it out.

When that particular bug is sorted out then I hereby annoint THAT as MY stable release.   :) It might not be the stable release for others but for me that currently is.
Until the next feature discovery is stable I STAY with MY STABLE release.

This is sound advice.  You find a build where your day to day use has no bugs.  Where you find a bug, you report it and help the developers bugfix it.  This new bug fixed build then becomes your next stable release.

What I think nanomad was suggesting.  We (us users) decide on a nightly build that will become the new stable build.   We bugfind this nightly build.
New features will continue to be released (we let the developers do what they do best), but any bugs reported from the nightly build that we choose as the stable release, will be backported to that release.

So eventually when all the bugs are found, we have a stable release.  For those not interested in a stable release, development has continued on new features.

The only other way is to completely stop development.  Lock down code changes to bugfixes only.

edit:  My suggestion is to either pick a build back before raw features, or wait until the new file format has been implemented into the main source tree.

deletedAcc.0021

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #22 on: August 25, 2013, 03:59:27 PM »
This is sound advice.  You find a build where your day to day use has no bugs.  Where you find a bug, you report it and help the developers bugfix it.  This new bug fixed build then becomes your next stable release.

This is what I have done.  I have a nightly release that I compiled back in early June (without raw), that I use daily on commercial shoots. And I have a Tragic Lantern version (with raw) for personal use.  I have yet to find any bugs with the feature set that I use in either release.

I've recommended the same nightly to several 600D users that wanted to upgrade from 2.3 and (knock on wood) they haven't had any issues either.  I call it a "stable nightly".

Edit:  with exception of the occasional pink frame shooting raw, but I don't consider that a bug .. more of a camera limitation.

tron

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #23 on: August 25, 2013, 04:37:43 PM »
This is what I have done.  I have a nightly release that I compiled back in early June (without raw), that I use daily on commercial shoots. And I have a Tragic Lantern version (with raw) for personal use.  I have yet to find any bugs with the feature set that I use in either release.

I've recommended the same nightly to several 600D users that wanted to upgrade from 2.3 and (knock on wood) they haven't had any issues either.  I call it a "stable nightly".

Edit:  with exception of the occasional pink frame shooting raw, but I don't consider that a bug .. more of a camera limitation.
I have tried Nightly Aug 21st on my 5D2. I haven't noticed any problem. I have also tried successfully the latest 31302bbc6461.zip for 5D2. The only issue I have noticed applies to ALL nightly builds and I have reported it in another thread. Fortunately nanomad is informed now. See

http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=3072.msg69358#msg69358

(plus, minus a few posts)

1%

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Re: Next stable 2.4 -dev's release
« Reply #24 on: August 25, 2013, 05:50:03 PM »
Quote
There are bugs in 2.3.

That's exactly my point. People act like there is some sort of magical stable release anointed with holy bug free oil and keep asking when is the "stable" or "official" coming out rather than trying things and identifying bugs, especially ones that affect a legitimate workflow.

I'm hoping people doing commercial work are using their cameras every day? So any real bugs come up real quickly and you can go back to the last build you used and say X is now broken, every time I hit disp button the camera starts singing sinatra, etc.