Author Topic: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2  (Read 14408 times)

JasonATL

  • Freshman
  • **
  • Posts: 54
Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« on: November 05, 2012, 01:14:02 PM »
This is a 70 second video comparing the results of using the 5D Mark III's internal codec (ALL-I) with the video from an external recorder via ML's clean HDMI out. The external recorder is the HyperDeck Shuttle and ML is a1ex's Alpha 2 version for the 5D Mark III

As is discussed in the notes on the Vimeo, the current challenges in getting good results this configuration are: 1) the video via HDMI out is 1620x1080, requiring a zoom to get the same 16x9 image as what the 5D records; 2) The HDMI output is at 1080i, requiring deinterlacing; and 3) the output of the HDMI is 8-bit and might be 4:2:2, but could be 4:2:0.


3pointedit

  • Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 263
  • 550D
Re: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2012, 01:52:56 PM »
OMG you can barely tell! That is stunning, no wonder the camera makes such soft images. Would be interesting to see some motion tests, to compare deinterlacing effects.

Looks like great news for long form recording though. Thanks for taking the time.
550D on ML-roids

JasonATL

  • Freshman
  • **
  • Posts: 54
Re: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2012, 02:54:45 PM »
OMG you can barely tell! That is stunning, no wonder the camera makes such soft images. Would be interesting to see some motion tests, to compare deinterlacing effects.

Looks like great news for long form recording though. Thanks for taking the time.

You're welcome. The reason that I shot the trees was to get fine detail and independent motion of the detail. In my experience, the combination of these two is what taxes the codec and results in a lot of compression artifacts at lower bitrates. Using higher bitrates cleans images such as this up quite nicely. Unfortunately, the zoom and interlacing challenges currently make this difficult to see. I agree, though. More tests should be interesting.

Lcrusher

  • New to the forum
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Re: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2012, 08:32:52 PM »
Thanks for the video.

Could you record from the HDMI out while zoomed in?

JasonATL

  • Freshman
  • **
  • Posts: 54
Re: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2012, 09:15:49 PM »
Thanks for the video.

Could you record from the HDMI out while zoomed in?

Yes. But, it doesn't look great so far. I'm going to try to get a full "resolution chart test of HDMI out" video up in the next week or so. I've done some playing around to try to see what settings and tests make sense. It sounds like you'd like to see one with zoomed in (I assume using the magnifying glass to go to x5 and x10?).

Lcrusher

  • New to the forum
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Re: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2012, 02:51:47 PM »
Yep. 5x and 10x.

Don't think there's a point in doing some resolution test though.

hjfilmspeed

  • Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 479
  • 5D III and IV
Re: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2012, 07:08:17 PM »
This is a 70 second video comparing the results of using the 5D Mark III's internal codec (ALL-I) with the video from an external recorder via ML's clean HDMI out. The external recorder is the HyperDeck Shuttle and ML is a1ex's Alpha 2 version for the 5D Mark III

As is discussed in the notes on the Vimeo, the current challenges in getting good results this configuration are: 1) the video via HDMI out is 1620x1080, requiring a zoom to get the same 16x9 image as what the 5D records; 2) The HDMI output is at 1080i, requiring deinterlacing; and 3) the output of the HDMI is 8-bit and might be 4:2:2, but could be 4:2:0.
Quote

Excellent work. Im not sure if i would want to record my video this way yet. but i think you may have revealed why the mark 3 has such soft internal recording. 1620x910 is probably what the mark iii is actually resolving (if even). then the 8bit and 4:2:0 h.264 probably further cripple it. At this point the olpf thing is deffinetly out. Again shooting an s2 jpeg in video mode yields a 1920x1080 jpeg that looks way sharper then its video. (realy good actualy telling me the rez is there, just not at 24fps) The soft video of the mark iii is due to how its sampled in camera IMO. Weather canon deliberatly did this or the camera cant physically capture true 16X9 1080 from its 20+mpix 35mm sensor is still unclear i guess. I do remember canon saying they were "trying to preserve details." and that they expect mark iii users to step up there "sharpening skills" Im not trying to bash but that to me sounds like a line there supposed to say so we feel at fault. I wish canon would just be straight with us is all.

hjfilmspeed

  • Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 479
  • 5D III and IV
Re: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2012, 10:02:40 PM »
This is a 70 second video comparing the results of using the 5D Mark III's internal codec (ALL-I) with the video from an external recorder via ML's clean HDMI out. The external recorder is the HyperDeck Shuttle and ML is a1ex's Alpha 2 version for the 5D Mark III

As is discussed in the notes on the Vimeo, the current challenges in getting good results this configuration are: 1) the video via HDMI out is 1620x1080, requiring a zoom to get the same 16x9 image as what the 5D records; 2) The HDMI output is at 1080i, requiring deinterlacing; and 3) the output of the HDMI is 8-bit and might be 4:2:2, but could be 4:2:0.


Excellent work. Im not sure if i would want to record my video this way yet. but i think you may have revealed why the mark 3 has such soft internal recording. 1620x910 is probably what the mark iii is actually resolving (if even). then the 8bit and 4:2:0 h.264 probably further cripple it. At this point the olpf thing is deffinetly out. Again shooting an s2 jpeg in video mode yields a 1920x1080 jpeg that looks way sharper then its video. (realy good actualy telling me the rez is there, just not at 24fps) The soft video of the mark iii is due to how its sampled in camera IMO. Weather canon deliberatly did this or the camera cant physically capture true 16X9 1080 from its 20+mpix 35mm sensor is still unclear i guess. I do remember canon saying they were "trying to preserve details." and that they expect mark iii users to step up there "sharpening skills" Im not trying to bash but that to me sounds like a line there supposed to say so we feel at fault. I wish canon would just be straight with us is all.

Kraemer

  • New to the forum
  • *
  • Posts: 45
Re: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« Reply #8 on: November 20, 2012, 05:18:10 AM »
Great video test. Foliage is a compression grinder for sure.

""
As is discussed in the notes on the Vimeo, the current challenges in getting good results this configuration are: 1) the video via HDMI out is 1620x1080, requiring a zoom to get the same 16x9 image as what the 5D records; 2) The HDMI output is at 1080i, requiring deinterlacing; and 3) the output of the HDMI is 8-bit and might be 4:2:2, but could be 4:2:0.""

Are you saying there's no way to output full uncompressed HD, 1920x1080 out of the current 5Dm3 ?   Interlaced or not; would be ok with me. but 1620?  Can you guys crack it so it will export full rez?

Francis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 818
Re: Clean HDMI out on 5D Mark III with ML Alpha 2
« Reply #9 on: November 20, 2012, 07:19:13 AM »
Are you saying there's no way to output full uncompressed HD, 1920x1080 out of the current 5Dm3 ?   Interlaced or not; would be ok with me. but 1620?  Can you guys crack it so it will export full rez?

They are saying that right now it is not possible. All development is made with little steps breaking new ground. Will any one get 'full-rez'? Maybe. If each feature unlocked was limited to one that some developer positively knew they could 'crack,' ML would be pretty boring. Be patient, wait around, and maybe. And please don't ask when.