Author Topic: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?  (Read 2026 times)

Kyle Kearns

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Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« on: January 19, 2019, 06:08:22 AM »
I normally do my color correction/grading in lightroom because that's what I know best, but recently started to tinker with resolve.....I noticed that when I tried to bring up the exposure or play with the highlights or shadows it reacts like a crappy jpeg photo. It seems like there's no depth to the image whatsoever.

Could I be doing something wrong or is resolve just not as good at handling raw files?

I've been importing the dng files through the media browser in the program and I've also tried dragging them from the folder.

IDA_ML

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2019, 10:32:48 AM »
Of course!  And this is the fastest and easiest workflow.  All you need to do is convert your MLV files into folders with DNG files using MLVApp or MLVFS and you are ready to open them with Resolve.  Then use the Camera RAW module to process your clips in a way very similar to ACR.  Watch the Parade meter and do not overprocess your files.  Also, when filming, make sure you expose to the right without blowing up the highlights.  In that way you will get stunning video quality.

Enjoy!

Dmytro_ua

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2019, 11:32:44 AM »
I normally do my color correction/grading in lightroom because that's what I know best, but recently started to tinker with resolve.....

At first I thought almost the same as you are. But then I've got to know Resolve better and I can assure you, that you can get almost identical color grading with Resolve, ACR/Lightroom, MLVApp.

To make it easier, I've made a reference color grading in ACR and then started to match it in Resolve (then also did the same with MLV App).
IMHO, the first thing is to choose Color Space: Blackmagic Design in Resolve's Camera Raw settings. I tried REC.709, but the colors are weird and it is really hard to match with that color space. So, for me, Color Space: Blackmagic Design - is a way to go.
Then, in Camera RAW check:
- WB
- Tint
- Exposure (even if it looks ok in ACR, in Davinci I always make +1.18-1.2 exposure). I think there is some difference in calibration.
- Sharpness: 10 - this is a default sharpness , if I'm not wrong, Resolve's 10 = 0 in other programs. If you change it to 0, you actually make it "minus". So 10 - is a good start.
- other settings can stay by default. You can get back to them anytime later (if you need).

Then, move to Color Wheels. You'll need to pump up some saturation, a little bit of contrast. Try to learn how "Nodes" work. All Curves windows, Qualifier, Windows (Masks), etc. It's not hard. Watch some tutorials on youtube.

g3gg0

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2019, 03:40:39 PM »
using Davinci Resolve with mlvfs and it works quite well.
sometimes mlvfs had problems loading some frames, but that was just a temporary issue.

so i can recommend this combination as it saves you the conversion effort / space.
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Dmytro_ua

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2019, 11:16:12 AM »
using Davinci Resolve with mlvfs and it works quite well.

What is the best workflow of mlvfs on a PC?

Kyle Kearns

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2019, 06:32:50 AM »
Okay here is what I'm talking about:

Both images I used the dropper to find the white balance, and both I pushed up the shadow .67.

Resolve looks like absolute garbage....why?






Dmytro_ua

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2019, 10:36:12 AM »
Both images I used the dropper to find the white balance, and both I pushed up the shadow .67.

Resolve looks like absolute garbage....why?

You don't have to blindly copy the settings.
Could you upload the source DNG file (only 1 frame) and JPEG file (edited in Lightroom to your taste).
When I have time, I'll try to match it in Resolve.

eNnvi

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2019, 12:28:09 PM »
Okay here is what I'm talking about:

Both images I used the dropper to find the white balance, and both I pushed up the shadow .67.

Resolve looks like absolute garbage....why?






That's because you're using log wheels e not primary bars (learn to use primary bars instead of primary wheels), did you maybe use a LUT? That would be an orribile mistake (at least on the first node)

There's a reason that makes Davinci Resolve a perfect software for color correction and grading and that's his "YRGB color space".

Not many YouTubers really know how to properly use DaVinci correctly, find a BMD trainer and ask for a course (I did it, if you work with videos it's worth the investment, I learned a lot of tricks that made me save hundred hours of worktime)

Dmytro_ua

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2019, 02:31:25 PM »
I learned a lot of tricks that made me save hundred hours of worktime

Can you share some of the tricks with us?  ;)

Is there any information which can be useful especially to ML RAW users?

Levas

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2019, 04:06:21 PM »
Okay here is what I'm talking about:

Both images I used the dropper to find the white balance, and both I pushed up the shadow .67.

Resolve looks like absolute garbage....why?







This difference has probably also to do with the different history in video editing and photo editing.
Resolve is a video editor and video people are used to lift, gamma and gain.
And Lightroom is a photo editor and it does a lot of tricks in the background.

If you use lift in resolve, it actually does what it is supposed to do, it lifts the video signal, especially the lower values, the shadows.
So, you end up with gray shadows, because that is what lift is, it raises the video signal, so also the black point is raised.

If you use the shadow slider in Lightroom, a lot is happening, it doesn't literally lift the shadows. The shadows values are raised, black point isn't raised that much I think, and it also does something with contrast and saturation in the background. 

Somehow photo and video editors are still working a bit differently, because in the past it were two different things...


eNnvi

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2019, 01:22:53 AM »
Can you share some of the tricks with us?  ;)

Is there any information which can be useful especially to ML RAW users?

The first thing is about not using luts, there are tools (like stills) that are a lot more powerful. The biggest difference is that a LUT "cuts" the signal above and under, while still doesn't.
Then I learned the use of every node and also mixer and splitter node.

The biggest thing that helped me on ml raw is how to manage caching and the color space (input/output/viewer and so on) in the settings.

Then I knew the general workflow to be really faster, like using flags, smart bins, shared nodes, stills managing, caching and optimized media, etc..

It would be really too long to write everything in one post, maybe an entire forum would be needed for that.

Pheraps the fastest thing that made me be more precise is using the 10bit mode for the color picker (even if you have a 10bit monitor, like I have, your eyes can't see what davinci could) abd the thing that made me be faster is lightbox and stills (you can use lightbox to mark your clips with a flag, then correct just one clip, take a still of that clip and paste the still over the similar clips, then use the split window to match with another clip, take still of the new clip and paste over similar clips, then repeat again untill you corrected all the clips, then a couple of shared node and secondary is done).

Dmytro_ua

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2019, 10:34:24 AM »
The first thing is about not using luts, there are tools (like stills) that are a lot more powerful. The biggest difference is that a LUT "cuts" the signal above and under, while still doesn't.
Then I learned the use of every node and also mixer and splitter node.

The biggest thing that helped me on ml raw is how to manage caching and the color space (input/output/viewer and so on) in the settings.

Then I knew the general workflow to be really faster, like using flags, smart bins, shared nodes, stills managing, caching and optimized media, etc..

It would be really too long to write everything in one post, maybe an entire forum would be needed for that.

Pheraps the fastest thing that made me be more precise is using the 10bit mode for the color picker (even if you have a 10bit monitor, like I have, your eyes can't see what davinci could) abd the thing that made me be faster is lightbox and stills (you can use lightbox to mark your clips with a flag, then correct just one clip, take a still of that clip and paste the still over the similar clips, then use the split window to match with another clip, take still of the new clip and paste over similar clips, then repeat again untill you corrected all the clips, then a couple of shared node and secondary is done).

Thanks for sharing, but it's the general information, what Resolve can do. And it's not difficult to discover these tips reading the manual, or watching video tutorials.
I thought, you could share some tips from your own experience, concerning your workflow with ML.
For example: How to manage caching and the color space (input/output/viewer and so on) in the settings. - for ML footage.

Anyway, thanks

allemyr

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2019, 09:51:55 AM »
Hi

Yes all the ML RAW specific things is more about colorspaces and gammas, thats a huge thing ofcourse since everything we do with the camera is color :)
Since its not a premade workflow by for example Panasonic Sony, Arri or RED you have to solve everything with colorspaces by yourself and that can be very tricky.
I've for example fiddle around for many years. Shure I 4 years ago got acceptable colors for a video I didn't know much about colorspaces and so on.

I once a while get into Resolve and try out my thoughts, I follow Juan Melera on Youtube and Vimeo since 6 years :) https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqi6295cdFJI9VUPzIN4NXQ He  shows of various workflows that you can adjust to your camera, ML RAW here.

This image was my finding today, Apply Pre Tone Curve together with the rest of my workflow solves it for me and now I want to go out and capture stuff again with my old 5D3 which hasn't happend for some months.
You can find this panel in Resolve Project Settings, and Camera RAW tab and since I work with CDNGs I go to the CNDG tab and change the settings for how those files will be adjusted with CRaw tools




Camera settings is set the same but with clip instead of project which open up the adjustment sliders but apply all the settings from the general panel.




I then have 2 colorspace transforms with a node where I balance my shot, since it reacts smoother to it in a log space and looks more natural.








With only a withbalance adjustment and offset/exposure adjustment I can consistet grades now which makes me happy.
I post some still exports from Resolve. And you can see that I have no sharp edges from bright sharp highlights anymore :)
Now I need to use my camera, and today I will :) Happy shooting!









This togheter with my upscale with superscale to UHD from DNGs looks super!

Dmytro_ua

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2019, 11:04:51 AM »
You can find this panel in Resolve Project Settings, and Camera RAW tab and since I work with CDNGs I go to the CNDG tab and change the settings for how those files will be adjusted with CRaw tools

Camera settings is set the same but with clip instead of project which open up the adjustment sliders but apply all the settings from the general panel.

I then have 2 colorspace transforms with a node where I balance my shot, since it reacts smoother to it in a log space and looks more natural.

Hi allemyr,

Thanks for sharing your experience. I'm definitely going to try your workflow with my footage.  ;)

But, I'm interested in your opinion with a few questions, first of all:
- why do you choose P3 D60 Color Space?
- why do you reduce sharpness to Resolve's "0"? As I know = 20 (in Resolve) - is a default setting which does nothing to sharpness of the original file. I mean, if you set "0" in Resolve, you actually reduce sharpness of your DNG to negative value.

Regards

allemyr

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #14 on: January 28, 2019, 11:21:42 AM »
Hi!

P3 D60 is pretty similar to rec.709 but P3 D60 should be a richer color space to work with, I export the video in rec.709 tho and gamma 2.2.
I work with files from 5D3 which has this line skipping sensor (every third pixel is used) so i reduce sharpness in the camera raw process and sharpen in the last node with contrast pop, but the -20 sharpness settings might be to much but I stick with that.
The -20 setting can reduce sharp highlight lines as a defect of debayering. So its for me camera specific since i guess this 1920px wide image from a 5760px sensor could be hard to debayer since its gaps between the used pixel in the camera.

allemyr

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2019, 12:04:21 PM »

From that start point I follow this grade to get highlights down with LOG color wheels like the tutorial show.
I realise that I need to show my hole workflow with every setting in Resolve for this to work, but basically I follow Melaras advice to balance in LOGspace and the grade/look at the end.

I use a simple mlv to cdng converter. But yes for this info to be useful I might need to explain it more precise.

Set it up right and the Log color wheels will let you balance every different shot perfectly and easy. The offset slider for exposure and highlight slider is the most i use to get every different shot good.
I had trouble with that before especially with smooth highlight and not a flat looking image.

allemyr

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2019, 08:03:29 PM »
Took some footage today from last month and put it togheter to this with my new find about the "Apply Pre Tone Curve"


I have to say that Youtube UHD is terrific in terms of online streaming quality!
If you have a UHD display please turn on 4k :)

Glad I put some effort in today in Resolve, because not be able to use my camera since I wasn't any happy about color in Resolve was terrible.

This camera has aged very well and its pretty fun how its Resolve that makes all this various brands raw cameras feel great!

allemyr

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2019, 08:59:23 AM »
Version 2

Hi did the same thing but adjusted the "low range" also, the black point.
We all have different workflows and I don't use it to much since its a hobby.
14-bit is very nice but maybe I need to adjust my grade a bit to protect noise. This NR sharperning thing is really a hassle and maybe something you should stay out, since it takes much time to fine tune and I didn't fine tune in this video.

allemyr

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2019, 09:18:02 AM »
The Apply Pre Tone Curve was really the game changer here for me. Glad I started from scratch and found it.




allemyr

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2019, 09:46:41 AM »
From this to this its one click in Resolve with some slight adjustments because of different exposures in the shot or white balance.
I like it, but need to get better at grading :)








Tyronetheterrible

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #20 on: February 04, 2019, 04:28:31 AM »
Okay here is what I'm talking about:

Both images I used the dropper to find the white balance, and both I pushed up the shadow .67.

Resolve looks like absolute garbage....why?







In Resolve have you tried just raising the Shadows in the Camera Raw tab as opposed to the Color Wheel tab? That might give you similar results to Lightroom.

allemyr

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #21 on: February 24, 2019, 10:36:44 PM »
Sorry for posting much in this thread :) I know its 2019 now but I spent some hours more on fine tuning the amount of NR and sharpen the video with the OpenFX "sharpen" effect in Resolve instead of "Contrast Pop" effect. Since this is one of the few Resolve threads here I hope its ok that i post here. Finally I solved my workflow. I have spent quite much time during the years I had this camera on post workflow learning Resolve and adapt it to ML RAW footage with findings here and there. It has been many months between my testing but sometimes I spent 3 days in a row :) This tutorial solved my grading thoughts by Juan Melara and lot of reading in the Davinci Resolve 15 manual :)

Finetuned the NR and sharpening UHD looks fine on Youtube tho its shot in 1080p. 1080p always look crap on Youtube.

Now when I feel comfortable with the quality I get out of it and with a pretty easy way so the main focus can be editing and film i might start using my videocamera a bit more :) the lately.
Since i guess the thread starter left a while back i hope its ok to post here.

Best Regards
Karl

Kyle Kearns

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Re: Does resolve work for magic lantern raw?
« Reply #22 on: March 10, 2019, 06:14:44 AM »
Okay it looks like it was a combination of having the wrong project settings and not using the camera raw tab, thanks guys!

I'm able to control the image most of the way that I'm used to in lightroom, I just need to figure out a few more things.