Author Topic: Investing in a CR.2 lens?  (Read 4325 times)

D_Odell

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Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« on: December 08, 2016, 03:08:07 PM »
Hi everyone!

Recently I've been digging into crop view shooting and many of my lenses are pretty soft.
But since I want long focus, with deep focus scenes, long focus wheels etc CR.2 seems like the best option? Currently looking at the 15mm F2.9 here.

Do anyone have a propper focus shoot with a CR.2 lens preferably a wide angle and could offer me a DNG to play around with? If you have shoot in daytime all the better!

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dfort

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2016, 07:05:50 PM »
You mean this lens? (You might want to edit your references to CR.2 lens.)



Yeah, it is a great lens. It has interchangeable mounts so you can switch between Canon EF, Nikon F, Micro 4/3, Sony E and PL mount. Good thing because it retails for $5,700. Note that this lens will also cover full frame sensors while the 18mm will not.

Have you looked at the Xeen 14mm T3.1? It also has interchangeable mounts but is less than half the price. It is a rather new lens so time will tell if catches on with the pros and the rental houses.



Now when you say "crop view shooting" in this forum are you talking about Magic Lantern crop hack or zoom mode? That is much smaller than APS-C or Super35.

Can't locate any DNG samples to download but the equivalent still camera lens is listed on the DXOMARK website.

I'm happy with my 16mm T2.2 Bower (a.k.a. Rokinon, Samyang) Cine lens (APS-C only). Just checked the price and it is $269 at B&H. I use Nikon mount lenses with adapters so it will cover the same platforms as the above lenses except for PL mount.
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D_Odell

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2016, 07:51:41 PM »
Now when you say "crop view shooting" in this forum are you talking about Magic Lantern crop hack or zoom mode? That is much smaller than APS-C or Super35.
Correct I usually go for 2.5 crop in ML crop hack to achieve "normal" field of view.. Also a 21mm lens will work fine for me as a wide angle lens on a s35 sensor.

Can't locate any DNG samples to download but the equivalent still camera lens is listed on the DXOMARK website.
Will check that out. But if anyone have a DNG please drop me a note!

I'm happy with my 16mm T2.2 Bower (a.k.a. Rokinon, Samyang) Cine lens (APS-C only). Just checked the price and it is $269 at B&H. I use Nikon mount lenses with adapters so it will cover the same platforms as the above lenses except for PL mount.
Since I have used Zeiss before and like their bokeh and sharpness I will in this case go for one of thous, not new but used. But I will need to sell the hole kit of FD L lenses so must be sure first.
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dfort

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Re: Investing in a CP.2 lens?
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2016, 08:01:04 PM »
I see from your signature that you've got your OLPF removed so you must be a stickler for sharpness. Can't go wrong with Zeiss CP.2 Primes for sharpness and build quality.
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D_Odell

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2016, 08:18:40 PM »
I see from your signature that you've got your OLPF removed so you must be a stickler for sharpness. Can't go wrong with Zeiss CP.2 Primes for sharpness and build quality.
Actually I believe to make harder decision for future shootings, for starters one lens, one view "to rule them all" sort of speak.. So I will in that case choose a really good prime that makes the "normal view" I like best.

Do you have a link to one of your films with Teen 14mm? Thanks!
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dfort

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2016, 09:03:20 PM »
"Xeen" -- I haven't used it but here's an interesting comparison between the Xeen, Zeiss CP.2 and Sony Cine Alta lenses.

I agree with you that it is better to have less gear but better quality. I learned photography using my father's Rolleiflex twin lens reflex.

I'd show you some shots with the Bower 16mm but since it isn't a chipped lens I'm not sure which shots were taken with that lens. We're working on a lua script that will help with that:

http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=18083.msg176090#msg176090
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D_Odell

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #6 on: December 10, 2016, 12:29:42 PM »
The more I read about it the more turn off I get, it seems that CP.2 is SLR optics put in cine housing. That means that there is the same amount of breathing and other downsides. The positives I'm not sure...

Source: http://cinematechnic.com/optics/zeiss_compact_prime_cp2

Also I had a conversation with a Zeiss representative and he couldn't recomend CP.2 super speed over original CP.2. The reason that you need to stop down to 2.1, same stop as CP.2 non super speed to get sharpness... I you want to go where I want it seems PL lenses is the way to go. I'm not a Sigma man.
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dfort

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #7 on: December 10, 2016, 05:07:57 PM »
Interesting article. There have been a bunch of new less expensive cine style lenses that are basically rehoused still lenses. Some aren't even hiding it. Cinematics, a company based in Shenzhen, China, will rehouse a lens that you send them:

https://www.cinema5d.com/how-to-get-a-fake-canon-50mm-cine-lens-for-800-instead-of-5000-and-what-to-expect/

One reason I brought up the Xeen lenses is because the manufacturer, Samyang, keeps revising the formula for their newer lenses. For example the 16mm Xeen is very different from the cheap 16mm Bower that I've got. The new lens will cover a full frame sensor, something that seems to be a new trend in PL mount lenses.

What camera are you planning to use with your PL mount lens? As you know there are PL to EF adapters but going EF to PL requires extensive rehousing--like the CP.2 lenses.
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D_Odell

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #8 on: December 11, 2016, 08:47:43 PM »
What camera are you planning to use with your PL mount lens? As you know there are PL to EF adapters but going EF to PL requires extensive rehousing--like the CP.2 lenses.
There seems like stupidity to go there, just waist of money? Staying at 5D3 and going PL... At the moment my company isn't doing well so what my FD set will bring in will determine what possibilities there are. But I was just let down when heard of the Zeiss rehousing DSLR optics. But of course a cine prime (Ultra Prime/Master Prime) with non breathing issues and what Zeiss are known off aka dreamy bokey is beyond my documentary budgets. Maybe look around to see what will come up. Best, David
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Kharak

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2016, 08:55:50 PM »
Is there any IQ difference between Xeen and Rokinon? I get that the 16 mm has lots of changes, as it was originally not made for full frame. But I watched a video by Shane Hurlbut (ASC) where he compares Xeen, cooke and some other cinema lenses. Now it was not a comparrison between xeen and rokinon, but to me the Xeen 35 has the exact same look and flaws as the rokinon e.g. Thick green and purple CA and low contrast, and overall green/yellow glass. The Samyang glass never gives accurate colours.

These xeen lenses seem to be only rehoused glass with longer focus throw in my opinion.

If you wanna throw big cash at cinema lenses, I'd suggest quality glass from Zeiss or Canon.

Just my 2 cents
once you go raw you never go back

dfort

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2016, 09:55:36 PM »
Throw more than 2 cents onto that if you are going for PL mount lenses and broaden your search to include Panavision Primo V, Leica Summicron-C and Cooke Mini S4/i lenses. Just one lens can cost around $15,000 so we're talking serious cash for a set of primes.

I know a few DP's and none of them have these lenses in their personal camera bags. If they do own them they broker them through a rental house.
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D_Odell

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2016, 09:56:49 AM »
Read some interesting articles at thecinelens and this illustration of purchasing a Cine lens is quite good:


Click me!
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Kharak

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2016, 05:06:23 PM »
I was not suggesting cooke or panavision.. But when you are cashing out for xeen lenses, there are other lenses in that price range with higher IQ.
once you go raw you never go back

D_Odell

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2017, 09:44:48 AM »
After using a CP.2 at a shoot, short handed, no focus pullers, one man camera crew, the lens don't perform to what the price say. If you want professional housing of a photo lens, or exact focus metrics, then the lens is for you if wanting to burn 3000€.

The image quality is not what I have been looking for.
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dfort

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Re: Investing in a CR.2 lens?
« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2017, 05:05:44 PM »
The image quality is not what I have been looking for.

Maybe, but I'll bet everyone was saying, "now that's a professional lens!"
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