Computer specs for editing 1920x1080 raw mlv files

[juliusE]

Hi everyone,
couldn't find a post on this subject directly.

I want to invest in a new computer that is tough enough for editing raw mlv files online.. (but would also like to know what you can get away with with a online/offline workflow)..
right now I own a Macbook pro from 2012, so im not even gonna try to find a workflow as it will probably be too much of a hassle on its specs.

But what kind of hardware are people using for their post production, working with high res raw files?
Please enlighten me so I know I'm getting something strong enough - but at the same time dont waste money on something superficial.

cheers

[Danne]

I use a mb pro 15 inch 16gb ram 2.6 quadcore, nvidia card. Works fairly smooth with davinci resolve and premiere pro. I, d say that, s a good minimum basestation for a smooth workflow.

[budafilms]

For use Final Cut or Da Vinci I recommend a computer with AMD card. OSX work faster with Open CL.

[juliusE]

Thanks guys

I use davinci resolve and premiere pro
would be lovely with some detailed specs of peoples systems, here on ML forum

[budafilms]

Julius, various people here are using a Hackintosh.
It's a cheap way to get a mac, with a few of investigation.
If you have a couple of nights and no too much money could be very usefull and you can upgrade components less often than an entire machine like a Mac.

I let you a site where I build a couple of machines in my past, only following a guide:
http://www.rampagedev.com

My recommendation is get Intel Processor i7 Quad Core, Asus or Gigabyte Motherboard, a good video card from nvidia 660ti or Amd 280X or better and a lot of space in hard drives, or better, make a RAID system with software.

As you know, Yosemite and EL Capitan are free and is a legal option, like Magic Lantern in you Canon

Everything could be better hacking our life!

[ansius]

I would rather think first of the actual workflow, and then check what actual software needs and on what hardware it works the best.

I'm using Adobe thus PC /  Windows is superior because of the Mercury Engine and nVidia cuda. Form my tests I've found that pc with mercury engine vs opengl on mac runs faster. and when you factor the price for a desktop-ish solution - price performance is way better with PC than MAC. Tough in a recording studio I've built and work in - we are basically MAC only, and for the same reason price / performance (meaning legal software as well). With laptops now it is head to head, more matter of taste, IMHO

as for PC - go with Intel CPU, forget AMD, too unstable (you don't want to rerun crashed 8 hour renders), also do research in RAM speeds because the MHz ir not all, there is also RAS/CAS timings, and that can make huge difference. also look for bottlenecks, sometimes they are the main problem, like dual core cpu can work more or less with 3-4 hd multicam, as long as your hard drive can deliver the footage.

so start with workflow, then look for corresponding computer.

[budafilms]

@ansius

I have three PCs and three macs.

The PCs are dual booting: win 7 64 bits and OSX Yosemite. Two with nvidia 970 Gtx and one with AMD 290X

Davinci Resolve and premier for Mac and for PC  - I'm not using Premier any more - I have both OS version in the same hardware.

The result in performance, renders, effects and stability under mac it's superior in time with the same job. Like 20 to 50% better depends if I work with Pro Res or H264.

Right now I'm upgrading PC to OSX EL CAPITAN. That works under Metal - like Mercury in PC as you said - and work faster than Yosemite.

I understand and I read about CUDAS but appear to work very good only for games.

This is my expierence.

[juliusE]

Thanks everyone!
I'm definitely going with building a strong hackintosh!

Think I have everything pretty down on what to get and how to build it, BUT only thing i can't get my head around is doing a RAID hardware thing.... hmmmm,,, sounds like the BEST option, but maybe also very expensive? ...

[budafilms]

@Julius

You can create a RAID by software with DISK Utility, under OSX. It's very fast and easy and I have from 5 years without any problem. You can connect and disconnect the disk, change the ports. Even change from a mac to another and for a OSX version to other.

Google :RAID disk OSX. Do an Stripe, and select 256K unit for big files such video.

Try to read this article, very interesting about Premiere vs Final Cut X
http://www.macprovideo.com/hub/final-cut/final-cut-pro-x-vs-adobe-premiere-pro-performance-test

[reddeercity]

Hackintoss, is the way to go if you what killer performance on a Mac platform.
If you get the right components you will Crush any MP 5.1 , you even keep up with the new Mac Pro Late 2013 edition
I have  been running the same Hackintoss Desktop for over 2 years now and in A.E. its 2x faster then
my MP5.1 , with 26G ram, 4 core 8 thread Xeon CPU, SSD OSX & Raid0 with 2WD VelociRaptor 10k 600GB Drives(1.2TB in Raid-0)

tonymacx86 is a Great resource for hackintoss there even a list
of components that will work for OSX buyers-guide for CustoMac_Pro this where I started to learn all about how to build a Hackitoss.
The #1 mother board recommended is the Gigabyte.

As far as Raid disk array's , there is 2 option first you can buy a raid controller PCIe add on Card
Or you can use the motherboard sata on board chip controller to build a raid-0 disk array.

With the add on card  you will get faster speed e.g. Raid-5 which is a minimum of 3 disk (4 better incase one drive fails)
with redundancy .
Where as Raid-0 is fast only needs 2 disks can be configured in OSX ,uses the on board controller, But No redundancy .
If a drive fails you lose the Whole Raid and all of you data ,unless you backup.

A good Raid card with memory runs about $250.0 - $600.0 you can get cheaper one but they have no ram on the card .

I run a ATTO R380 in raid 5 configuration with 4x2TB=8TB (in raid5 it read as 6TB)
R/W 450MB/s on average.

Raid-0 in my MP5.1 R/W is 250MB/s , If on a budget the onboard controller works just fine , just remember to backup.

I'll mention one last thing , the best part about the Hachintoss is the fact that you can Overclock your CPU big time.
I have a i7 3770k 4 cores, 8 threads , default speed is 3.5GHz I crank mine to 4.7GHz(with a water cooler) plus overclock the Ram from 1066
to 1600 MHz. Make a Biggggg difference .

[juliusE]

Thanks @reddeercity !
Alright, very cool
I'm gonna go for a raid-0 setup I think - cus I have to keep it affordable for me.
Any specific harddisk you need to get for doing raid?
and what is the disadvantage if the raid card not having ram?

[DeafEyeJedi]

This is my next investment -- thanks so much for your comprehensive details and it's much appreciated @reddeercity & @budafilms!

I'll definitely get my hands on this after the Holidays when I get my bonus from work.

[reddeercity]

what is the disadvantage if the raid card not having ram?

Found this at a Server site , I thing it explains it better then I would.

what-is-the-memory-module-on-a-raid-card-needed-for

The memory is used for read and write cache which improves the performance of the storage. The basic rule when it comes to cache is buy as much as you can afford. The more cache you have the better the performance of the disks will be as data can be written to the memory if the disks aren't in the correct position.

The purpose of RAM on a RAID controller is to provide a level of cache to allow write operations to hit stable storage without incurring the latencies involved with rotating disks.
The RAM on the controller can usually be split between read and write cache. A common ratio is 75:25 write:read.
 

Any specific harddisk you need to get for doing raid?

Rule of thumb is to keep them the same size & same brand. but you can use really any thing , if you use two different sizes e.g. 1TB , 2TB the 2TB will be formatted to 1TB so you would end up to only 2TB Raid0. So that would be a waste of hard drive.
There are many choices out then now for HD in a raid , but I like  Seagate Barracuda STBD2000101 2TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5"
Seagate Barracuda 2TB Spec PDF
"Average data rate, read/write (MB/s) 156MB/s Maximum sustained data rate, OD read (MB/s) 210MB/s"
Have 4 of these in my Raid 5 Box for the MAC plus in my PC Work Station I have 4 more with the motherboard Sata Controller Raid0 , which give 8TB with R/W speeds of 700+ MB/s

@DeafEyeJedi It's twice performance at half the price , and now the new PC Mother Boards have Thunder Bolt2 & USB3.1 -10Gb/s
Plus the ability for expansion for hardware etc......

[allemyr]

Nice thread!

I would like to update my computer a bit but I'am quite satisfied with its performence anyhow, some hardware in it is quite old but still poweful.

I use a PC with the following:

CPU: 2600k 3.4ghz i7 4-core
RAM: 24gb
SSD 1: Intel 120gb OS on it
SSD 2: Samsung EVO 500gb
HD: 2x 4tb in raid 1 for safebackup
GPU 1: GTX 780Ti 3gb
GPU 2: GTX 580 3gb

I really like editing video from a SSD's its read speed is around 500mb/s and write is half of that, don't really need anymore power from it when exportingn videos so i go with the Samsung EVO instead of Pro.
But the search times is great, no waiting or lag with a SSD. Strong GPU's is really what Davinci Resolve likes, realtime playback is no problem if you have nice GPU's even with a lot of effects, but with no noise reduction ofcourse.
500gb for a project is not much, so I think I will buy something around a 2tb SSD soon.

Best Regards!

[ggameon]

Get any new computer with a i7 processor as much ram as you can afford ( 32gb would be great ) and a decent older videocard

If you are on a budget?
videocard gtx 470/480  or 570-580 will do just fine ( dont go crazy on that unless $ is no issue)

Older processors like i7 2xxx 3xxx series are all great

ssd is nice but not absolutely necessary

for a good pc you could go crazy and get a hp or dell upto 60-70k $ looool but you dont have to spend more that 400-600$ to get a very good pc for most people unless you are crazy about cgi and complex 3d for which you earn a living ( in which case you wouldn't ask anybody a thing and would know all the available components and their benchmarks )

Most if not all people on this forum don't need the gtx 780/890 or quadra videocards ) spend that money on harddrive and 32gb ram or more in case of some motherboards that allow that, like the cheaper i7 3820 ( max 64gb )

Just for fun a system for you:

i7 4770k ( 3820-4820-3770-2600-2700)
32gb ram
gpu: gtx 670 ( cheaper..470-570-770-480-580-680)
storage ( 1 ssd would be nice minimum of 250gb if you can bigger )
good casing for better cooling
some kind of processor cooling costing about 100$ or less

it won't cost you a lot...not the best consumer pc but close to the top ) not including the top pro stuff which cost way too much for mortals

[reddeercity]

Most if not all people on this forum don't need the gtx 780/890 or quadra video cards

I Total Disagree Here , Get the biggest baddest Video Card you can Afford. Most if  not all editing & grading app rely on lot of Video ram & fast GPU.
Don't waste money on Old Tec. Video Cards .
And yes people here on the forum need it the Most because of Raw Video workflow , Try to do anything in DaVanci with a old GPU with 1GB Vram , nearly impossible.
Or FCPX which relies on Open CL , Cuda in A.E. or any Adobe  image app.
Yes you can get away with less , but the point of this Thread is "Editing 1920x1080 Raw MLV Files"not 720p or less .
Any computer will work , but if you are always waiting to do thing because your system is to slow or has a big bottle neck some where.
you will never get any where.
This apply to PC or MAC , I would sacrifice System Ram or a slower CPU speed (but I would just overclock anyways    Yea even in a MAC) to get a Killer Video Card or multiple GPU's Cards

[mothaibaphoto]

It's all depend on what you mean by "edit" and what software you intend to use.
I can edit 2240x1260 mlv with MS Ssurfase 3(not Pro) while on travel. Open with MLRawViewer(it plays flawlessly by the way), mark IN and OUT  - export.
Despite reddeercity claims, Adobe A.E. didn't use GPU on my windows desktop at all. Maybe it matters if to create 3D content or to run (expensive) 3-rd party plugins, or something like that.
But Resolve changes the game - this beast really makes wonder on fast GPU, I ordered GTX 970 just because of it.

[Walter Schulz]

Thanks for pointing me to Hackintosh, budafilms and reddeercity! Just managed to get it up and running. Crude at the moment but promising ...

[reddeercity]

Your Welcome Walter , Once you get all the bugs out then the fun begins .
Its really not that hard to setup ,  USB 3.0 was kind of a pain thou .
specking of that I had a extra PC USB3.0 Asus card kicking around,  put it in my Real Mac Pro 5.1 and
ended up using the Hackintoss USB 3.0 driver to get it work. Which was pretty cool.
Right now I'm Editing a film shot on a BMCC 2.4k on my Hackintoss with 2TB of Raw Cdng's and it doesn't
slow it down one little bit at all , Real time editing and in full preview with multiple grading nodes .... it really amazes me sometimes .

[DeafEyeJedi]

That's Great news, Walter and looking forward to your results!

Thanks again to @budafilms, @reddeercity and everyone else on this particular thread for their contributions and in excellent details!

You guys are such a tease & Can't wait to get my hands dirty after the Holidays!

[budafilms]

Just for upgrade this forum that appears to be interesting for new users.
Recently I made a new Hackintosh with this configuration, thinking a future for about 5 years and manage around 3 tb of DNG for my full lenght movies shooted in my 5d Mark III


Processor: i7 6700K (you can go for the 6700 with out K if you are not to overclock)
Mother: Asus Maximus Hero VIII (Go with the cheap asus if you don't need lots of Sata 3 for HD)
Ram: 32 GB 3200 MHZ Corsair
GPU: AMD 290X 4 GB Saphire Reference Card
3 x 1TB Barracuda (RAID Stripe from Disk Utility OSX software)
1x6TB (Time Machine back up, but, I never need it)
1x250 SSD Samsung Evo 850.
Power Suply 750 Watts NXZT (Check your GPU for calculate this)
Case NXZT H440

I'm running EL Capitan 10.11.5 and the only soft that I use in this work machine is Resolve 12.5 (free version), Final Cut X, Compressor, All the ML softwares except MLRviewer that always gave me problems. Now I'm try to learn Fusion (it's free and it's amazing) but always I get sleep.

My test numbers are:
Cinebench CPU: 950
Cinebench GPU: 140 fps
Geekbench 64 bits: 19,900
Raid, with Blackmagic disk test: 550 Mb/s write and similar to read.

If you need any help just write me a PM.

Good shots!