Author Topic: Canon 5D MK3 & Atomos Shogun Recorder vs Canon 5D MK IV with 4K? and ML  (Read 16240 times)

IndyP

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  As a Canon T2i owner I am looking to upgrade to a 4K camera. I would like a C100 MK 2 but at $5500 it’s a little on the expensive side. However, I love the form factor of the DSLR as well as its ability to immediately switch from stills to video and as a result am waiting with anticipation for the introduction of the 5D MK IV, which hopefully, will have 4K.

That being said, if it is able to shoot 4K, my question is:

1.   Would I be better buying the 5D MK IV at around $4000, or
2.   Would I be better off buying a 5D MK III ($2000) and an Atomos Shogun 4K recorder ($2000) = Total $4000

  In each case the cost would be about the same. Obvious advantages of the MK III with the Shogun Recorder would be a good field monitor (which I don’t have) vs any other advantages the new 5D MK IV would have.
  Also needing to be considered is:
        The workflow between the two systems when shooting 4K as well as the quality of the final output.
        My desire to keep Magic Lantern on the MK III or the MK IV (if I go that route)
        And my concern that I may have difficulty in loading Magic Lantern on a new 5D MK III or (hopefully later), the 5D MK IV
Give me some input guys, what do YOU think would be best.

Thanks.

chmee

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Re: Canon 5D MK3 & Atomos Shogun Recorder vs Canon 5D MK IV with 4K? and ML
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2015, 07:57:06 PM »
Sorry, what do you know about the 5D Mark IV? Nothing but Rumors? ..this is a hypothetical question without any answer.

IndyP

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Re: Canon 5D MK3 & Atomos Shogun Recorder vs Canon 5D MK IV with 4K? and ML
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2015, 01:52:06 AM »
   You are right, information about the 5D MK IV are nothing but rumors, but it is widely hoped and believed that it will have 4K. That being said, I am still looking for an answer, assuming that will be the case. No one really knows how 4K will progress, but as I am in the market for a new camera, I am inclined to buy one with 4K, especially since (and I’m speculating here), the demand for footage shot in 4K will continue to increase.

   However, (and I’m by no means an  authority on this subject), the problem is not which camera shoots the best in 4K, but which one allows the best and easiest workflow after the footage is shot. So, for users who understand a little more about the internal specs of the Canon 5D MK 2 and MK 3, and those who have perhaps used the Atomos Shogun to up-scale clean HDMI out from the 5D MK III to record 4K, what might the pros and cons be of recording 4K using the 5D MK III & Shogun vs a 5D with 4K?

   Perhaps someone who has used a ML hacked 5D MK3 with the Shogun to shoot 4K can give me an idea how their shots came out regardless of the possible specs of the future 5D MK IV.
   And “yes”, in part, I’m asking for a hypothetical answer to a hypothetical question that may help me to decide whether to buy the former, or wait for the latter.
Thanks

chmee

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Re: Canon 5D MK3 & Atomos Shogun Recorder vs Canon 5D MK IV with 4K? and ML
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2015, 09:13:37 AM »
technical simple.. You cant record 4K with a 5DIII. the usage of a shogun or odyssey isnt a help. you'd upscale a FullHD YUV4:2:2 to 4K on your workhorse and this is - i guarantee - not, what you want :) so, you have to wait 'til summer/autumn 2015 or decide for another manufacturer.

sgofferj

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Re: Canon 5D MK3 & Atomos Shogun Recorder vs Canon 5D MK IV with 4K? and ML
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2015, 11:14:14 AM »
I would wait for the Axiom with EF mount. I had a similar thinking process just that I was thinking about a Sony A7s plus a Shogun vs. a GH4 vs. a Blackmagic Production Camera 4K.
Now I have postponed my decision, hoping that there will be an Axiom Beta available also as a regular product (and not only for Kickstarter backers) and waiting for reviews.
18+ years Linux user, wolf-fan, hobby photographer and -filmmaker
EOS 6D, EOS 7D

IndyP

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Re: Canon 5D MK3 & Atomos Shogun Recorder vs Canon 5D MK IV with 4K? and ML
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2015, 05:54:20 AM »
   Hmmm? O.K. chmee, if I’m understanding you correctly, are you saying that you “CAN” record in 4K using the Shogun or Odyssey from a camera that has a clean HDMI 10 bit 4:2:2 signal (out), such as the 5D MK3, see here http://www.bhphotovideo.com/explora/video/news/unveiled-atomos-shogun-4k-hdmi-monitorrecorder but the difficult workflow and end results are not worth it?

    If this is the case, then the point I made in my last post (which I heard from a reputable authority on the subject), must be valid, and that is, “it’s not which camera shoots the best 4K, but which one presents you with the easiest and best workflow afterwards.

   Sgofferj also said in his post that he was also thinking along similar lines as myself. Any further clarification you can give as to why it’s not advisable to go with such a setup as the Canon 5D MK III and Atomos Shogun would be appreciated. I’m sure there are others who are currently thinking along the same lines.   :)

chmee

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Re: Canon 5D MK3 & Atomos Shogun Recorder vs Canon 5D MK IV with 4K? and ML
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2015, 08:09:16 AM »
Where's the benefit recording a fullhd@8bit@4:2:2-Signal that will be blown up to 4k including the 4:2:2-artifacts (if upscaling is even possible in shogun)?

the footage won't be sharper, you have to carry and power this external recorder, its an additional source of trouble. the only thing: you wont have typical h264-blocking/smearing-artifacts - but you're able to optimize the h264 with ml inside the body.

regards chmee

dopepope

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Re: Canon 5D MK3 & Atomos Shogun Recorder vs Canon 5D MK IV with 4K? and ML
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2015, 11:03:43 PM »
Indy, you cannot record 4k out of the mk3 even with magic lantern. you can only get a 1080 signal out of the camera.
maybe 4k is possible at some future point? but i think it's hardware limited to the 1080 signal it currently sends.

DjJuvan

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Re: Canon 5D MK3 & Atomos Shogun Recorder vs Canon 5D MK IV with 4K? and ML
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2015, 09:39:48 PM »
5Dmk3 doesn't output 4K through HDMI. I have it and Atomos Shogun too, it doesn't work. I bought sony a7s for that purpose.