Which Cameras are Capable of 4k Video? MAX Res of Your Camera at 24+fps?

[sumpm1]

Can people please weigh in on which cameras they have been able to shoot ~4k resolution at 24+fps h264?

I will outline the reason for my question and what I intend to film. But please just let me know what the max resolution your 550d/T2i, 600d, 650d, so on HAS BEEN ABLE to record 24+fps h264. I would not like to deflect the discussion away to "you don't need that resolution, you can just use x resolution/format..." I want to know the answer to this question. Thank you.

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So what will I be filming. I am a musician. I will be recording video of myself and band members performing individually in front of green screen. With the intention of being able to choose fancy background sets. Also I would enjoy the experience learning about the chroma key process and editing process. So yes my chosen camera would be used with the main intention of chroma key work.

My final edits will be intended for youtube. The final resolution will most likely be only 1280x720. But I would like to give chroma keying a shot at 4k. This is probably pretty new to the scene. Not many hobbyists have had the opportunity to film at 4k because of the budget. So there is probably not much public info about "chroma keying using 4k vs chroma keying at 1080p. But the VideoAlchemy youtube channel did a decent trial of 4k chroma key using the GH4 here: http://youtu.be/-bUUNL6Zhvg

I am sure I could get great results with ~1080p original footage. But I am a geek. I want to try 4k h264 out for chroma key.

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BTW: I am new to the boards so this is my first post. Hello!

[dmilligan]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=list+of+4k+capable+video+cameras&l=1

None of them. There aren't any cameras supported by ML that are capable of anything more than 1080p h264. The only Canon DSLR that can record 4K is the $10,000 1D-C. And even that camera cannot record 4K in h246, it uses MJPEG.

[sumpm1]

Thank you for the reply.

Hmm. I guess I just saw several "4k videos" (not timelapses) posted under the name of "magic lantern." I guess I assumed that they were h264. Because under raw, I saw on this article http://goo.gl/gPtzda, that the max raw resolution of most cameras is either 1280x720 or ~1080p. So I made an assumption, that the 4k videos I had seen from Canon DSLR were in h264.

Alright. I guess I need to ask a different question:

Q: Are any of the Canon DSLR cameras capable of shooting in ~4k video resolution in ANY format? Such as MJPEP or other? And if so, which cameras?

And so the question is still the same: What is the max video res of your camera?

[dmilligan]

People posting about 4K ML video is just click bait. At best they simply "upscaled" regular raw video to 4K, at worst its a bold faced lie meant to get views.

Maximum resolutions are only available with raw recording in crop mode and only can record for a couple of seconds at best.

http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6215.0

[ItsMeLenny]

I know what you mean when you say you've seen videos that have said to be 4K from ML, but it's not 4K from the camera, it's 4K from their video editing program

Which I will explain. This link for reference: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgQ2MOkAZTFHdFFIcFp1d0R5TzVPTVJXOEVyUndteGc&usp=drive_web#gid=5

If you see in crop mode for some cameras the raw resolution can hit "2512x1080". When people debayer that image it comes to a resolution of 2512x1080 with a chroma sub-sampling of 4:4:4, however youtube (and most simple exports of h264) export at 4:2:0 chroma sub sampling. Which means the resolution of the luma (black and white) is 2512x1080, where as the chroma (colour) is half that at 1256x540. So people double their resolution so that their chroma is output at (the native) 2512x1080 where as their luma is stretched to double the size at 5024x2160, giving 4K.

I've done multiple tests with chroma sub-sampling and at HD resolutions (1920x1080) it makes no visual difference (I guess thats on screens that are HD) (so there may be a visual difference on 4K displays). I have noticed differences of 4:2:0 and 4:2:2 at DVD (SD) resolutions. However I've tried 16:8:0 and even with the chroma that tiny, visually there's very little difference, however when it comes to green screen and effects you'd want to be working on 4:4:4 footage.

The 4K upscaled thing is useless even for youtube, as youtubs compression is what really kills videos.

[Kharak]

Only Canon DSLR capable of 4k is 1DC.

It shoots 4k MJEPG and I think its 8 bit 4:2:2.

[sumpm1]

Thanks so much for clearing that up guys. I have been trying to find solid info on this, searching these forums for topics with 4k in the title, and searching google for some of that info. Nice to have it finally answered.

So my giddy dream of trying green screen with that resolution is over haha. I am still interested in getting a lower end Canon DSLR for my project. I have been scouring craigslist for a deal on any of the DSLR models, T2i, t3i, T4i, or T5i that I can use for the recording.

So I guess my "4k resolution questions" are done. I may post another thread about my green scree project, but I don't know if this is the forum to do it. Looks active enough, and I am sure plenty of experienced users in this forum, so probably is a good place to ask about green screen advice.

I guess I can ask right here, if anyone has any advice, I'd appreciate it.

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So I mentioned my use for the camera, mainly for green screen shots. So from what I have seen, the video quality on these DSLR's is super high. So it would seem that it would lend very well to chroma key. Since compression artifacts and smaller sensor sizes ruin a green screen source video.

But if any of you can answer this for me:

I am interested in getting a Canon DSLR JUST for doing my music videos, and they will mostly use a green screen.

Do you think that is a good idea? Are there other cameras (camcorder) in the same price range that would do as well or better?

Thanks.

[Kharak]

You should make a new thread in the appropriate section with an appropriate name for the thread if you want the right users to help you with chroma key questions or any other question for that matter.

Also the moderators here do a lot of work trying to get people to post new threads in the right sections so that the forum is less cluttered. Help them out by posting in the right area.


Try searching in General Help Q&A section: http://magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?board=4.0

Or Shoot Preperations section: http://magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?board=43.0

If you can't find the answer to your question there, I think you could post in the latter of the two, regarding Chroma Key setup.

A recommendation from me for Chroma Key is that you shoot in 14 bit RAW.  h.264 simply can't deal with the outlines of a green screen on your subjects.

[kgv5]

Are there other cameras (camcorder) in the same price range that would do as well or better?

If you have some budget maybe you shoud look for Panasonic GH4 - it records 4K internally with efficient 100 mbit codec. When you add metabones speedbooster MFT-EF you could use canon lens and get APS-C/super 35 sensor size look. The whole thing would cost similar to 5D3 body but its in fact the only resonably priced 4K camera. You have to decide if you prefer great colors with 14bit raw and a ultimate freedom in color grading  - IMO crucial for music videos or want to go just for resolution - totally crisp picture, tons of details, huge reframe abilities, digital punching but colors seems to be decent at most and highly compressed 4:2:0 8 bit codec doesnt give much freedom for color grading (but YT and people on forums say its quite good). I have seen somewhere in youtube that despite 4:2:0 it is very good for green screen.
Personally I am going to stay with raw - after working with it it is so hard to come back to compressed format... And raw workflow is so easy now thanks to ML devs team