Absolute minimum iMac Pro config for trouble free RAW / MLV video processing

[Canon eos m]

Hi All,

I am presently a Windows 8 user and want to marry into the Apple Mac family since I want to use FCP, work with Prores 422 and above; and generally get a better machine.

Wanted to understand the lowest config that I could manage to process MLV/ RAW video files using Adobe CC programs (Premier, AE, Photoshop, FCP, etc.).

The local Apple store here in Singapore advised that the minimum I would need is 16GB RAM, i7 Quad-core, SSD / Flash Drive 256, HDD 1TB and things should be fine.

Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated since I cannot afford to make a mistake on this purchase.

[Oswald]

Make a hackingtosh. You get better performance in lower price.  or windows pc?

[Canon eos m]

I need a laptop. What is a hacking tosh?

[dmilligan]

What is a hacking tosh?

Third party hardware (not from Apple) that has been hacked to run MacOS X. You will run into all kinds of problems if you try to do this, it is not advisable. Hardware from Apple is marked up from equivalent hardware that you could get yourself and assemble, but: Apple only tests their software on their own hardware. This means that it is very robust and stable on Apple hardware, but is completely untested and unstable on anything else. You are paying extra for all the compatibility and stability testing and from Apple.

If you are trying to be cheap or don't want to buy into Apple's walled garden, then you should just avoid MacOS X altogether. Trying to get MacOS to run on non Apple hardware is just kind of silly if you ask me.

To answer your original question:
You don't need anywhere near that kind of spec as an 'absolute minimum' for this. Now, you probably 'should' go with at least something like that if you would like to have somewhat reasonable performance. I can manage (barely) to run Adobe CC programs and process and edit raw on my 2009 iMac (core 2 duo, 4GB ram, hdd), but that doesn't mean it's a pleasant experience (a huge amount of patience is required). I usually use my much newer laptop for this type of stuff.

Something else to consider would be making sure the graphics card is supported by Resolve (or whatever raw processing software you're using) for fast GPU accelerated debayering.

[Canon eos m]

Thanks dmilligan, what I am after is a true Apple laptop that will be adept at handling all the regular renders (non 3D type). I have been told 16GB RAM, i7 quad core, 256 sad should do the trick.

[Audionut]

I held off on a laptop for many years, mainly because every time I used one, it was a slow POS.
Then along came SSDs, GPU processing, and cheap RAM.  And by cheap, I mean, anything that doesn't have an Apple sticker on it.

[romainmenke]

Couple of things that are different with apple than PC.
Only since 2012 do they have USB3 (so don't by a second hand machine from before 2012)

Retina Macbook Pro's are very pretty but you pay a lot of money for a screen.
On the Retina's you cannot change ram, gpu or cpu. So you are forced to buy the highest spec if you want it to last.

SSD as the boot drive do not really speed up your proces.
Buy one or more Thunderbolt SSD drives to use as cache disks. This will make a big difference.
But remember these will only last for about a year if used as a cache disk and then you will see them drop in performance.
SSD suffer from extensive read write (the essence of a cache disk)
This is also the reason why you don't want to use your boot drive as the cache disk.

On the gpu side: -Performance is bad on the retina models because these crappy mobile gpu's have to drive way too many pixels.
                          -Base models don't have discreet gpu's only the built in intel option

On the cpu side: get a high spec I7. having 8 threads that run at about 2.5ghz really does make a difference.

My personal beast is a 2012 macbook pro 15 inch (non retina)
-2.7 ghz I7
-16gb ram
-1gb Vram
-250 gb ssd boot drive
-1TB hard disk for storage (owc second drive bay instead of the dvd player)
-200 gb ssd thunderbolt cache disk.

[Audionut]

SSD as a boot drive will make the overall experience of using the laptop, much much greater though.  You're taking the slowest component in the chain, the HDD, and replacing it with a bundle of joy.

If the Intel GPU is a newer model supping OpenCL, it will be decent enough for video work.  Mobile Intel GPUs are actually useful these days.

[romainmenke]

True on the intel gpu part and the ssd experience part.
But since apple no longer makes the regular macbook pro (only retina), you are forced to choose for a gpu that can not really handle the resolution.
So I would wait another year, next gen gpu's will be better at handling that many pixels.
Or buy a second hand 2012 model.

I'm just thinking about the value for money.
If money was no object, I wouldn't worry about performance on a laptop and buy a high spec apple desktop to do the actual hard work.
Any laptop would then be fine for back-ups and a little work on the go.

long time apple fan boy by the way, but I really don't like the direction apple is going now. The machines are still awesome, but not without compromise.

[Audionut]

I agree with everything.  But I don't understand this part.

you are forced to choose for a gpu that can not really handle the resolution.

Rendering and displaying desktop images, video frames etc, is pretty easy these days.  All mobile GPUs (especially with OpenCL/CUDA) shouldn't break a sweat with these tasks.
On my desktop, I switched from Intel HD2000 (no OpenCL) to an AMD, simply for madVR.

Long time apple hater btw.    I thought about making the switch to Apple once, then I had a look at the upgrade prices. Ouch!

[romainmenke]

Don't switch to apple
I grew up with it so I have no idea how to use a PC. (not that it would be impossible, just used to os x)
But the money I would have saved....

[reddeercity]

There is really no diffrenance between Mac OS & PC system
They do the same job, I mainly work in Mac OSX (MP 1.1 & Mid 2010 MP) for post
work with raw and Use my pc laptop to extact mlv->dng and some a.e. & photoshop work.
SSD's is the best investment you can make on your system. Specially for windows base machine
As there is a swap disk so you need that speed.
CPU speed is not a factor as much any more.
1)fast SSD
2)fast ram & as much as you can install
3)biggest GPU you can get
4)fast external storage raid 0, 5 (USB 3.0, thunderbolt) note Mac support USB 3.0 native
5)CPU i7 good or i5
I listed thing in order, CPU is not that important as it used to be.
So go ahead & buy a Mac book Pro it will last you a long time .
Note* Mac OSX 10.9.1 & FCPX 10.1.1 needs a strong GPU 

[fotogemeinschaft_de]

Macbook and strong rendering: I have read about overheating issues

https://www.google.de/search?q=+Mac+book+Pro+video+processing+overheating+problems&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:de:official&client=firefox-a&channel=sb&gfe_rd=ctrl&ei=E9kxU5-8JcSF8QfswYF4&gws_rd=cr#channel=sb&q=macbook%20overheating%20issues&rls=org.mozilla:de:official

[poromaa]

I am doing all my work on a macbook air 1.7Ghz i7 with 500GB SSD and 8 GB ram. I just started to experiment with filming in RAW and it is possible to work with if using proxies. However, with a dedicated GPU (as in my old iMac) I could run daVinci Resolve (this is unfortunately not possible with current setup).

SSD is the most important thing for fast editing etc.

Prof of concept is that I did everything in this ad on my macbook pro (even the VFX). (Not filmed in raw though)

http://vimeo.com/77954672

[Canon eos m]

I am doing all my work on a macbook air 1.7Ghz i7 with 500GB SSD and 8 GB ram. I just started to experiment with filming in RAW and it is possible to work with if using proxies. However, with a dedicated GPU (as in my old iMac) I could run daVinci Resolve (this is unfortunately not possible with current setup).

SSD is the most important thing for fast editing etc.

Prof of concept is that I did everything in this ad on my macbook pro (even the VFX). (Not filmed in raw though)

http://vimeo.com/77954672

I agree with each and every remark about going the SSD way. This is what I did with my PC. I bought a Dell i3 dual core machine which sucked. Then went to the local store and got an upgrade of the mother board, i5 quad core intel chip, nvidia 660Ti graphics card, 32gb ram, 27 inch Dell monitor (hi res), etc. Things didn't get much better.

I then went and got me a 128gb ssd as the main drive. Ran out of memory and got me another 256gb ssd and then was fine. The machine rocked in performance and still does for general use. However, it struggles when using premier pro cc, after effects cc and some of the raw/ mlv to convertors on my machine. The local PC store told me I need a new i7 eight core processor for a better experience overall.

For now, rendering is a bit difficult for long videos. I did find a workaround by working with proxies and also making sure that I shoot smaller length raw / mlv videos. But all this seems like such a compromise.

I am also taken in by some many of the cinematography ppl that I admire using the Macbookpro with FCP X as their go to combination. It is portable, reliable and easy to master. Take Philip Bloom as an example. He travels so much that his superfast PC as home is just sitting there to be used whereas all his work (including rendering) is most done on his MacBook pro in his hotel room.

All sounded well till I turned up on the Apple store. The machine I want (or rather they propose I buy) is very expensive.

My biggest worry is that these damn things are no upgradable. You are stuck with the configuration you initially order. While that is not so much of an issue, but the fact that I may make a mistake is.

Which is why I started this thread. Before, coming to this forum, I had gone to one of the Mac dedicated forums to gauge the views of other users. The problem is that not many are aware or have used raw/ mlv files for video. 

The other choice I have is to go for another upgrade of my PC with a i7 eight core / new mother board and maybe a new graphics card and a few more SSD's. But see there is the point. The machine is so huge as is. With the i7 and new graphics card, I will need a new and bigger cabinet and then the wires are a mess. Plus, I feel the power that a PC uses vs. what a Macbookpro will use - the Mac will pay for itself in the long run since I will save on power costs. Then the Mac will be mobile, etc., etc. - you get the point.

Last but not the least - imho, there are no other laptop options in the market that can compete with the Macbookpro on quality; and I can continue to use my Adobe cc package on the Macpro without requiring a major platform upgrade.

But all this is how it should be, how I want it.

To conclude,

Can I afford a full spec Macbookpro - NO.
Do I want the Macpro - NO.
Can I afford to upgrade my PC - YES.
Do I want to upgrade my PC - NO.
Should I look for other brand laptops - POSSIBILY

[romainmenke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=meX6UxWtcW8

Just watch this. Neither you nor you're clients will care that you are working on a pc when you get your work done more quickly.
The G7 is cheaper, a whole lot faster and doesn't come with with extra solder added to all the internals