Messages

@Reddeercity, thanks so much! I'll get to testing straight away!

Did you see black borders in my DNG? Or you mean in your own files?

Thank you masc! Then I would suspect that's why exif is showing JPEG for both.

I'm having an issue here too. I don't have an external monitor, and would like to view self shot MLV RAW interviews via usb. Any updates on this?

That is weird! Doesn't ML use a JPEG compression method for making lossless RAW? Is MLV App using it too for lossless DNG? I see that when I open both in ACR, the "JPEG DNG" doesn't show Adobe's RAW profiles in the drop down. Whereas, the second DNG I posted (should be real RAW) DOES have Adobe's RAW profiles available.

So I asked my coworker what his original workflow was. Originally, I asked him to deliver a DNG sequence. He exported a JPG sequence with adjustments from ACR because he felt the DNG's looked "dark." (Probably because the DNG's are previewed in linear gamma on mac?) He then batch converted the adjusted JPGs back to DNG. (He obviously doesn't know the benefits of RAW)

I hate that DNGs can hold raster images. Now ill be skeptical if I'm receiving RAW data or not.

Anyway, after some talking I asked for the original DNG sequence. Below is the original RAW DNG from Canon 5D2. (File size is larger, but still 740kb.)
https://www.mediafire.com/view/lzsxznzy1aq8fjy/M24-2054_1_2020-06-24_0001_C0000_000155.dng/file

Use exiftool or what has already been recommended.
Dng can be lossless raw or even some lossy jpg turned into dng. Too bad you don't take the time to share samples.

Sorry about the late reply! Here is a frame from that sequence!
https://www.mediafire.com/view/ve4pxi7gbd1wtra/M24-2054_1_2020-06-24_0001_C0000_000155.dng/file

Just curious, but 1880 should technically be 8 pixels too much, 1872 pixels should be available.
So if you look real close, pixel peeping, you probably detect a very small border on the left or right, which exists out 8 pixels wide black border.

Just did a test. 5D2, 10/12bit build

Via MLV_lite, at 1880, I did a shot of blue sky, wide open 50mm lens, focused as close as I could. No black borders for me anywhere!
Original DNG here https://www.mediafire.com/view/3e3l87lr0akvjkh/M27-1926_000080.dng/file

And then some pixel peeping screenshots of the sky linked below. 
Top left: https://www.mediafire.com/view/5pui0n2fmvzn1vq/Screen_Shot_2020-06-28_at_11.52.16_AM.png/file
Bottom left: https://www.mediafire.com/view/f6m3hciq32s6gsp/Screen_Shot_2020-06-28_at_11.52.05_AM.png/file
Top right: https://www.mediafire.com/view/3woavny8mjs45k9/Screen_Shot_2020-06-28_at_11.51.44_AM.png/file
Bottom right: https://www.mediafire.com/view/jhs201hbgpiy3bg/Screen_Shot_2020-06-28_at_11.51.54_AM.png/file

@Levas , I have a 5D2 and yes a cr2 is 5616 but the FRSP is 5632 , and there must be some padding in canon firmware .
Also I check the Image dump from my 5D2 & 3x3 raw image is indeed 1880 not 1872 or 1877 as I said ,
there's 3 pixel from somewhere , maybe some padding ?
In the zip file there is 3 files the 3x3 ml raw dump , DNG ,  the converted dng ->.ppm file from exiftool & the converted .ppm -> .png
5D2_True_3x3__Sensor_Size_5-12-2020.zip

Code Select Expand

File Name                       : RAW-001.DNG
Camera Model Name               : Canon EOS 5D Mark II
Software                        : Magic Lantern
Subfile Type                    : Full-resolution Image
Image Width                     : 2040
Image Height                    : 1268
Strip Offsets                   : 33792
Samples Per Pixel               : 1
Rows Per Strip                  : 1268
Strip Byte Counts               : 4526760
X Resolution                    : 180
Y Resolution                    : 180
Default Crop Origin             : 0 0
Default Crop Size               : 1880 1250
Active Area                     : 18 160 1268 2040
Image Size                      : 2040x1268

So if you pixel peep there no missing pixels that I can see .

In the Old Raw_Rec module (pre-2016) We had 1880 wide , before the speed penalty was found in D5 cam .

Found a CR2 and

Code Select Expand

Record Mode                     : CR2
Canon Image Type                : Canon EOS 5D Mark II
Canon Image Width               : 5616
Canon Image Height              : 3744
Raw Jpg Size                    : Large
Cropped Image Width             : 5616
Cropped Image Height            : 3744
Sensor Width                    : 5792
Sensor Height                   : 3804
Sensor Left Border              : 168
Sensor Top Border               : 56
Sensor Right Border             : 5783
Sensor Bottom Border            : 3799
Color Data Version              : 6 (50D/5DmkII)
Exif Image Width                : 5616
Exif Image Height               : 3744
Image Size                      : 5616x3744

Important info about Sensor
Cropped Image Width             : 5616
Cropped Image Height            : 3744
Sensor Width                         : 5792
Sensor Height                        : 3804
Sensor Left Border                 : 168
Sensor Top Border                 : 56
Sensor Right Border               : 5783
Sensor Bottom Border            : 3799

Magic Lantern uses less of a off set 160 compared to canon's 168 and the vertical canon does 58 where ML uses 18 offset
Also I did a OB Zone test here and it's 1880 so
mainly a coding issue . With Crop_Rec it's really a non issue now , with 1x3 , 3x1 etc. .... 

Just curious, but 1880 should technically be 8 pixels too much, 1872 pixels should be available.
So if you look real close, pixel peeping, you probably detect a very small border on the left or right, which exists out 8 pixels wide black border.

Just did a test. 5D2, 10/12bit build

I shot on a tripod, same exposure, lens, etc. Nothing changed but the MLV module.

MLV_rec has a maximum 3x3 resolution width of 1856px.
Original DNG here https://www.mediafire.com/view/6ziy3e7ajobq6we/mlv_rec-1856.dng/file

MLV_lite has a maximum 3x3 resolution width of 1880px.
Original DNG here https://www.mediafire.com/view/taqdx0kfihpvv6a/mlv_lite-1880.dng/file

Looks like the image offset has pixels missing on the right in mlv_rec.
See comparison here https://www.mediafire.com/view/xb7b6yy15k4tkzi/LITE-REC-Comparison.png/file

mlv_lite looks like image offsets are set correctly!

Via MLV_lite, at 1880, I did a shot of blue sky, wide open 50mm lens, focused as close as I could. No black borders for me anywhere! This is cool!
Original DNG here https://www.mediafire.com/view/3e3l87lr0akvjkh/M27-1926_000080.dng/file

And then some pixel peeping screenshots of the sky linked below. 
Top left: https://www.mediafire.com/view/5pui0n2fmvzn1vq/Screen_Shot_2020-06-28_at_11.52.16_AM.png/file
Bottom left: https://www.mediafire.com/view/f6m3hciq32s6gsp/Screen_Shot_2020-06-28_at_11.52.05_AM.png/file
Top right: https://www.mediafire.com/view/3woavny8mjs45k9/Screen_Shot_2020-06-28_at_11.51.44_AM.png/file
Bottom right: https://www.mediafire.com/view/jhs201hbgpiy3bg/Screen_Shot_2020-06-28_at_11.51.54_AM.png/file

No, this is not possible.It can lead to problems with proxy workflows: because the naming might be different, linking could fail."Fast Pass" leaves picture data untouched, while "uncompressed" force exports to uncompressed cDNG where also RAW corrections are applied.

Thanks masc!

1A. So If I don't use a proxy workflow, renaming cDNG sequences after exporting should work fine? There are no cDNG metadata issues with that?
2. To clarify, a "Fast Pass" cDNG export will not include ANY adjustments from the panels?

A few questions here, forgive me! I tried to read as much of this thread as I could!

1. Is there a way to rename DNG sequences in MLV App? (Aside from the current structure?) I like to include the camera model in my file names.
1A. If I rename AFTER exporting to DNG, will this cause any issues? I know there is metadata inside cDNG's, so if the current filename doesn't match the filename it had when exporting, will that cause any issues?
2. What is the export setting "Cinema DNG Fast Pass"? How does it differ from "Cinema DNG Uncompressed?"

Thank you!

Sorry I'm getting so caught up in this! I guess my curiosity gets the best of me! Thanks for all the useful info, and well made points! @reddeercity, the highest 3x3 horizontal resolution in the 10/12bit build is 1856px. Is 1872px available in your experimental Crop_rec build?

It's really nothing, it's less then 1%, it's a non-issue.
In real world, nobody could tell there are 16 pixels missing on the side.

But here some more to think about  :
The 6d can use the whole sensor width, which is 1824 pixels in 3x3 mode.
The 5d2 can do 1856 pixels(without black border) in 3x3 mode.
So 5d2 has 32 pixels more in 3x3 mode...what do you want more pixels nobody will notice, or more field of view nobody will notice 
But there is more, search in google for the real sensor size of the 6d and you will find out it's not 36mm like the 5d2, but slightly smaller, the 6d has an 35.8mm wide sensor 
So we're missing slightly field of view on the full-frame 6d, have you ever heard anyone wine about that, exactly, it's so small, no problem 

But there is another catch here, what we call whole sensor width, is actually whole width of sensor used in photo mode.
But as we know, there are unused pixels on the side of the sensors, the black borders.
Canon 5d2 has a 160 pixels wide black column on the left side and the 6d 'only' has 80 black pixels wide column on the left side...

So if we all sum these up, I think it's fair to say they can both film in full frame a.k.a 1.0 crop factor 

@Levas, Canon markets the 5D2 as 5616px full width/full res for stills. Plus it's black borders are thicker than the 6D's. Can you explain why Canon crops/pads the sensor in standard firmware? Doesn't the padding, and thicker black borders effectively make the 5D2 sensor 35.8mm x 23.9mm? Why would canon add this random padding?

Module tab should only disappear after abnormal shutdown. Debug -> Modules debug -> Load modules after crash OFF (default). 5D2 is among the cams able to harm cam and card if mishandled!

Walter, can you suggest good practices for us 5D2 users, to keep from harming our cameras?

But sometime down the road I could possibly add support for 1880(3x3) in my "Crop_Rec" branch    for mlv_rec module that has audio support
That would be more then likely way down on my priority list .

@reddeercity, thanks so much!

Just some thoughts here, to help me wrap my head around this:

As of now, 1856px (3x3) crops the field of view 1.01x (IE: 50mm equivalent is 50.5mm.) If we could get 1872, we could get a full field of view in 3x3 mode. But would require a resolution increment of 16px. What are the caveats of a smaller resolution increment?

Thank you!! Happy to help in any way needed!

Can this module be used to program EMF/Focus Confirm chips on adapted manual lenses?

Another question. Lol. Sorry!

Does it matter what movie setting is set in normal canon menus for MLV recording if I always use FPS Override?

Thanks so much for the clarification reddeercity!! And thanks for your ongoing development!!

Yes in the old core code with raw_rec module before mlv_rec in 2014 ->2013
read this
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5533.msg37819#msg37819
https://bitbucket.org/hudson/magic-lantern/pull-requests/438/raw-recording-force-line-size-to-be/diff
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5533.msg106668#msg106668
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5533.msg83420#msg83420
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5533.msg55649#msg55649
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5533.msg55404#msg55404

If you like to try it on your 5D2 ML-build_Oct24_orginal_raw.zip
You have to delete all the old file from new builds except the "CROPMKS" folder (but it will work without it)
all you need for modules is  RAW_REC.MO & 5D2_212.SYM plus the AUTOEXEC.BIN in the root of the card .
so you have just 14bit , & 1880 or it can be switched off for just 1872 & 3x crop_mode has 2152 .

So to catch up, ML is "unified" now? In layman's terms, what does that mean exactly (for us non-coders?)

Reddeercity, is 1872px not available because the "unified" code requires 32px increments? Thus forcing us at a max 3x3 binned resolution of 1856?

Maybe the answer to the previous question will answer this one: Any way to get 1872px in the 5D2 nightly build?

(Thanks for answering these questions for us "late-adopters" of ML)

If you shoot with anamorphic glass, you can use the entire 3:2 / 4:3 sensor, what have you.

Personally, I feel that because the entire width of the sensor is always used, lets say from 5D3, 3:2 36x24 sensor. Be it 16:9 or 2:35.1, you have the entire width of the sensor giving that awesome space. It is not "Full" Frame, but its the entire width of it.

EDIT: regarding the anamorphic. Funny, you shoot Full Frame 3:2 sensor with a 1.5x Anamorphic only to squeze it down by 50% and plaster it on a 16:9 screen

Kharak, what do you mean when you say "it is not 'full' frame?" Are you referring to the decrease in vertical resolution of 16:9 and 2.35:1 compared to 3:2? Or are you saying that 36x24mm digital sensors are smaller compared to that of 36x24mm film?

Thanks all for the tips! So I have been using the Magic Lantern RAW Calculator https://rawcalculator.netlify.app/calculator_desktop and I will be purchasing the 5d2 soon!

I see down the page that there is a "Resolution Increment." I will be shooting full frame (1.0x) mostly, and I see that if I select "8px" under the "Resolution Increment," I get the full width binned by 3 at 1880px wide. Whereas if I select "16px" I get 1872px wide.

Can somebody explain a little more about what "Resolution Increment" is, and how it affects the image?

Is 1856px wide the highest res available in full frame mode?

1x and fullframe is different things. If you going to shoot fullframe i can recommed the M3, maybe its still expensice tho idk.

I'm not sure what the confusion always is, but I thought it was standard to talk about crop factor/focal length multiplier 1.0x as full frame. As its commonly used this way with many other photography resources (and in ML menus.) Did you think I meant 1:1? I believe the difference (and correct me if I'm wrong) is a period vs colon ( . ) ( : ) The period is a factor, and the colon is a ratio.

Thanks all for the tips! So I have been using the Magic Lantern RAW Calculator https://rawcalculator.netlify.app/calculator_desktop and I will be purchasing the 5d2 soon once I find a good deal.

I see down the page that there is a "Resolution Increment." I will be shooting full frame (1.0x) mostly, and I see that if I select "8px" under the "Resolution Increment," I get the full width binned by 3 at 1880px wide. Whereas if I select "16px" I get 1872px wide.

Can somebody explain a little more about what "Resolution Increment" is, and how it affects the image?

Thanks Levas!

Yes, probably on a tripod, and no one behind the camera. I can set the camera to auto restart recording again though right? That works for MLV?