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Messages - KMA_WWC

#51
Quote from: a1ex on May 18, 2013, 11:04:55 PM
May I ask you to run this test with the Hoodman card?

http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5471

I'll do it right now, and as soon as I finish I will post it over there.

BTW, I just did one more simple 5min CF card test and writing speed got up to 115.9mb/s reading 133-142mb/s. This IS a crazy fast card. Also , card wasn't empty. It was filled with 5gb file.
#52
Quote from: Hazer on May 18, 2013, 10:01:44 PM
Hi-

Wanted to throw in a quick Mac workflow tip I've been using.  I haven't seen this mentioned yet;  apologies if it has and I missed it:

As you have probably experienced, the raw .dng files produced by raw2dng don't display in Finder/Quicklook, Preview, FCP/FCPX, Motion et al.  The data is there, but the images show up black/blank.  Ater Effects and Photoshop will take them, but if you'd like to use them in other apps, I've discovered that Adobe's DNG Converter utility fixes the problem *without* needing to convert everything to a tiff sequence and step away from raw.  Here's the download link:

http://www.adobe.com/support/downloads/detail.jsp?ftpID=5568

After installing the app, just select all the .dng files for a given clip right in finder and open them.  This will launch DNG Converter.  Hit "Convert" and you'll get a new set of .dng files in the same folder that will work fine in the above applications.  You now can use Quicklook/spacebar in Finder on these new files as usual.  If you have Motion, you can drag them all right into the layers palette and you've got a raw image sequence.  Color correct and export as ProRes.

Note that these are still raw frames and the original image data *appears* unaltered.  I haven't examined in detail so those more knowledeable in this area should take a closer look.  However I think DNG Converter is just re-wrapping them in a more Mac-friendly way.

Thanks!

Thanks for sharing!!! Definitely didn't see that before. I will try to test it out later today and see if its better than current post workflow.
#53
NOTE: This is all my personal opinion, experience and everything comes from my personal tests. You may or may not agree with it, so please no hating.

So, here are my observations from a week of testing different CF cards from different manufactures. All the test were done with latest build.

Komputerbay 128GB 1000X From benchmark tests it was around writing 60-72mb/s

Can record continuously up until 4GB limit in all resolutions before 1920x960, no skipped/dropped frames

1920x960 15-20 seconds of recording then it starts to drop/skip frames

1920x1080 10-15 seconds of recording the in starts to drop/skip frames

1920x1152 less than 5 seconds and then it starts to drop/skip frames

I returned the card since the writing speed is less than advertised.

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3x Komputerbay 64GB 1000x From benchmark test it topped out up to writing 92mb/s

I got them since they are faster than 128gb. Komputerbay tests and other user test prove that. My personal tests too show that they are much faster than 128gb.

Can record continuously up until 4gb limit in all resolutions before 1920x1280 with no dropped/skipped frames.

1920x1280 up to 5 seconds of recording and then it start to drop/skip frames.

Returned all of them since two of the cards failed on me yesterday and third one was about to fail too.

My personal experience and opinion about Komputerbay cards are negative. Those cards in my opinion are the most unreliable cards I've ever used. I will never use them on any professional shoot. I will never buy them again. I'm not the only one btw with this problems. Their cards are all vary in the speeds and not consistent. Their quality check suffer. One can get 128gb with 90mb/s write speed and other can get same card with less than 65mb/s. TRUST ME, you may not get the same results I got.

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SanDisk Extreme Pro 32GB (surprised me a lot) From benchmark tests it topped out up to writing 88mb/s

Can record continuously up until 4gb limit in all resolutions before 1920x1152 with no dropped/skipped frames

1920x1152 10-15 seconds and then it starts to drop/skip frames

Great performances from SanDisk after all tests. It still works great for me. REMEMBER its not 1000x card.

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Now to the winner of all.

Hoodman Steel 1000x 64GB From benchmarks it topped out up to writing 98mb/s SUPER fast. UPD: Writing speed goes up to 116mb/s, which is very impressive.

Can record continuously up until 4gb limit in all resolutions before 1920x1280 with no skipped/dropped frames.

1920x1280 5-8 seconds of recording and then it starts to drop/skip frames.

Out of all cards is by far my most favorite. I also used lexar cards before, but not with raw update. They are the best build quality cards out there (made of steel components). They use ssd technology in them which helps to achieve super fast writing and reading speeds. Also life time of this cards is pretty amazing too.

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Hoodman and SanDisk are great cards that I would recommend to people. I will also test lexar and transcend cards. I'm still amazed by the hoodman card. I'm pretty sure after new builds Hoodman and SanDisk would be able to record for longer periods. That's all I got for now. Hope that helps.
#54
Guys PLEASE STOP asking the same questions here. You are filling the thread with the same questions that were asked before!!! Please read the thread and you'll find the answers to all your questions. I understand its 47 pages, but some of the question been answered a page before, so at least check one page in advance or make a new thread!!! Thank you!
#55
Not trying to be a controversial, but new build is much improved for me.

Here are the results:

Old build May 14:

No drop frames before 1080p
1920x1080 7-9 dropped frames
1920x1152 3-5 seconds of recording and after that drop frames all over the place

New build, today's:
1920x1080 no drop frames at all.
1920x1152 15-20 second of recording/vary

I use SanDisk 32BG Extreme Pro card which performs btw pretty good.
#56
Also found a small bug for a Mac OS app. If there are files with the same naming convention in the same folder, app won't convert it. For example: I have my M0000001.RAW file and when I export a new video/raw file with the same name (it ask me if I want to keep both and I say yes), I get M0000001 2.RAW which won't convert for some reason. Not sure if anyone reported it, but though it could help in the future.
#57
Lourenco, first of all huge thanks for the new build. Just installed it. One question though. Is there any way to change the resolution like in old builds or is it 1080p only? thanks in advance!

UPD: Never mind found it :) thanks
#58
Quote from: platu on May 17, 2013, 01:31:30 AM
A little update regarding the KomputerBay cards...

You may want to avoid recommending the 128GB version of the KomputerBay CF card. Evidence is building that the 128 version had slower real world write speeds than the 64. This prevents 1080p raw recording since the 128 doesn't seem to attain the 83MB/s minimum write required for 1080p raw recording. The 64GB version seems to test at 90+ MB/s write while the 128GB version tests at 60-70 MB/s write.  It turns out that Andrew from EOSHD was using the 64gb variety of the KomputerBay card for his Raw tests, which is why he was able to utilize even greater than 1080p raw without dropped frames.  This is all still unproven but I just returned my 128gb and ordered two 64gb to see for myself.
Hey there! That's what I did today! Check reply #1067
I also noticed that komputerbay tests itself show that 64gb is much faster than 128gb, I don't know how I missed that before buying.
#59
Just returned my Komputerbay 128gb card and ordered 3x 64gb cards. Will be testing it and see if there is any deference between them.

Actually what I realized is that even komputerbay tests show that 64gb is a lot faster than 128gb.
#60
Tried to install new build and I always get "please copy al ML files" even though I did copied everything. Also all the menus are blured and look weird (small blocks). Anyone knows why? I will try to install an old build for now.

UPD: Just to confirm, old build works perfectly. Not sure why new one freaks out.

UPD 2: Looks like in new build missing some fonts etc. will try to fix it now and test it out. Am i the only one who has missing fonts in the new build?
#61
Quote from: platu on May 16, 2013, 12:42:55 AM

I just ordered and received the same CF card as you... the KomputerBay 128gb 1000x CF card and have been running tests with each of the various Raw builds over the last 3 days.  The latest build for 5D3 someone just posted from today seems to be the best in terms of speed... see http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5413.25 (Reply #30).  This includes some small memory tweaks that definitely helped me get a little bit longer runtimes as well as moved me up to the next resolution without dropped frames.

Here has been my experience with the KomputerBay 128 GB 1000x CF card...

For my tests, I tried Global draw turned ON and OFF and there was no significant difference except maybe a second or two extra of recording time but the extra time was not consistent.  So I decided to leave Global Draw = ON (with just peaking and crop marks enabled).


My tests using the ML benchmark utility shows read speeds that range anywhere from 52MB/s to 72MB/s.  Using CrystalDiskMark and ATTO Disk Benchmark, I get similar write speeds so my particular card seems to have a write speed that varies a bit.  I would say the average write speed that I get most of the time is about 65MB/s which is completely in line with the ML benchmarks and the listed speed needed by each resolution listed under the RAW video section of ML.  So I would trust the ML benchmarks and recommended write speeds for each resolution.  I have also confirmed that at least one other person is getting similar write speed using this card.

That said, the buffer/memory tweak Alex made today did have a significant impact when using my card. 

Here are my tests Before today's build...
1920 x 720 or less resolution (no skipped frames for complete 4gb file)
1920 x 840 (no skipped frames for complete 4 gb file)... before today's build, this was the best I could do.
1920 x 900 (no skipped frames for complete 4 gb file)... tweaks added to today's build allowed me to use resolution for first time
1920 x 960 (maybe 10 seconds before frame skipping begins.. unusable beyond that)
1920 x 1080 (maybe 1-2 seconds before frame skipping begins... unusabe beyond that)

After using today's build...
1920 x 900 (no skipped frames for complete 4 gb file) before today's build, I could not use this resolution
1920 x 960 (went from 10 seconds to 20 seconds before frame skipping begins.. unusable beyond that)
1920 x 1080 (went from 1-2 seconds to 5 seconds before frame skipping begins... unusabe beyond that)

So the tweaks made by Alex today have definitely helped so I encourage further memory/buffer optimizations... they are making a difference.

I don't know how EOSHD, Nuemann Films, and Cinema 5D are getting 1080P and greater without dropped frames. They say they are using the same card.  Maybe some of these cards are getting faster write times.  Or maybe they are just getting that resolution for a limited time but a bit longer than me before frame skipping appears.  If any of them can chime in here to clarify, it would helpful for those considering the Komputerbay cards.  This card is by far the most realistic in terms of pricing for the vast majority of people who want to take advantage of this RAW update and plan on using it beyond test videos and personal work.  None of the other cards comes close in terms of price/gb.  The other solutions by Lexar and Toshiba (soon) are more like $650 for 128gb vs $178 or KomputerBay. I'm sure this will eventually change, but that could take a year or longer before cheaper alternatives are available.  But there is no getting around the fact that the less than ideal write speed of these cards may prevent continuous 1080p for some (depending on their particular card?).  But continued memory optimization and other techniques by the ML team may be able to extend 1080p recording from 5 seconds to 30 seconds or possibly more when using this card.  If that can be attained, the vast majority of folks will be able use this resolution in many shooting scenarios, short of documentary or event work.  I do realize that smaller resolutions can be scaled up in post nicely, but I tend to avoid that as do many others I'm sure.

Lastly, on the topic of workflow mentioned above... it's completely worth the time as far as I'm concerned.  The difference is night and day.  There are a lot of test videos coming out now, some of which don't fully capture the quality improvement gained here.  EOSHD, Nuemann Films, and Cinema 5D did great job of showing what's possible.  Just wait until some shorts and features by other skillful DOPs start to appear online.  While I don't love the added work required in post, I find it impossible to go back to H.264 after getting used to the look of my footage now...it's improved that much.

Thank you Alex and team for this... also to g3gg0 who apparently had a huge role in making this particular breakthrough happen.

I feel like you were siting next to me and seeing what I saw :) I have/had same issues like you did. I got my Komputerbay card and the speed vary between 60-72mb/s. I haven't tried the new build yet, but that's what I'm going to do. Hopefully its as good as other people say or at least better.


My personal observation about this whole thing:

I think right now not just everyday, but almost every hour or so there are new improvements in the firmware. I like the fact that most of the bugs can be fixed or worked around. I personally think installation and whole post workflow isn't as hard as some people describe it. It only took me 10min to downgrade from 1.2.1 to 1.1.3 and then install everything needed. Yes, post workflow is time consuming, but overall i think within a certain time that would be worked out too. I really like where everything goes and hope to contribute and help.

Also, I just tested the SanDisk extreme pro 32gb CF card and I was actually able to shoot at 1080p (1920-1080 exact) with that card until it reached 4gb. I had only 9 skipped frames (to be honest not 100% if it skipped any frames at all). Test shows the write speed around 74-88mb/s. Its much faster than my brand new komputerbay 128gb 1000x even though on paper komputerbay supposed to be better. All those test were done with an old build and I'm pretty sure after I install new build it would be much better.

QUESTION: Where do I send/attach the list of bugs I encountered also log infos?