Messages

External monitor will work on the 5D mkII. Just a couple of tips:

-The rectangular guides don't work, its offset, so mask your monitor with tape or transparency.

-To remove the distracting off centered guide use ML grayscale in preview menu. (the image will still be in color via hdmi and no more skewed guides)

-Do not preview your footage with the HDMI monitor attached as your camera will freeze.

One big benefit of raw is the image is all HD even when recording unlike h264 that it will downrez when recording.

Its great for keeping focus. Tip: since raw doesnt burn in profiles, you can crank up sharpness in pic profile for easy focusing, raw doesnt burn in the sharpness unlike h264.

I also have only those problems and am using the given solutions.

In other words: I can confirm, that HDMI and RAW work pretty good together!

He is the my test workflow with cdng's natively as a Image Sequences  in Final Cut Pro X
Then exported to Compressor by XML to 2k mp4 .

If you Select Original Quality that will be true 2k

Very nice!
Did you upscale 1880 or record in crop mode?

Everyone experiencing wrong framing on HDMI can now vote for this issue to be solved:
https://bitbucket.org/hudson/magic-lantern/issue/1582/crop-bars-for-external-smallhd-oled-7-7

HDMI + RAW:
- resolution is 1080p

- no decrease in speed

BUT:
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6432.0
You can activate ML Greyscale to remove the wrong frames on HDMI screen (while still having a colored image).

Also: Here you can vote for this framing issue to be solved:
https://bitbucket.org/hudson/magic-lantern/issue/1582/crop-bars-for-external-smallhd-oled-7-7

A huge problem with external monitors is this:
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6432.0

So, I'm asking everyone, experiencing this problems, to vote for this issue to be solved:
https://bitbucket.org/hudson/magic-lantern/issue/1582/crop-bars-for-external-smallhd-oled-7-7

You may check this post:
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=7054

If you read through, you can find the exact same problem. I even did a short demonstration video of that problem.
But sadly, nothing has changed since...

is the possibility to record past the 4gb limit baked into the ML raw module by default; or do I need to tweak something to make it happen past 4gb? THANKS

Or use RAWMagic if you're on a mac.

Hi,... i was wondering if you can add your problem to this link, it seems there are dozens and dozens of people who started threads and topics about issues with external monitors , but these are all over the place and consequently no one thinks its an issue since they show up only one at a time in this very big haystack of threads. i started a thread at the developpers page addressing it to alex, in the hopes he can make this more priority, there is a vote and a follow option, if you wouldn't mind adding yours there as well, may be alex can then see how many people really do work with external monitors and have a hard time not seeing crop marks the right way and other issues:

https://bitbucket.org/hudson/magic-lantern/issue/1582/crop-bars-for-external-smallhd-oled-7-7

i would really appreciate your effort, may be we can all get together on those many issues with external monitors..

BR
Kuky

+1 for that!

I don't have anything to test with right now since I'm not at home, but do I just drag the .RAW and .R00 file into the program or just the .RAW file? I actually use RAWMagic, I just had no idea it was capable of doing that.

Due to Apple's sandbox system you need to drag all the files. But then it'll work seamlessly 

Is there any way at all to get around the 4gb limit thing?

https://vimeo.com/68473652

That's the only thing I've been able to find with how to deal with that on a Mac. Everything else I see is for Windows. Is this actually the best/only thing I can do?

EDIT: I tried the cat command the person mentioned in the comments so I guess that's a better way to do all of this.

It's even easier:
RAWMagic
This programm creates dng files directly from spanned files. So, you don't need to 'cat' them first!

hello,
this all sounds very interesting..
can anyone please post a link to a 5dmk3 build with the new format.. i am looking forward to test it.
thank you.
sw

What about a look into the very first post in this threat?


By the way: 5D2 support is much appreciated

when you attach an external monitor, choose ML grayscale in preview. no more off centered white rectangle. But images are still in color.

Yeah! Works like a charm! Thanks for the hint

@ a.d.: Would it be possible to deactivate any recording frame as an option?
Actually you can choose between white and black; and I would really like to deaktivate it at all.

That's due to the fact, that I'm recording quite often with an external monitor attached, which makes the frames from ML still useless!
I glued my monitor like most other people do for correct framing as well, here the wrong borders are annoing.

P.S.: Correct frames would be much better than wrong and deactivated ones. But the former should be much easier to implement, I think...

I guess it's problem many people apply to.

Great! And many thanks!

Can't wait to switch completely to the new format.

Also, I was able to recreate a situation where raw2dng deletes files without creating dmgs. Here is a screen recording https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10164102/raw.mov

It's alarming, that raw2dng deletes files at all!
Thus creating the worst of all cases imaginable! The loss of files!
I would consider this as a really dangerous bug!

By the way: Did you ever encounter something like this with RAWMagic?

That depends on the data, the camera outputs on the USB port.
If it has always the same (full) resolution, then there's no drawback in performance.

By the way: I sold my Nexus again, since I don't see any hope, that it will be supported by RAW in the future...

 

@guentergunter
Maybe is because of the 1880 buffer and upscaling (then in-camera H264) that MkII has badder moiré than MkIII?

No. Aliasing (and thus moiré) always any only occurs, when you skip lines.

In other words: Your 5D2 has 5616 columns and 3744 rows (→ 5616 x 3744 = 21026304 pixels total) of arranged silicon semiconductors which by light induce an electric voltage that is then interpreted by some mathematical logic behind to produce an image.

The very problem is, that semiconductors can only detect the intensity of light, but not it's color.
The solution: A Bayer filter!
That means: Every one of those 21026304 pixels, your 5D2 sensor has, consists of four silicon semiconductors.

Let's now imagine a white item in from of a dark background that moves quite slowly in front of your camera. It will then first be detected by e.g. a semiconductor with a green filter, then one with a blue filter and so on. So, it always happens, that an item for a short period of time (and sadly often enough the very moment you shot) only covers half of the arranged four semiconductors which form a pixel.
So, only the green or blue or red semiconductor induces voltage and thus the mathematical logic behind means it's a green or blue or red item.
When the item moves ahead, it will cover more and more pixels completely, but at it's border, it will always just cover parts of pixels, as well.
The logical misinterpretation resulting in those wrong colored pixels at the edge of objects is what is called aliasing.
Moiré is an addition: It means that those pixels form patterns like e.g. colored streaks.


To prevent aliasing, you need to blur the light that reaches your sensor, so that it always fills one pixel completely.
In other words: Every digital camera has a blur filter in addition to the bayer filter in front of it's sensor.
And this only works for just the very resolution the sensor has.
So, when you now record a movie with 1920x1080 pixels from a sensor that has 5616x3744 pixels you have three options:

1) You only take the part in the middle of the sensor that matches your resolution.
→ no more aliasing; but higher crop factor

2a) You only read every second or third or even seldom pixel (= skip pixels/lines).
→ aliasing pops up, since the blur filter doesn't match your resolution anymore; but no higher crop

2b) You still read every second or third or even seldom pixel, but you implement a by voltage controllable variable blur filter.
→ no aliasing and no crop!

3) You take the full image from the sensor and downscale it by software on the fly in the camera before encoding.
→ no aliasing and no crop!


RED as an example uses method 1). That's why decreasing the recorded resolution increases the crop factor.

The 5D3 has one of those crazy by voltage controllable variable blur filters. That's why this camera uses the same sensor size for photos and video (no crop) and has no aliasing.

The 5D2 has none of these solutions from stock, so there is aliasing (in video).
But there's hope: The aliasing filter from mosaic engineering


Any questions left?

[3]

Many pages back, there is a description about what you ask.

The 5D2 encodes the H.264 material directly from an internal RAW-buffer. This RAW buffer is the one ML (=magic lantern) reads and directly saves to the CF card. And this buffer has only those 1880 pixels.
That means: H.264 is also upscaled, but inside the camera! So, you may beleave it's true 1080p, but it isn't!

I would always rather take the 1880 RAW material and upscale it outside the camera. It will always and definitely look better than H.264!

By the way: On the 5D3, this internal RAW buffer is 1080p. So, it's not upscaled to encode H.264. That's also the reason why this cam can save 1080p RAW without crop.

Solucionated! with the new firmware 1.2.1 set mirroring in the menu, and conecct any Monitor via HDMI.

Great feature!
But it's sadly for 5D3 only 

Is anyone else still having problems shooting with an external monitor? Each time I try shooting raw the camera crashes when it finishes recording and must be rebooted.

Do you use a HDMI monitor or an Android device via USB?

So a tablet connected to the USB port is better or worse than an external monitor hooked up t the HDMI out? Can you use it for focusing? Will it provide you with false color, zebras and focus peaking?

Considering that a 7" Lilliput monitor can be had for about $250, is the Nexus worth it as an option?

Zebras and false color are pretty useless on both options (when you record RAW), since they are not computed on raw sensor data (as it's done inside the cam by ML). So, only focus peaking makes sense to be used.
I would say the HDMI is more usable, when it comes to lag time.
But the peaking function on the Lilliput is said to be average at the most. It's much better on e.g. a Nexus, due to much more computing capacity and better algorithms. Also: Apps are possibly expandable with new algorithms, zebras, meters and maybe even RAW-support.

When you plug in a HDMI cable, the internal monitor shuts down. So, if you plan to use a monitor for someone else than the cinematographer (e.g. the director somewhere behind), the cam needs to be equipped with another monitor as well.

At this point, it also want to mention that a Lilliput with a big rechargeable battery lasts 4 hours. So, you would need some more batteries and at of course a recharger.
4 hours is what the Nexus lasts out of the box. And batterie extenders for Tablets/Smartphones are pretty cheap and give you up to 3 complete recharges.


So, if lag time at a second monitor is a decisive argument for you, then you'll need HDMI (with probably two monitors, batteries, etc.).
If it doesn't matter, you're going the cheaper way with even better peaking.
___

BUT: Yet, only the 5D3 supports USB output with RAW video enabled. And I didn't find anything about whether it's possible on other ML-cams or not.
In other words: Is it accessible by software or is it a hardware limitation?

Just curious: when you disable raw video, does the image appear again?

a1ex: Did you ask with a possible solution in mind?

Thanks for your time! I hope there is a way...

My setup doesn't do that. And your lag, is MUCH slower than mine.
Edit: just noticed you're on a 5d2. I'm working with the mark iii

The lag is something I can cope with easily - as long as there is some picture at all.

And since I'm a student, the 5D3 is actually out of my financial reach.

Hmm, I know that the EOS Live is quite slow I have tested it with Canon 5d mkII mkIII
Probably it is 10fps. But is in no way a evf or something.
Better is a HDMI streaming usb stick from Blackmagic with a Windows 8 tablet.

I tried the Note with the Android app and a special cable and it lagged similarily.
However I wonder about the new Nexus 7. Probably it is the same but it hads the capability to give us more fps.

I used the DSLR Controller by Chainfire for monitoring. Within the app, you can set fps to 30. And it looks like that.

The only real downside is a lag of around 0.5 seconds (check my test video above).
So, you're right, I wouldn't use it for framing, especially for fast movements.

But, my 5D2 is too slow for computing peaking while recording raw. This needs to be done outside the cam.
There are two possibilities: Android or an external HD monitor with peaking.

When I compare these two, I prefer Android for two reasons:
- It's much cheaper than a comparable field monitor with internal peaking (a used Nexus 7 costs around 100$ at eBay vs. 350$ for a appropriate monitor)
- Since the android device is connected to USB, the internal monitor is still active (so is HDMI) and can be used for framing (no second monitor needed, since internal display is still active!).

I would use this setup for e.g. SteadyCam shots: Framing with internal display (or a cheap SD HDMI monitor) and remote focus pulling from behind by someone else with the Android app and an electronic follow focus.

I hope that it's possible at all and that the effort to make it possible is low enough, so that someone cares beside all the other great developments like e.g. Dual ISO
At least it's an option for everyone else than 5D3 owners (which is, to my knowledge, the only cam with the abbility to use USB combined with raw video).

RAW videos obviously can't be shot with dual ISO, yet. Or am I missing something?

Thank you for testing. Now we know that the 5Diii has something the 5Dii and 50D does not have that enables RAW video output. All the same results on the 50D. Sudden stop/start of video on tablet as soon as RAW module is toggled. All buttons still work.

Maybe it's just enabled/disabled by luck so far - since no one seemed to look at this thoroughly, yet.

WHat a shame, I really had very high hopes to use this on the 5D2 for peaking focus during raw recording, are there any chances there might be a workaround?

I still have very high hopes. At least no one said it's impossible.
To me it looks just like an overlooked setting, which can be fixed!

What do you mean by workaround?