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Messages - Digital Corpus

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Share Your Videos / Canon 7D MLV Tests
« on: April 02, 2020, 03:25:33 PM »
I'm not a film maker. I come from shooting stills. I've had some time recently to play around with RAW video a bit and this is some of what I've shot; I consider them technical tests. Given my background, I used RawTherapee for processing. Some are short clips, some aren't.

Just wanted to extend my own thanks to this app. I come from shooting stills but have always been interested in some motion. ML has definitely had my attention since the first April first announcement introducing RAW video. Recently due to some abundance of time, I've been playing with it again and this app in conjunction with RawTherapee have been an interesting journey. Granted I've only used MLV App to export DNG files, but still, thank you for the work on it.

Feature Requests / Re: Better Image Quality
« on: August 12, 2013, 07:59:48 AM »
check this link

read advantages of Nikon D90 and see line no 3. and then let me know what they mean by this picture quality.?
To reply or not to reply, that is the question...

Let me say this. My day job is a supervisor in a photography department where we have 45-60 Nikon D90 cameras in operation in a given day. I was lucky enough to be the predominant influence as to how these cameras are configured for getting the best, out-of-the-box image quality possible. That being said, we haven't needed to change that configuration after a few years of deployment.

Now guess what? I'd rather drop kick the camera into oblivion after chopping it up with a hatchet, feeding it to a wood chipper, and then milling it into a fine powder. I cannot stand the functionality, performance, or image quality from the camera.

As a full disclosure, I own a Canon 20D, 30D, and 7D with the Tokina 11-16, Canon 17-55 F/2.8 IS, Canon 70-200 F/4 non-IS. There are 2 features I wish I had from the Nikon firmware that have significant use and no equal on the aforementioned Canon cameras. However, to each their own and use the best tool for the job.

I've shot a few misc assignments on RAW with the D90 and I have less latitude than my 30D. The performance of the D90 is crippled when the battery percentage is at 60% or below which causes additional shutter lag when taking a photo. Despite being in Manual, you have to wait for the metering timeout in order to change the exposure after a half-shutter press, which is an asinine limitation as well. Furthermore, shutter speeds are supposed to be 'intuitive' where one goes from 2 seconds, 1.6", 1.3", 1". But when you change to fractional seconds the '1.3', '1.6', '2', and then '2.5' don't make sense to the average person whereas 0.8", 0. 6", 0.5", and 0.4" do make logical sense. Oh, and the body like to over expose by 1/3 of a stop under normal circumstance and 2/3rds if you have active d-lighting on at normal or higher. The latter of which we've compensated for, btw.

All of that said, I'll mirror the same sentiments that the others have mentioned previously:
  • buy glass
  • learn to take good pictures
  • the body doesn't matter that much.

I hate the D90, but it works for what we do and it's sufficient for the average Joe.

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: August 06, 2013, 12:02:05 PM »
I do live in SoCal, and was considering purchasing one.  It would be great to test drive one.  How effective is it in the raw files?
My presence here is just to follow where things are. I have an embedded solutions electronics project, day job, automotive work, and LifeĀ® that consume my time. As such I haven't had a chance to try RAW. Hit me up via a PM if you're serious about borrowing and we'll see what we can do.

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: August 05, 2013, 08:27:01 AM »
Try putting the sharpening to zero, ACR always pushes the sharpness amount to 25.  Are you seeing this pattern when pixel peeping?
Video in the 7D is done not just through line skipping but pixel binning as well according to the release information. This is what is responsible for the grid like pattern. You need the VAF-7D. If either of you were local to SoCal, I'd consider loaning it out to you as I own one.

If I got off my arse and compiled a 7D copy from the repo, I'd host it. I have no time for extra projects though and this would fall into that category. Hosting isn't a problem when I've pushed through 1 TB in 3 weeks off my home connection and Verizon hasn't cared...

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: May 25, 2013, 10:11:29 AM »
Yes sir, video and audio data rates have always been measured in bits hence CBR (constant bit rate, and High bit rate)
It's not necessarily audio and video. Its more the simple detail that it's a data rate. It's reduced down to bit for terms of how the controllers/processors interact, i.e. on a bit level. Storage is where bytes will come into play. Yes, we are still dealing with video in this context with RAW, but our storage devices for this medium are listed in the "X" notation for speed and MB/sec as well. As such, it's simpler for cmparing a RAW speed to teh card speed by using MB/sec instead of Mbps.

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: May 25, 2013, 10:03:48 AM »
24bit @ 1080i @ 30fps :24*1920*1080*30=1.49 Gbps.
24bit @ 1080p @ 60fps :24*1920*1080*60=2.98 Gbps.

1080i @ 60 fps == 1080p @ 30 fps, fyi. Interlaced means that there are half as many rows.

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: May 25, 2013, 10:01:34 AM »
Your error was in notation. Upper case 'B' is bytes, lower case 'b' is in bits.

g3gg0 does plan on returning back to the 7D's development, but his focus lies on the RAW video development and regular life (I assume). Right now ML is running off of the slave CPU in the 7D. As far as he can tell, now RAW stream touches the slave. So, for the time being, maybe until the end of time, we will not have RAW video. However, we will get a good copy of ML. In earlier tests I've recorded 220+ Mbps h.264 video with CRB 20 on my Samsung 16 GB cards.

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: May 24, 2013, 06:13:18 AM »
Although the 7D can record to UDMA7 cards, it seems the speed is limited to UDMA6 cards.

The 1000x cards on 5D3 can write at about 88MB/s, while on the 7d it tops out at about 66MB/s. A tad below the minimum needed for 1080p raw, it seems....

I'm seriously thinking of selling my 7D and get the 5D3 for the raw video...
True, however you should consider this:
1920x1080 @ 24 fps --> 2,073,600 pixels, 14 bits @ 24 fps --> ~83.1 MB/sec
1920x900 @ 24 fps --> 1,728,000 pixels, 14 bits @ 24 fps --> ~69.2 MB/sec
1280x720 @ 60 fps --> 921,600 pixels, 14 bits @ 60 fps --> ~92.3 MB/sec

Drop 14 bit-depth to 12 bit-depth, which is about ~85.7%, and those numbers become:
~71.2, ~59.3, and ~79.1
This is dropping from 16,384 levels per channel to 4,096 levels per channel. In the real world, this is a negigable difference. Now, there will be a difference fropping from 12 bit to 10 bit, 4096 to 1024.

We can reduce the bandwidth a bit more by dropping the resolution and with how sharp and clean RAW is, we can upscale a touch to compensate. Not ideal, but if you have a clean image, there will not be any noticable difference. Let's try 1720x960:
1720x960 @ 24 fps --> 1,651,200 pixels, 12 bits @ 24 fps --> 56.7 MB/sec

This is a ~14% drop in bit-depth, ~11% drop in size, and voila! No one will notice the difference in resolution. You'll miss a focus pull more often than you will miss the resolution.

Now granted, the 7D's semi-unique architecture will make it insanely difficult to crack if we ever get RAW. But if it does, it will not be far behind the 5D3. It'll definately be better than the stock H.264.

Edit: We've had successful 1920x1280 recordings with the 5D3. This is a touch over 100 MB/sec

...CF and SD cards are Flash memory. There is a bit of a principle of Flash memory that *will* affect  your write speeds, and though these memory cards are not what we consider SSD's, they have to abide by the same rules...

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: May 17, 2013, 03:14:59 AM »
I need some help. I'm new to the ML world and learning how this all works.

I have a 7D with the FW 2.0.3
I downloaded the 7D Alpha 2 and pulled the contents onto a CF card and then went through the steps to load it on the camera.
However while it's in the process of loading it seems to stop and gives me the screen that says:

"Ensure a lens is attached. (which there is) Press start start/stop button to activate movie shooting."

The Alpha 2 doesn't seem to have loaded on the camera, or if it did I'm misunderstanding how to access it.

What am I doing wrong? Am I in a wrong setting and am unaware?

I've had no problems loading Alpha 1 or 2 on my 7D. What lens do you have attached? If it is a non-cpu lens, in other words it does not report aperture, focal length, or focus to the camera, then the camera may not know you have a lens attached to it. I cannot speack from experience because I have no such lens.

@platu, glad I can give some insight.

I'll try this new one. It frames fall!

It is on this I was able to record 1920 x 1080 25 fps and 1920 x 1280 25 fps :D
1920x1280 @ 25 fps --> 2,457,600 pixels, 14 bpp @ 25 fps --> 102.5 MB/sec
If it was at 24 fps, you'd only need about 98.4 MB/sec.

As demonstrated by real world testing of 1080p RAW video, on would need a card that performs few extra percent, ~3%-5%, above this number in order to safely record the video without dropped frames.

These are my little tests. The very short edits are because this is how long I can record at 1880x720. You may also notice some jumping too. Of course this is far from perfect.

Recorded on the 5DMKII with DURACELL Pro Photo 600x UDMA 16GB CF card. I think the build I was using was the one from the 13th?

I have ordered a Komputerbay 1000x 32Gb and am hoping that it will improve the situation (reading the posts on here I am glad I chose the 32Gb one instead of the 128Gb)
1880x720 @ 24 fps --> 1,353,600 pixels, 14 bpp @ 24 fsp --> ~54.2 MB/sec
This speed coincides directly with your memory card. That KomputerBay one will do the trick.

I feel like the refactoring lowered write speed somehow.. I'm getting less frames.... either that or the card is getting slower?

Now in photo mode non LV it takes all the memory and you have to turn it off before LV will start.
If you're still having write speed issues, try a low level or full format of the card to see if that helps.

Just consolidating some information here from what I've read as I find this thread highly intoxicating, despite not owning a 5D3.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but a RAW frame will be composed of R, G, & B channels. However since the data is not debayered, R & B are 1/2 the horizontal and vertical resolution of a debayered frame, thus 1/4 of the frame's resolution is color data for either R or B. And since G is twice as pixels than either R or B, it'd consume 1/2 of the frame's resolution is color data. Overall, this add's us to just the pixel count of what a frame is. Now, this is 14-bits per pixel data, 8-bits in a byte, 23.976 fps (simplified to 24 fps for the sake of simplicity), frame_res*14/8*24= datarate in bytes/sec.

If my understanding of the data format is sound then this is what follows so far...

For the 5D3 with the KomputerBay 1000x cards being used, we've seen:
1920x900 @ 24 fps --> 1,728,000 pixels, 14 bpp @ 24 fps --> ~69.2 MB/sec write speed requirement
1920x1080 @ 24 fps --> 2,073,600 pixels, 14 bpp @ 24 fps --> ~83.1 MB/sec write speed requirement
1920x1152 @ 24 fps --> 2,211,840 pixels, 14 bpp @ 24 fps --> ~88.6 MB/sec write speed requirement

For the 600D, the reported card I happened to miss, we've seen:
1280x400 @ 24 fps --> 512,000 pixels, 14 bpp @ 24 fps --> ~20.5 MB/sec write speed
960x540 @ 24 fps --> 518,400 pixels, 14 bpp @ 24 fps --> ~20.76 MB/sec write speed

CF and SD cards are Flash memory. There is a bit of a principle of Flash memory that *will* affect  your write speeds, and though these memory cards are not what we consider SSD's, they have to abide by the same rules.

In order to provide a proper test, also to ensure your CF/SD card wears evenly, which not all manufacturers use or advertise if they have wear leveling, you should format your memory card in a computer with a "Full" format to make sure you get real world results. Initial writes may be faster, but that won't be how the rest of the card performs during the rest of it's life.

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: May 16, 2013, 03:56:55 AM »
We were at a stage where the 7D could not boot ML. One day we may have access to the master ARM chip. Just need another apiphany.

EDIT: Ah, well, UDMA6 goes up to 133 MB/s. Granted the highest regular benchmarks on the 7D I've seen are at ~55MB/sec. It's been a while since I've run a ML benchmark on my cards, but I only have Sandisk's 60MB/s cards.

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: May 16, 2013, 12:19:34 AM »
7D isn't compatible with UDMA 7 cards, so maybe we'll never see full HD raw video working on 7D.   :-*
Um, no...

g3gg0, please continue to develope the 7D firmware. We know you have a life, some people are just impatient. Your work on the 7D has been tremendous and a lot of us want to see it continue.  The rest of us who are quiet probably understand that you're developing the RAW video and that once you get it nailed down, then you'll have more time.

I'd love to see more work on the 7D, and a full version of ML on it if you can make that happen. I hope others agree, since it's been said, but please take your time and develop something great for us. I'd donate again if the options was present.

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: May 14, 2013, 01:43:55 AM »
7D has to be coded... should work tho.

I am eager to see where this leads. Granted out developer here is the one who made the breakthrough. Patience will reward us hopefully :)

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: March 13, 2013, 02:53:48 AM »
Not sure if this has been reported or not but, can anyone confirm this:

With ML on, on video mode, if you zoom in, the exposure shifts about +1eV.

This is highly apparent on the highlights when using cinestyle. Set it so you have a large portion of the frame that almost clip the highlights. (set it so that you clip the highlights at 1x zoom, then go down until it doesn't clip) When you hit zoom, go to the highlights and it will clip.
Go into the ML menu, go to the smilie face prefs and go into the 2nd option, LiveView zoom settings...
Look at your Auto exposure on zoom and Increase SharpContrast.
Hi guys. i noticed that there's an experimental binary (bitrate monster) to play around with bitrates and GOPs,
Since this binary  was released prior to this alpha2 my question is, are these bitrate tweaking possibilities available in alpha 2?
Thanks in advance!
Yes, they are in Alpha 2. You have to enable bitrate hacks in order to use them.

I'm awaiting Alpha 3 :)

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: December 26, 2012, 11:06:27 PM »
Can not confirm that. Beep works.
Double checking this morning and you're correct. Works fine now :\

Archived porting threads / Re: Magic Lantern for 7D alpha 2
« on: December 26, 2012, 12:07:09 PM »
Quick Notes. If I don't make a comment after the feature, that means it seems to work fine and I love it :)

White Balance Manipulation
ISO Manipulation

REC/STBY - Beep doesn't work, We have no Blue LED

Mirror Lockup Tweaks

Follow Focus via Joystick (Bug, with zoom via half shutter, follow focus does not work, will look into further)
Adjustable speed settings

Disabling x5 zoom
Increase SharpContrast (You can see if more so when zoomed in)
LiveView Zooming on Half Shutter
Focus Box Settings
LiveView Power Savings

I know these notes are sparse, but you added oh so much, it's impossible to go through it with a fine tooth comb right now :)

Archived porting threads / Re: First 7D alpha released!
« on: December 12, 2012, 08:53:03 AM »
This is an alpha and has to be re-loaded after each time the camera shuts down. Please search/read the release page... It would have taken less time than registering and waiting for such a reply.

Archived porting threads / Re: First 7D alpha released!
« on: December 11, 2012, 07:34:35 AM »

Thank you again for the hard work you have done. It's good to see that others were able to help out and create a workaround for the shutdown bug. I'm eagerly awaiting that Alpha 2. It's not fair that the 5D MK III is ahead of us in that regard ;). Anyhow, I see commits for the intervalometer and trap focus. What else might you have in store for the next alpha? :p

That's normal. Canon 'could' fix it with a firmware update, and you only need black frame subtraction in a still image to fix it, but alas... I do admit that it is a tad annoying  :-\

Archived porting threads / Re: First 7D alpha released!
« on: November 18, 2012, 11:16:46 PM »
still hunting the nasty shutdown bug.
good luck!

Archived porting threads / Re: First 7D alpha released!
« on: November 15, 2012, 06:07:21 AM »

Anything we can specifically help you with the development of the 7D's ML port?

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