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[Post-processing:]

Post-processing:

These post-processing tools are not developed by ML, other than some reference implementations (raw2dng/mlv_dump), which are command-line tools to keep them simple.

The programs you are talking about are developed by other authors (not by ML devs), so their authors will most likely welcome your feedback.

Recording modules

Judging from user feedback, my impression is that raw_rec is pretty much stable (except for some small quirks), but minimalist (no sound, no metadata), and mlv_rec is still work in progress, has the big advantage of audio recording, but write speeds are a bit inconsistent, and being quite a bit more complex, there are more things likely to break. However, it's designed to be extensible (friendly for future development), which can't be said about the RAW format.

An example regarding extensibility: suppose you may want to do some FPN correction, and for that you need to record optical black data (either complete or summarized somehow) or some sort of bias or dark frames. With the RAW format, you have no other choice but creating external sidecar files. With MLV, you can simply add this optical black data to MLV spec and implement it. The converters that don't know about this new feature will simply ignore it gracefully (this is allowed by the design of MLV format); the ones that do will use this correction data and output better images.

Once mlv_rec will be better in all aspects, raw_rec will most likely go away. For now, my impression is that it isn't there yet, so I still keep the old raw_rec in the nightly builds.

The cause of pink frames is not yet fully understood, and recent versions of mlv_rec were reported to have fewer pink frames at least on 550D. On other cameras, raw_rec may be better, I don't know.

If you report things like one module seems to be more solid during long usage, a useful feedback should include some statistics. For example, say you've recorded a bunch of footage at settings XYZ, and got 15 pink frames out of 12345. Then, say you've changed setting Y and got 30 pink frames out of 1234. This feedback is much better than vague reports about intermittent failures, but providing a way to reproduce a bug is even better.

I use the camera primarily for photos, so I didn't actually use the raw recorders in the last few months.

Probably quite easy, but since the MLV file format is extensible, I don't expect further development on raw_rec (other than maybe some basic maintenance), but anybody is free to give it a try.

I don't exclude a lite version of mlv_rec at some point in the future, rewritten with performance and robustness in mind, rather than feature-completeness. But I'm confident that MLV as file format is here to stay.

First of all thanks for Devs getting involved in this thread , there are answers that I would like to pose.

RAW_REC to me seems pretty stable too, however for the application I need I need sound as I only have 2 people involved in the project I would love to record in RAW.

MLV_REC is conceptually great, however the recording speeds/buffer performance is very up and down. Im working on a cooking show for web distribution 24p is not the look I need at all. the motion blur is too filmic, 30P would be ideal. If card spanning can return to full HD 30p with MLV and MLV_SND I will be a very happy man. I will also feel that ML has achieved a a fully fictional raw video camera with sound, a real video camera so to speak, a complete functional unit to rival video cameras. In post this means I can use Pluraleyes to auto sync external professional sound, reducing post processing time.

Is it too early to say if 30P full HD will be possible?

Is there any way you could explain what is going on with the write speeds to a laymen, Im big on solving problems but just unfortunately not coding ones. I built a shoulder rig to film the show and be able to start and stop recording, and audio recording all while the camera is on my shoulder. I built the rig with the fact a 5D mkiii might not acutaly be the camera to do this project, so the baseplate can be changed and as such the camera. However the canon sensor is amazing and produces superb skin tones and colors in my opinion much better that say a Gh3 or Black Magic (Subjective I know, lets not start another fight here)

I would just love to see this project done on MLV_REC and MLV_SND at 30P does anyone think that is possible in the future?

@Midphase, I have same thoughts exactly! You have very good points that No one will
Address , without being defensive !
All you ever hear is the same BS over & over
How ML is open soure and if you don't like it do it your self etc....
And then the same people will jump all over you when make a suggestion
Or a comment toward the Delveopment of Raw/MLV. To me it seems
There is no direction and if there is , it's known to a FEW Select
People .
And there agian I know everyone will take may comment
Negatively , but it must be said.
I'm absolutely a very big supporter or the ML , if I wasn't
I wouldn't be posting my concerns and be active on the form.
I will have more to say on this topic later on.

Well said, I don't think it is unreasonable to want MLV to function with sound or at 30p.

But at the same time I understand it's not me doing the coding either, so catch 22 on that one.

If this is open source does that mean there is no structural development plan? Or is it even unreasonable to ask that question?

The aggressive nature of posters taking this or that stance reminds me of one of my favorite Einstein quotes

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds"

And here's one free from me;

"If you find yourself arguing with an idiot, you have to ask who the idiot is"

This is something that has confused me greatly, I don't get why the crop mode will do full HD at 30p and 1x mode will not. I'd love to understand why the buffers operate differently under the two modes.

Developers, can you possibly shed some light on this?

very very cool! great idea.

MLV_REC and MLV_SND working on full HD 24p with 25th build and card spanning on. 30p not quite there yet drops after 10-15 seconds

CF and SD Benchmarks are up 5 MB/s for the CF card, looks like the buffers are smoothing out, SD - 18.9MB/s CF - 84.9MB/s

I'll check the footage and sound later today to see if there are any errors

Here's the Benchmarks for a 64Gb Lexar 1066x CF.



The card would not do Full HD at 30p, Member "Markus" got hold of a 1200x Komputerbay that had faster benchmarks than the 1066x and that card would not do Full HD @ 30P.

Quoted data rates and data rates achievable by the camera are different, it's not the card it's the camera that bottlenecks the write speed.

MLV_REC when working will be able to push this further by utilizing and extra 20MB/s write from the SD card (Card Spanning) If I'm correct, that looks like the only possible way that faster data write speeds will be achievable.

Thanks!

Did a quick test today with 1920 x 1080 30p with card spanning on,  managed 15 seconds of footage thats 5 seconds more than yesterday.

With 1920 x 1038 30p I got 25 seconds. much improved., I will play with buffer fill methods later today.

I repeated this with MLV_SND and got 23 Seconds

MLV_SND, Im not sure if this is working the audio meters are not registering any levels when the module is turned on, It did with yesterday build. seems to be working again, ok so temperamental. Ill try to find out what caused it to be on/off.

One question to anyone out there who has experience with card spanning, do you have to set the Canon menu to record to both cards or does ML override that setting and as such it isn't a concern? I currently have the Canon menu set to record to both cards and files are being written to both cards.

I have the same experience. I think it is a error of jumping between buffers thing but I am no programmer. If you turn on Buffer Graph and trie different methods sometimes the buffers aren't nearly full and still a frame skips.
From Cf-only buffers 5 and up, the SD card delays when it starts recording, but when it starts after a second or two a frame is skipped.

Anyways: maybe a new topic with only card spanning results makes the it easier to follow and discuss.

Agreed on buffers, something doesn't seem to be functioning correctly, the code isn't maximizing the potential bandwidth for whatever reason, like yourself I am no programmer but Im happy to test.

Thanks for the the heads up on the 1038, I have 2 CF cards, a Lexar 128Gb 1000X and a Lexar 1066X 64Gb my SD card is a Sandisk Extreme Pro 95MB/s 64GB, Im testing them today.

When I run a quick benchmark on the CF and SD I get:

Lexar 1000X 128 GB

SD 19.8 MB/s
CF 77.5 MB/s

Lexar 1066X  64 GB

SD 19.8 MB/s
CF 76.4 MB/s

My first question is are these results believable? If so that would lead me to believe 96-98 MB/s is a kind of maximum data write achievable even when CF and SD cards are Combined, have we reached maximum bandwidth?

If anyone has achieved higher with earlier builds, Im aware lots has changed recently, this would really interest me and lead me to explore buffer settings etc a bit more

When I use RAW_REC I can, with small hacks on, record 1920 x 1038 30p continuously  at a rate of 99.6-99.8 MB/s with the camera icon green continuously with the Lexar 64Gb 1066x card

With the benchmarks on Markus's Komputerbay 1200x CF much higher than my 1066x Lexar I would think we're close to 1920 x 1080 30p using RAW_REC. That is unless the 100MB/s is a ceiling so to speak.

Card spanning is working 1920x1038 30fps is shooting continuous
Settings: status when recording NONE/Memory Hack ON/Extra hack ON/Buffer Fill 3/CF only 1
Thnx g3gg0!

PS: status when recording DEBUG gives me a around 1300 frames with above settings

Please can you let me know what card and camera you are using. thnx

I just got up here, but I'm going to do some more testing later on today. I need a solution for a one man shoulder rig so the one button press and I can record sound and video would be ideal. I ordered and OKI MC1 to see if that will work with ML, should be here next week.

I also had a thought that once the updates to MLV_REC and MLV_SND get those modules running smoothly maybe a wired remote to the H6 is a viable work around. At least in post plural eyes can sync up the audio to make it manageable, rather that sliding the audio a couple of frames back and forth. I have a project for a short cooking show in a week and wanted to give this rig a go but the stability has me a little worried, however the possibility of raw and good sound also has me excited lol

ill post a pic of the rig later it looks like a cross between a transformer and a shoulder mount missile launcher lol

What are your settings on SMPTE? I have mine at 50 and the gain dial on the H6 set accordingly to hit 0db, I ask as I didn't have the sound bleed. Are you muting the channel the SMPTE goes into in the H6 Mixer?

Also have you checked with the Raw_Rec Module?

Thanks for the heads up. I've been playing about with the SMPTE module and have managed to get it to start recording but when I stop recording it doesn't stop the signal and audio recording continues. I'm going to continue reading the posts and see if I can work out why the SMPTE module isn't turning off the signal. Have to say though I feel pretty close to having a solution, the image has always been awesome with raw. I'm excited to getting an audio solution working.

If MLC_SND and MLV_REC return to functioning solidly, syncing the audio from the H6 with pluraleyes would be sweet. I've built a nice shoulder rig with Zacuto half cage, QR Shoulder pad, Tornado and Z-drive, AXIS mount and EVF. Getting this working would complete the deal for me. Stunning Image and Sound, job done. time to film.....

Hi, I'm no expert on this, but I was just playing about with my 5d mkiii using the MLV and MLV_SND module.

Would it be possible to trigger the Zoom H6 recorder from the internal mic now that we have sound?

As I say I'm no expert but Im happy to try ideas out and feedback results.

Thank's, Awesome!

Has anyone succeeded in getting card spanning to work? reading back through earlier posts it was working and now doesn't seem to be working, see previous page.

I tested it using 1080 30p and can't get over 10 seconds, when I look at the files on the cards the SD card only has extremely small file saved, it seems to be writing to the CF fine.

Im using a 5d Mkiii with 128Gb Lexar 1000x CF and 64 Gb Sandisk Extreme Pro SD and yesterdays build

Can you post a benchmark of the camera in MLV REC with MLV SND, in video mode with Global Draw on and then off? 24p and 30p? :-) That would be really good for the community.

The results from playback are pretty much meaningless.  I'd be interested in those results.  But 1050 KB 128gb isn't fast enough for MLV with Sound but my 64gb 1000x KB card is perfect.

Second that, I just found out today that the 128Gb Lexar 1000x  won't do mlv + mlv_snd.

wow you have been busy! saw you were playing about with the 1.2.3 firmware

Just to confirm, the HDMI cable was not inserted when you ran the tests?

I absolutely have to have the cable connected as I use the camera on a shoulder rig with a Zacuto EVF.... hmmm Darn, I was really hoping we would get 30p with the numbers on the the benchmarks, 24p is certainly not to be sniffed at tho.....I like the 256Gb size though if we can sort out the bug of stopped recording Ill get one. Bye bye lexar 1066x its been short and not as sweet as hoped.

@mixmastermike
Wich Model of the Lexar did you get exactly? I was hoping to get good speeds with the new 1066x 128GB Lexar cards...

1066x is 64gb

No kidding, 64 Gb of slower = nearly 300 bucks. I picked up 2 Lexar 1000x 128Gb cards used for $400 and they have done well but I'd love to have some higher frame rates and the 256Gb size is also a no brainer. I wonder if we will ever get full HD 30P..... I guess for now dropping the res slightly won't hurt. Thanks again for posting you results!

Glad I can return the Lexar lol did you buy the Card direct? saw they were like $600 on their website.

thanks,  have you tried the raw_rec module?

Is 1920 x 1080 30p possible with no sound?

The Benchmarks, are much faster than the 1066x Lexar I got yesterday. I was trying to upload the image with imgur.com but I can't get it to work, it just gives me the ? thumbnail.
Thanks for the help on posting the image Markus!

Lexar 1066x CF



Lexar 1000x CF