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Messages - KahL

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Finally began working w/ the 5DIII more and I love it. Shot this in a 2.20:1 aspect for a 2.35:1 crop which worked w/ the 5D's full frame look. A bit of BMPCC mixed in there but mostly 5DIII

As a bonus, the same workflow but for a music video one-week later

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Tragic Lantern / Re: 50D Raw video
« on: February 25, 2014, 01:39:45 AM »
Thanks Andy.

KahL: "I'm also looking into purchasing some super 16 glass to further look into this for the 60D as well." -- can I ask what mount you will be using? I have some C-mount lenses I've had for years, but I can't use them because the lens register distance of a Canon DSLR is too long (44.0mm versus 17.5mm for C-mount).

EDIT: I just saw one of your earlier posts -- you mentioned PL lenses (with a lens register distance of 52.0mm). PL lenses are out of my budget, but I'd be interested to hear how you get on with them.




I've also been looking at b4-mount glass too:

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Tragic Lantern / Re: 50D Raw video
« on: February 25, 2014, 01:26:02 AM »

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Tragic Lantern / Re: 50D Raw video
« on: February 24, 2014, 05:20:00 PM »
I wouldn't want to shoot looking at a 10x magnification. 5x view is just about useable but is still only around 50% of the captured frame size(=2.475x at 1080p dimensions).

Aliasing and moire seem to be getting confused here. The 50D will alias (sometimes badly) in non-crop but is much less in 1:1 crop mode and totally down to pixel size. Moire is rare in crop mode but can happen. Hey, even the ARRI Alexa suffers from it  ;) Moire can only be totally defeated with a huge increase in pixels and a reduction in pixel size but this also has a knock-on effect to low light performance.

Excessive moire can also be down to how you process the DNG files. For extreme cases you really need to use AMaZE debayering (as found in Raw Therapee) or the anti-moire tool in ACR. Aliasing is more difficult to treat. I've tried anti-aliasing plugins but they have minimal positive effect. The only 'ok but not perfect' solution I have found when trying to rescue a 50D shot with bad aliasing is some serious post work, rescaling up to 4k or larger and back to 1080p. This softens the image but reduces aliasing artifacts. You then need to add selective sharpening to enhance areas that are less prone to aliasing and possibly add blur or even do some matte paining to artificially correct a scene. It's a lot of hassle if you're only shooting for fun.

That said, I've found the 50D is actually better than the 7D (which has FPN problems) for raw video and it can just about match the Bolex D16 image. The Black magic Cameras are significantly better but obviously much more expensive than our 5yr old DSLR.

After using 50D raw video for the past 9 months I would offer the following advice:

1) remember the limits of what you are shooting with. Don't expect night vision or 5D Mark III quality. The 50D is somewhere between an S16 and S35 but behaves like Super 16. It has +/- 11 stops of DR (Dx0 tests) but in reality only about 9-10 without excessive noise. However, noise can be cleaned up with Neat Video and can be squeaky clean but retain detail at ISO 1600 with the right settings (i.e. temporal filtering and only reducing noise in the channels that actually have noise).

2) The 50D needs light! It will give exceptional results (considering it's age) if you remember this.

3) Post processing is important. You're shooting raw video so why skimp? If you want fast and easy then shoot H.264 (or, pardon the plug, use Cinelog and a LUT ;) ). It takes some careful steps to even get to a good starting point for grading but it's worth it.

I'll hazard a guess that no matter how bad your shot is, it can probably be cleaned up if you use the appropriate tools for the job but ask yourself first 'is the shot is worth saving?'! Sometimes a re-shoot, after learning how and where aliasing/moire occur in a given situation, is a better option.

This is a fairly good assessment here.
The 50D isn't really a low light monster, but if you're already used to using the cropped s35 sensors then it shouldn't be too much of a problem. If you're creative you can work around it fairly simply.

One point I'd have to say is that the 60D in raw behaves more like s16 film more than the 50D. I've found from comparative tests that the 50D is more like 3-perf s35 film when upscaled to 1080p, while the 60D (at 1152x490) resolves very similarly to s16 film (more so than the DBolex or BMPCC). I'm also looking into purchasing some super 16 glass to further look into this for the 60D as well.

I'm have a blog post about this soon to give some visual comparisons.

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Tragic Lantern / Re: 50D Raw video
« on: February 22, 2014, 11:00:41 PM »
Hey fellas, long time user of the 50D RAW here now.
Wanted to share some still frames from my latest promo project using this system (can we officially call it "digital cinema" at this point now?):

Shot using Zeiss C/Y 50mm 1.7 and Nikkor AI-S 28mm 2.8



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General Help Q&A / Re: CF card nightmare, any help much appreciated
« on: January 19, 2014, 06:11:02 AM »
Soooo this thread was just ignored? NO ONE can help?

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Feature Requests / Re: Lock 180 and 90 Degree Shutter.
« on: October 11, 2013, 06:49:59 AM »
This is actually a REALLY solid idea. I find myself doing the same thing and wishing for a feature such as this.

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Tragic Lantern / Re: 50D and 40D Raw video
« on: October 02, 2013, 04:33:31 PM »
I like the UI text improvements in a great way. It's much more legible for me and for my 2nd Ops too.
A few new projects completed using the 50D latest builds :)

SPLIT SCREEN

C3 THE SCIENCE OF BOXING

THE PASSIVE-AGGRESSIVE LITTLE TOASTER

I love you guys for the development strides you've brought to this community as well as to us filmmakers. It has REALLY brought my work to the next level.

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Raw Video / Re: How to review RAW footage?
« on: September 21, 2013, 11:12:05 AM »
ML raw isn't the best option for those kind of 'time critical' jobs. It's more like shooting on film.

Pretty much.

However, I've found from my experience that because we DO NOT have playback on set/location, the shoots move faster. If anything, the confidence stems from strong performances and the security of "did we get the shot and was it strong enough?", which brings it back to refusing to cut corners- like celluloid film. I enjoy that immensely, really.

"Chimping" on the camera is irritating as hell to me and the last thing we need as Cinematographers are everyone's opinions muddying up the focus on set. All that's need are for the Director to see the image (second monitor in hand), possibly 1st AC for pulling focus and of course the DP himself/herself.

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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: August 27, 2013, 06:00:16 PM »
PROGRESS UPDATE:
I just shot the opening day of the US Open yesterday with a week old build. There was one instance where I couldn't change the exposure in time to film a gigantic screen, so the RAW filming saved my ass in a major way. I can't thank this team enough.

Soon I'll be releasing another fashion film using the 50D and I've made sure to include your logo in the end credits. This has now become a standard w/ my team when using Magic Lantern software overall :)


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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: August 01, 2013, 12:58:21 AM »
Great job Kahl footage looks amazing.  I got a question the low light shots like the one where his seating in a room waiting, and when his walking out to fight was that shot on the 50D?

Yeah it was. I think I stuck to about 1600 ASA for those shots. I'm not a big fan of super high ISO ranges unless it's absolutely required, so I tend to embrace the shadows and express the work with the smaller light sources. I find it gives a lot of personality to the shot rather than blasting to say, 6400 ASA, y'know.

Bah, Cinematography geekery :-p

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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: July 31, 2013, 04:22:56 PM »
So now that the contest is under way, I can finally show this off.
This was shot w/ last month's 50D build (most shots) and also an earlier 60D build. Slo mo was done on 720p video on the 60D as well.
Even in the earlier builds, the color depth, latitude and flexibility was second to none.


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Raw Video / Recovering a RAW file w/ 3 other files refuse to unpack
« on: July 19, 2013, 08:30:13 AM »
So after shooting a music video on the 50D, one scene spanned for more than 3min. or so, which lead to a .RAW chain of 3 files at 9.37GBs. However, for the life of me I cannot get the files to unpack. I've used Rawanizer, raw2dng and raw2cdng with no effect. The other files seem perfectly fine and they've all worked w/o a hit. But, this one actually contains a shot I would need, but cannot recover.

Is there any other way, or should I just cut my losses and leave well enough alone?

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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: July 14, 2013, 08:30:35 AM »
You mean by changing ISO's from ML ISO window?  or its something else?

No, they're the specific magic lantern ISO values (rather than the Canon default ISO adjustments) where you can add + or - values. They're used to decrease noise in the darks w/o compromising the highlights (such as through HL tone priority). It usually works, but in VIDEO. I'm unsure if they have an effect, if any at all in RAW frame recording.

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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: July 14, 2013, 02:07:33 AM »
Great Job Kahl.. real nice images and colors.  Got a question how how did you keep the noise down from the 50D.  Any specific Settings from Canon menu, and ML settings?

Well my usual setting fall in line w/ using magic lantern iso settings by default, but that may not play a part in it at all. Best guess: it's probably how I lit the scenes. Also the dng noise looks more like grain as well, so that could be a factor too.

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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: July 13, 2013, 11:35:11 PM »
Strong results from the latest build as well, guys.
A few frame captures from a comedy short we're in post for, "The Passive Aggressive Little Toaster"





So this now marks the SECOND official production that I've shot totally in Magic Lantern DNG RAW. The Director didn't mind not having playback at all actually. I just gave him a second monitor to manage the shots as if we were shooting on film. Actually it made things FASTER, since the idea of playback from a Producer or anyone else wasn't on the table :-)

*um...can we NOT have playback in the final build, by the way? HAHA*

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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: July 08, 2013, 06:12:51 PM »
Finally finished up the fashion film short that I posted still frames from a few pages back. This was done on a previous build (that kept crashing w/ my DP4 EVF plugged in) and gave some great results. It's fully colored as well, but if I get enough requests, I'll post up the uncolored version from the DPX LOG export (with and w/o the base Kodak LUT).


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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: July 06, 2013, 02:12:52 PM »
nice one!
how did you synch audio? did you have a clapboard?

Somewhat. I used the impromptu hand-clap method on site. I use that often for rushed shots alongside the recorders and it definitely helps.

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Raw Video / Re: 50D - 14bit raw video builds and test results
« on: July 06, 2013, 08:34:19 AM »
Wanted to share my latest piece using the 50D Raw (off of the June 28th build).
80% shot on raw, and slow mo pieces using 60D video.

It's becoming smoother using Davinci Resolve to start things off. The color matching gets a bit cluttered, but w/ a LOG export setup from the Raw sources (along w/ the video filmed in Vision Log), it streamlines things a bit.


GEAR
Shot on Canon 50D w/ Magic Lantern 14bit DNG Raw.
Secondary shots on Canon 60D Raw (Super 16mm grade resolution) and 720p 60fps video (for slo-mo, using VisionColor picture style)

FILM GRAIN provided by VisionColor

LENS
Nikkor AI-S 28mm f2.8

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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: July 06, 2013, 08:32:04 AM »
Wanted to share my latest piece using the 50D Raw (off of the June 28th build).
80% shot on raw, and slow mo pieces using 60D video.

It's becoming smoother using Davinci Resolve to start things off. The color matching gets a bit cluttered, but w/ a LOG export setup from the Raw sources, it streamlines things a bit.


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Raw Video / Re: Turn your RAW footage into LOG
« on: July 06, 2013, 04:00:40 AM »
I can see the reason to do so; totally depends on your workflow.

You can easily have mixed media in the situation. For instance, I will shoot ML Raw for some shots and 60D's 720p 60p for slow motion work. Now if I'm shooting in Vision LOG or Cinestyle LOG for the Video work and mixing w/ the Raw frames, the images will obviously look DRASTICALLY different.

However, if you can covert the Raw files to a LOG profile, it's much easier to work with in post-edit color alongside the LOG-recorded Video clips (unless you're round tripping from the get go, which I don't like to do usually). Your final export would have the Raw and Video files all in a near-even LOG space, ready for a LUT and grade thereafter.

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Raw Video / Re: 60D RAW video - it's working !!!
« on: July 02, 2013, 06:39:17 PM »
Hey guys here's my first video I shot using the raw format:


It was shot in 960x544 and then I output to 1280x720 (psd) from Lightroom and edit in Premiere Pro.

I have a few questions: Are there any simple solution to reducing/eliminating moire and aliasing? I know there's the VAF-60D, but it's way too expensive for me. Can anyone recommend a good efficient workflow? I don't know if my mind can handle going into 50+ folders in Lightroom, white balancing/tweaking them, and playing the waiting game while exporting each into PSD files again.

Thanks

If you have a CUDA based card, then Davinci Resolve Lite is your best friend. Saves a TON of time processing the raw frames.

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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: June 28, 2013, 04:53:24 PM »
Okay guys, so an update.

I just wrapped a commercial shoot w/ the 60D but used the 50D ML RAW for a few interviews. They're brief cuts, but the results were amazing.

As a result, I've purchased a Transcend 128GB 1000x card for full production purposes and wrapped principal for a fashion film short. The results are f'ing STUNNING. This time around I used a Davinci Resolve process to DNxHD 10bit 422>Premiere CS6 edit>LOG DPX esport>AE CS6 color (yes, Resolve would be just as good, but I'm accustomed to the AE workflow right now).

DPX LOG


Grade and texture

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Tragic Lantern / Re: Raw video on 50d and 40d
« on: June 20, 2013, 02:22:42 PM »
I mentioned this in the test thread as well. I got a ton of pink frames during a hot (85-degree) exterior shoot yesterday afternoon (not 1% latest build).
Is this a heat related issue by any chance?


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Raw Video / Re: 50D - 14bit raw video builds and test results
« on: June 20, 2013, 02:14:17 PM »
Alright so during a fashion shoot yesterday, I was getting pink frames all over the place. The last time this happened, I was shooting w/ the 60D in raw as well. Both environments here fairly hot, especially yesterday's ext. shoot. Does heat or battery power have anything to do w/ this? While I was using a full battery, it was a low MAH (about 1400), while the other was 1700 and zero pink frames.

Just trying to narrow this down. Maybe I'm off somehow.


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