Messages

High speed video in 640 x 480 60fps, 120fps ?

Be interesting to see this on the 600d with digital zoom option also available


Q whats the highest frame rate at 640x480 that is attainable in theory ?

Q is high speed video going to get a lot of attention by ML devs in the near future ?

[Snappers of the future will probably be able to take a panorama of a scene or cityscape and turn it into a game map]

Win XP is STILL the second most common desktop OS , it solved most people problems most of the time so its kind of a benchmark product & represents a big landmark in computing and world history....hence the can it play Crysis / can it run windows XP connotation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems

In the future all computer devices of note will be able to run a 'full fat' operating system because they will have 'full fat architecture' Convergence due to the 'network effect' and the near universal desire for plug and play utility.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_effect

The qwertyuiop keyboard and the English language itself are living working examples of this. Neither are efficient as can be yet their 'utility' function is high enough that the 'network effect'  swiftly culls the diversity that naturally occurs in the early stages of ecosystem development.

The drive for universal connectivity and in camera processing will see cameras become more & more like computers over the coming decades.  Magic Lantern and the Game in the OP are among the first tangible signs that this is happening to cameras.  I can see touch screen cameras and touch screen tablets being happy marriage partners for most camera enthusiasts and pros.  It would be very handy to be able to plug your camera into the nearest monitor and have a full fat computer experience at your finger tips. Ok it probably wont be win xp touch ( you never know )  but it will be a full fat operating system that has gone on a healthy diet.


I don't think games for cameras will be huge driver  but photography needs will drive graphics performance and high definition screens so im sure there will be a wealth of games for cameras that follow swiftly in the heels of utility for snappers. Camera screens may well become detachable and wireless. They may well become 'computer tablets' or 'computer phones' in their own right.  You might own half a dozen cameras but only have one or two portable, dockable camera brains.  This would make sense on a practical and economic level.

The install base for win XP is so large that you cannot rule out SP4 or Touch for XP, there are other dev communities out there working on this.  Outside the US and Western Europe XP still has a dominant or very large market share in many countries.  XP on your digital camera is still a distinct possibility once cameras switch to x86 architecture.  Im not sure that ARM & Android climbing up the computational ladder can stop getting squashed by Wintel climbing down the computational ladder. There are Intel CPU's inside most Apple computers and they are starting to Tablets and smartphones too.  Cameras being behind the times probably and low on computing power probably the last consumer devices to get touched by Wintel

If your a gamer and you like some of the older games, chances are you may still being XP as it had better backward compatibility, it being so old :-p

Im sure Android will be the first OS invasion to sweep across cameraland. Windows something may well be the second and last invasion of camera land. Both these architectures and ecosystems have a huge legacy and back catalog of games. Pacaman, Doom & Angry birds cant be too far away from yer tilt n swivel screen...bring on the fun !

Snappers of the future will probably be able to take a panorama of a scene or cityscape and turn it into a game map
and do so at the  click of a button. Now there's an idea thats not so mad !...I wonder if ML 9.0 will support that ?


There are those who code and those who click and those who figure out the future long before it arrives

Drizzle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drizzle_%28image_processing%29

I mostly work with Bitmaps for the vision project.  Not sure why Cameras don't export pictures as BMPS as they are a no fuss halfway house quality wise.  (Jpeg, BMP, RAW ) Jpeg is like MP3 , losing valuable data . I tend to work with simple uncompressed formats like BMP's & WAV

The techniques and software that i use lean more towards astronomy than stills photography but its a different kettle of fish.  I build eyes capable of reverse engineering reality (for machine minds, not human ones), whereas a camera, though eye like,  tries to recreate a photonic reality for human eyes.

There is a lot of cross over of course but the details differ. I have to very deeply process still images in less than 1/10th of a second. Optical flow,feature extraction & recognition, motion detection, horizon detection, pillar tracking,  multi axis orientation etc as you have to compensate and co ordinate eye,head,body and walking motion. Trying to figure whats moving, you, the environment or both !...imagine skidding on a banana while skateboarding on a train at night and in the middle of a thunderstorm. That about sums the complexity my vision system has to cope with unaided. Crisp packet toilet roll lenses are what i do in my tea break.

Im just as likely to reach for a biology book as a physics book. I guess that marks the difference between an android eye and a camera. There is some amazing potential in computational photography and the fields reinforce each other. I find the whole field of computational imaging fascinating. Bandwidth and lack of control over the cameras systemic issues i have to contend with.  One main  goal is to capture & deeply process 10 megapixel stills (BMP's) @ 100fps.   That's a gigabyte+  each second.... so  its not exactly kiddie stuff & requires a network of a dozen computers to carry it out in realtime...lets just say i no longer need central heating, air conditioning is now on my xmas list 

Edge detection. Similar to Focus peaking
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8e/EdgeDetectionMathematica.png


Im a big fan of getting UI/UX right, it makes all the difference especially in computer games another area of interest. Have LAN will play.

A lot of people use an external microphone with a splitter to monitor the sound via headphones
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7dZO-myHP4

ZOOM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnJ1Bab9Pao

While  its extra money and hassle it does give you much better audio quality as the external mic is powered. Not all external microphone widgets have a headphone monitor jack.  Im looking into this right now and i will be going down the external mic route for  headphone monitoring  of my canon 600d T3i

[This is some pretty crazy stuff !]

This is some pretty crazy stuff ! Photography in 2050ad is gonna leave our eyebrows with purple fringing, lol

More computational photography. Object recognition allows you to apply HDR or tones to objects in the picture & much more besides.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8ukJuezF0w

Phase-Based Video Motion Processing.  Make a great Easter egg for Magic Lantern ? , ,  more groovy than 'the snowstorm'   
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7ZQ-FG7Nvw

Light field
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q26mekrMoaY

[C]

Its the calibration bit which is tedious and probably why such techniques aren't used to their fullest by field photographers.

Here again greater general computation power can automate many of the steps 'intelligently' will prolly be a couple of years before techniques start to shine through to the consumer showroom. The switch to F1 lens will be a big gain, itz crazy how much light complex DSLR lenses throw away. You cant correct film easily in the dark room so in the past focus was on good glass.



Working on a fun project right now. Stuffing a crisp packet down a cardboard toilet roll tube and using that as a lens. Just like astronomers i work in abysmal light and field conditions. Stress testing to the extreme all in a days work. Ill also be making some 100% plastic lenses for my cannon 600d, just for kicks. I need some lenses anyway but don't fancy shelling out the $ they ask. The challenge here is to make cheap lenses even cheaper than old cheap second hand lenses but just as good or even better pic quality wise.

Now computation has become cheap enough and portable enough (thanks in part to lipos) it is now feasible to start building 'the ultimate' Computerised camera. 

Photographers really yearn for 'quality' but 'camera users' want utility.  So i think we will see cheap,light plastic lens+computation take off big time. When it comes to video, your minds eye does a lot of post processing. This is why early TV didn't have to wait until Full HD to be successful.  320x240 pixels pleasant enough to watch for casual viewing & 640x480 quite watchable.

[Interesting article on lens correction]

When i get time ill prolly write some for the 600d, not high on my list right now.

Im not a photographer but i design test and build vision systems (androids)  so there is some crossover.  I have a room full of computers at my disposal so processing power is not an issue. Im experimenting with wide angles lenses, fish eye lenses and mirrors at the moment.  The field of view of most lenses is far less than what i need.

DSLRs have such a low frame rate for stills they are unusable for the kind of projects im working on where you need to take 10 to 120fps in low light conditions. Which is why i currently need a room full of computers.

Interesting article on lens correction
http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/lens-corrections.htm

DSLR's are fine for photography, intermittent taking of stills but they have yet to come to terms with video or computing. So there are a lot of barriers in their way still. Webcams are plug n play, smart phones have powerful generic CPU's and PC like architecture.

I did a lot of home work before i bought the 600d, its ok i can live with it but its like a museum piece,  18th century tech badly blended with 21st century tech.  Having lived through the early days of computing its kind of funny seeing digital cameras go through infant school. Photography in the future will be as easy as shaking yer tic tacs !

Cameras of the future will be 50% battery by weight and they will posses immense parallel computation power. At some stage they will exceed the power of a typical surfers desktop. They will be liquid cooled and the lens glass probably made out of cheap lightweight plastic similar to the vid in the OP.  Something else will change, you wont have to try and keep the camera still, there will probably be a vibration device built into the camera to make it shake. This will be the sensors oscillating in order to gather more light and information. Invisible nano pulse lasers will assist with focus and rang-finding. Press the shutter and the ultra light plastic lens will prolly retract & recoil like a gun. You might even see compound eye type lenses further down the line.

One can imagine the inverse of this tech making its way into cameras.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOsibeDX8jM


How to Shoot 4K Video with the Galaxy Note 3

did i mention the trouble with Hubble ? i think i did

Lens correction is often used by astronomers, nothing stopping DSLR users from setting up calibration tests or even writing their own lens correction code. Ive done that myself for several projects.

Its good to see that Canon have included some basic lens correction features with the bundled software.

Digital Photography is about to undergo a major revolution.  A few more doublings of sensor size/pixel density and CPU power and the barn doors get kicked open.

thanks for spelling out your setup

Remote control & twin hdmi inputs  for the win

...scope in on my xmas list

I have a 600d and id like to be able to use it as a 'webcam'

Its a shame Canon doesn't provide all the software you need im kind of wary about installing some of the stuff you see on the web.

Ive only just got my 600d so im not sure of all the options available. I cant seem to throw the EOS utility full screen either. A tad annoying.



If you wanted to demo the camera itself ? then you could just set up a webcam and point it at the camera / camera screen.  Plenty of web cam apps throw full screen. (The app bundled with the webcam is bound too)  Not sure if this would solve your particular problem. If you used an HD webcam the picture quality loss will be fairly low, the light from the cannon screen quite bright and easily captured by the webcam and you can lock down the exposure settings on the webcam for WYSIWYG

Going down this route you would have also have full control of the Canon Camera and not the limited control handed out by the EOS utility. You could even mount both cameras to a board.

If its stupid and it works its not stupid.

[3 seconds is a long exposure time, taking a video clip and using frame stacking might work best]

In theory the best approach would be to log the time and location that each pixel became saturated or exceeded a certain threshold.

Photons over time (graph) on a per pixel basis.

The limitations are likely to be what the hardware can or cannot do. The hardware limitations dictating the software approach.


If the operation of the camera was known well enough then one could write PC software specifically for that model to compensate for its 'known idiosyncrasies'  That approach might be more attack-able and more fruitful for coders more experienced with  computer software than camera hardware.


3 seconds is a long exposure time, taking a video clip and using frame stacking might work best

If the iso, color balance, aperture whatever was altered during the recording then you have a big bucket of data that is broad and deep in terms of 'information'


1) Most cameras take video at 24 to 60fps

2) Most good cameras can alter settings while recording video ( think settings sweep)

3) Having saved the video clip to SD card it may well be possible to write an In camera frame stacking and alignment app to process that video. Off cam always better, in cam often more convenient....in camera video frame stacking and stitching would be a sweet feature indeed !...360 degree HDR panorama anyone  ?

Take a few video clips and import them into the carious video stacking software apps out there. Get a feel for  that method. Stacking Video is the future, and it always was going to be the future and will remain so until stills can be stacked at 1000fps





Waterfall problem.

You could perhaps write a script to take a single still at high shutter speed and then record video afterwards.  The still then acts as a mask. The background is then stacked and then the still 'mask' is filled in using the sifted data from frame stacking.  This is one way to freeze frame fast changing /moving objects yet still apply high levels of detail to the non moving background and some missing information to the changing/moving objects.

Hi speed shutter still (freeze frame) +

Slow shutter blurred (masking aid  for the frozen frame) +

video clip (HDR background and freeze frame after fill )+

Calibration tables based on camera settings, fine tuned with the HDR data for that specific shot




Reminds me of the Heisenberg uncertainty principle.

One cannot know the precise location and the precise colour of a given pixel ....the above is a partial workaround


Here the fast frame and the slow frame gives the precise location of fast changing pixels (the mask) and the HDR video stacking gives you extra colour information about fast changing pixels as well as an HDR backdrop. You cant solve the unsolvable but you can figure out the best fudges.

Its not quite the same.

If a camera is 'optimized' for digital zoom there are numerous hardware and software tricks one can deploy to maximize the quality.

Faster sampling rates of the central sensor area, using the boundary of the image capture area for stabilization etc etc and generally throwing the full weight of processing power at a smaller data stream aka Munching down hard.  Over clocking and over sampling becomes possible too as your only pushing part of the sensor and supporting hardware chain.  Off the shelf silicon typically runs at clocks speeds 15% below their maximum potential. If you have access to those clocks then that extra potential can be tapped into.

As cameras get more sophisticated their will be a shift to more generalized architecture, be a lot easier to write software hacks when that happens.


Q is there a list of Canons that can do digital zoom for stills ?  Be nice to know whats out there.

With video becoming a must have feature, or at least a top selling point this will drive the need for much faster processors and bandwidth pipelines.  Its a bit like how computer games drove the development of graphics and sound cards.

Talking of bandwidth i actually crashed my computer yesterday BSOD trying to play a 4k video taken by a Smart phone.

Things are moving fast, give it another 5 years and most of the video related kinks will be ironed out....bit frustrating but i guess thats just the way it is. Solving 'Video' is an order of magnitude more difficult than solving Still pics. Start saving the pennies i guess.

Fast SD cards will help, but we are only talking by a few % if the bottleneck is further upstream and if the SD card is already twice the speed

Cache sizes are also important

Found this link
http://a1ex.magiclantern.fm/bleeding-edge/raw/raw-chart.png

Not an easy hack-around if there is no drop in physical substitute for the bottleneck controller.

Hardware to Hardware handshaking and protocols might be inflexible...bit stuffed in that case.

Need a detailed schematic of the data chain in order to have a more meaningful discussion, schematic of the specific hardware in question.

Over volting and overclocking can squeeze a double digit % increases if they are applicable. Heat and reliability can be an issue.

[SD Host Controller. SD Standards]

Ive been looking into camera hardware. I know next to nothing about digital cameras apart form the fact they suck to the power n but i know a great deal about computers,  imaging and physics related stuff. They are complex tricky devices for sure. A lot to squeeze into a small space. Engineering / repairman's nightmare but id so love to do a kick starter campaign 'Digital photography solved'  cos there is a huge gulf between where we are at now and where 'we could and should be', as a consumer, designer and engineer, its driving me bonkers !

You cant make a silk purse out of a sows ear, so despite the large number of owners of camera X advances in the hardware tech is likely to outpace most hardware hackers efforts. Software hackers having an easier time in general.

canon 600d disassembly
http://ghonis2.ho8.com/600Dreinstallsteps1a.html

Point of interest, i actually bought  a 100mbs class 10 U1 SDHC card before i decided what camera to get, there are faster cards than that.  A fast card you buy today would solve many speed issues. Very high frame rate video still going to be an issue though if its also at high resolution.


Panasonic Lumix DMC-GH3 . The GH1 and GH2 were hacked. Probably worth reading up on for those interested in the topic.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panasonic_Lumix_DMC-GH3

"It is the first MILC that can record videos with a bit rate of up to 72 megabits per second. That is significantly higher than the specification of AVCHD 2.0 of up to 28 megabits per second, which was released in July 2011 and is used for similar cameras and camcorders.[3]"


Digital movie camera
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_cinematography_cameras

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVCPRO#DVCPRO






SD Host Controller. SD Standards Some cameras now have 2 SD card slots.
https://www.sdcard.org/developers/overview/host_controller/



Q what kind of speeds are needed, reliable and burst speeds ?...solve one bottle neck and you quickly find the next !








Fast Communications.
http://www.astronomiser.co.uk/helpcanon.htm


This is important for a couple of different reasons. If imaging using a PC or laptop and downloading shots as you go, it's preferable to allow the camera a reasonable cool-down time between shots - a warm sensor means an increase in electro-thermal noise or noise caused by heat due to the electronics of the camera. A lot of electronic components heat up when in use (including sensors themselves) and a good idle time between shots (between 30 and 45 seconds depending on ambient temperature) can improve the quality of shots significantly. If a camera's communication electronics is running for half of this time, then heat inside the camera does not dissipate so readily. Secondly, if saving shots to a CF card then later downloading them to your PC, then download can take considerably longer.

The difference between the models is that some use USB1.1 and others use USB2.0. The speed difference is 12Mbps (Mega bits per second) vs 480Mbps - this is 40 times faster, but is a maximum measure of the speed available under the standard and note a true measure of the speed difference. A lot of other factors come into play - other devices attached to the USB bus (even some devices internal to the PC or laptop), the connected device's true maximum (i.e., flash drives have a maximum of about 240Mbps). The whole speed thing is a bit of a minefield - MBps is not the same as Mbps (Mega Bytes vs Mega bits - 8 bits in a Byte so multiply MBps by 8 to give Mbps) and Full-Speed USB is not the same as Hi-Speed - Full-Speed is 12Mbps USB 1.1 and Hi-Speed is USB 2.0. Also 'USB 2.0 Compatible' does not mean that it is USB 2.0. Anyway - this page - http://www.everythingusb.com/usb2/faq.htm - should answer some of your questions.

So, importantly, which camera is what?

    D60 - USB 1.1
    300D - USB 1.1
    10D - USB 1.1
    350D - USB 2.0
    400D - USB 2.0
    450D - USB 2.0
    1000D - USB 2.0
    20D - USB 2.0
    30D - USB 2.0
    40D - USB 2.0

[Its almost like the DSLR makers are scared to include quality digital zooms in case you don't bother buying their expensive lenses ?!?]

even a 4x digital zoom goes a long way with 12 megapixels P&S / Bridge
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fm6DyqSdjG4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mDC2wrGzMA

and when 2x or 4x digital zoom  is combined with 10x or greater optical zoom you really have something

Such a shame the 600d isn't optimized for digital zoom like its baby brother the powershot SX HS 50 or the Fuji HS 50. Id love to see a DSLR 'optimized' to take advantage of this. The win is when you have access to see and capture that zoomed image at the touch of a button.

Cant over come glass limitations but you can process and image stack and get the photons lined up that way. The 600d has about 30x zoom (3xOpt x 10xDigi) with the 18 to 55 crappy kit lens but only in video mode  . This means my much older and much cheaper Fuji 6500FD with its weedy 6megapixel sensor out performs the 600d when zoomed for stills taking as does my old Samsung Video recorder above 10x zoom.

Q do i really want to spend $1000+ on a canon tele lens when i can buy a super zoom camera & get  almost the same results & save $700



Its almost like the DSLR makers are scared to include quality digital zooms in case you don't bother buying their expensive lenses ?!? So buyers are simply buying super zoom bridge compacts and P&S or Crapsui video cameras instead of tele lenses. Not everyone is working for the BBC making wildlife videos...big zoom = big fun + big utility even if the pixel quality wont win awards.

Id love to see Nikons 24 megapixel sensor munch down hard on a 10x digital zoom for stills. Canons 18 megapixel sensor is quite capable of munching too. Just need the right architecture and the will & customers will be happy.

Q how much is a 200x zoom IS/VR lens for a DSLR ? ....even if you could afford it could you even lift it lol

That touch of a button utility is sadly lacking in DSLR land and for no sane reason. Canons own bridge camera has 200x zoom 4x of which is digital and it has IS (image stabilization)

If i was designing cameras for Canon I would make damn sure there was 1 budget DSLR with a crapsui lightweight plastic  superzoom lens and 10x digital zoom built in. Plenty more people would walk past P&S / Camcorder land and pick up an interchangeable camera. Its perfectly possible to make a zoom or macro  lens for $40 bucks even if you gotta resort to plastic, Call it a fun lens whatever. New entrants would rather spend the dosh on a good body and a crapsu lens just to get going. In that particular respect even the kit lenses are overkill as they bump up the cost/entry point for new entrants. > Canon Execs, if you are reading this < google inferior good & opportunity cost < You can add another 10 million customers once you 'get it'

Slightly off topic, but the subject of zoom capability or lack of is highly relevant to the ML team. At least where there is and/or isnt potential for software to help out end users.

The future is all about removing barriers....the moment you step into DSLR land there are half a dozen barriers which simply have no valid right to still be in place.     Zoom issues & Macro Issues two biggies on that list, as are video and sound issues.

[Astronomers take pictures in the most abysmal conditions imaginable.]

Astronomers take pictures in the most abysmal conditions imaginable. They figured out the future long ago.

Computational Photography for the win.....see Hubble deep field image for details !


Step 1 point

Step 2 press button

Step 3 your camera whirs quietly as it stacks a dozen or so frames at a thousand frames per second

Step 4 slowly increase the aperture of your smile as the 'quick preview image' re crystallizes into gigapixel heaven

You could shove a crisp packet into a toilet roll and use it as a lens....for some astronomers that would be a welcome upgrade given the paltry number of photons they have to work with 24/7/365

Landscape Astrophotography and with the right software and hardware the whole thing can be automated
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rydg7JGTAbw



You can also get frame stacking software for video. As many cameras like the 600d can take video at 30 or 60fps if you want to get a good picture of stuff that isn't moving then taking a few seconds of 'shaky hand' video is all the data you need. Frame stacking video turns your budget camera into an EOS MK III annihilator !...heck even a webcam can blow a $10,000 DSLR out of the water via frame stacking video..

Computational photography exchanges photon capture time for money. When you combine frame stacking with focus stacking and HDR stacking then that photo zoom scene in Bladerunner becomes a reality.

Future photographers will simply wave a wand about in the general direction of the subject and 'puter' will do the rest.  Imagine a device the size and shape of a packet of tic tacs.

The future of photography ENJOY !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCO4hO7CQ6A

[The camera's of the future already exist. See the Panasonic GH3 and Sony A99 for details.]

It takes a great deal of skill effort and perseverance to hack into hardware and write software fit for fools to use. (includes self)

Sometimes the doors half open but not enough people are pushing, other times the doors only open an inch and you need to call in the explosives team.

Right now Nikon hardware and end user utility is off the pace and patchy. Its why after much research Nikon, the original brand i had set my eye on ended up being at the bottom of my list. Panasonic and Sony have far more modern offerings than Nikon and Canon. Sony is still using a fixed mirror and thats holding them back, Panasonic using 4/3rds and that's holding them back. Despite this Sony, Panasonic and now Samsung are gobbling up Canon and Nikon turf....remember kodak ?...Nikon's doing a bit of a Kodak right now....so hacker love is much needed but perhaps thin on the ground....Canon's got the longer legs right now.

The future is EVIL, Mirror-less and Video...with touch screen tilt n swivel interfaces, high quality audio & external microphones. In fact processor power will mean you wont need a bag of lenses.

Stills photography will give way to video framestacking type processing....in the not so distant future still pictures, will be live. They will be in essence 'static' HDR video snapshots...that will be the approach for capture and viewing. Call it a Live Photograph if you will.


The camera's of the future already exist. See the Panasonic GH3 and Sony A99 for details.  at least their on the main highway
Magic Lantern + Canon = stranglers playing catchup (trying to make good use of Canons legacy)

Canon and Nikon missed the junction marked the future so their lineups are weaving their way across the dust track back on to the main highway. Only a loyal fan base and an equally long legacy have prevented their extinction....im not using a Nikon or Canon webcam, nor is my smart phone endowed with a Nikon or Canon logo.  Astronomers are forced to hack into 5 year old webcams.

Just like Xerox, Nikon could have owned the future. Chances are it will be those with a history of Video, companies like Panasonic and Sony will be the ones leading the video age...and of course the new kid on the block Samsung !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpMeFh37mCE



I just bought a Canon 600d, but it was by the slimmest of margins. Panasonic GH1, G5,G6 , Sony A57,58,A65 where all higher on my list than the Nikon D3200 and D5200 , those two Nikon's are dinosaurs feature wise. The D5200 doesn't even have exposure simulation...whats the point of having and LCD screen if you don't even have that !

The hacking is as much about playing catch up as it getting to the cutting edge.

Nikon doesn't just need a Hacker group...it needs a new CEO

Im not even gonna buy a second hand Canon fit lens until im sure Cannon is gonna be part of the future & after dropping the digital video zoom on the 650d and 700d im holding my wallet and not holding my breath....im fresh into the market and these truths are what i discovered.  Ive been watching and waiting for almost 10 years now to buy a digital camera 'worthy of the name' ...and i haven't seen one yet for less than $5,000...come to think of it im not sure ive seen one regardless of price ! Crippleware is how one should describe the current ecosystem.



Im not waiting for some wonder breakthru tech to transform the Digital Camera industry....just a breakthrough in common sense!

Because the tech to make a digital camera 'worthy of the name' has mostly been around for several  decades !!! and im still waiting for some company to join all the bits up and make me a whole one.

Can it play Crysis ?

Eventually all non trivial computing devices will be able to run windows XP :-p

Hardware & Software unification in inevitable in a world of networked computational devices....and no one will care whose name is on the tin....that 'it works' is all that is truly important.

The future is probably wintel everywhere....when your too big to screw up you stop becoming a monopoly and become a slave to wider society. I look forward to seeing the start bar 'everywhere' and i don't care whose name is on the tin.




@ OP, Love the VID

Pong we meet again, you've been in my life so long.....since 1972 to be exact....a game you can play on your TV, wow !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHsYjWm8XSI

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pong

a+nother excuse for chimping on the bus





This ALL highlights the fact that DSLR's are 40 years behind where they should be.....yes really !

Canon t3i 600D audio
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7dZO-myHP4

[Catching the Unicorn]

Catching the Unicorn

1) there is probably a bandwidth bottleneck....as in data can only be SENT so fast to the SD card slot/port anyway

2) LiveRam....imagine a stick of DDR3 ram, powered by a battery, aka liveram

3) Create a high speed data cable that terminates in the shape of an SD card ( with appropriate protocol and ID )

In theory data could be sucked out of the camera at several Gigabytes (not bits) a second.

Perhaps a simpler way is to RAID up 2,3,or 4 SD cards....have them suck out the data alternately  in parallel


List of device bit rates
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_device_bit_rates




LiveRam is the ultimate bandwidth  solution. It would be like a class 10,000 SD card :-p

[Im off to Argos to buy a Fuji HS50]

thank you so kindly for your swift reply

Shoots Canon R&D team...10x digital zoom in video for the 600d  but not for stills ?, =  a+nother head implosion brought on by corporate oversight

For sale, 1 week old Canon 600d !

Im off to Argos to buy a Fuji HS50 as 10x or greater 'digital+optical' zoom is an essential feature for me. The most expensive and most modern camera i have ever bought still cannot beat old school pocket cams on basic features and real world usefulness. Go figure!.....i just cannot believe the 600d doesn't have a digital zoom for stills!, every other camera ive ever owned has.




Taking screen shots of zoomed video you can take a screen shot of your 'zoomed in' video but in low light  taking a still and blowing that up will prolly give you better quality. Just tested that on the 600d. However in good light conditions ( tested on other cameras)  digital zoom from video mode can sometimes be better quality than a still 'blown up'

A modern camera with a good sensor will give you around 4x digital zoom quality equivalent when blown up.  If a decent point n shoot camera's 'optical+digital zoom' exceeds that of a DSLRs 'optical zoom' by more than 4x then that point n shoot will often produce better pictures.

Canon DSLR T3i 600D Digital Cropped Video Zoom Test Review Footage
http://vimeo.com/21179340




Common sense dictates that every digital camera should have at least 2x digital zoom, and ideally 10x or infinite digital zoom. Its not just about grabbing that shot from a distance, its also about having a pair of binoculars and a bionic eye at your disposal. More than this, the better the sensor and in cam processing the bigger the digital zoom you can get away with before the image degrades to the extent its not even fit for the web. A camera like the 600d COULD take useful images with a 10x,50x or even a 100x digital zoom in the right conditions....thank you for denying me the obvious Canon !....off to FujiBridgeland i go once again !

I have a T3i  600d , bought this week and installed magic lantern the next day.

Caution ! ...i know a great deal about computers, so i had the confidence and knowledge to give Magic lantern a try, and fix issues if something went wrong....i also watched several hours of video and read up on stuff before i installed the software.

DO READ  the installation instructions  very carefully as you can lock your camera up if you dont.

I strongly advise you to watch a few videos on youtube about magic lantern before you attempt installing.  Video talk is high on the agenda because video is new to DSLR land, but its not just about video options, its about giving greater access to the cameras hardware and software potential.



In answer to your question. Magic lantern has many features that will benefit still photography as well as video.

600d owner

I chose this particular camera over others due to the strength of the software support...Canon EOS utilility and Magic Lantern

I heard about magic lantern through the film making forums and later on youtube where there are several great tutorials.

I have a very very low opinion of DSLR cameras, they are clunky dinosaurs and consumers deserve much better from the big brand names. Someone at Canon has got half a brain and the hardware & software features of the 600d just about scrape a minimum pass. Thanks to all the Magic Lantern developers, version 2.3 while mildly buggy has helped plug some of the gaps that Canon & others should have plugged 10 years ago !

I also have a very low opinion of open source projects in general, too many cooks spoil the broth and lack of enduser focus, software like magic lantern helps restore my faith in humanity....and my end user sanity !


Well done ML dev team and the end users providing essential feedback and testing.




Open Source software i use with some confidence = Magic Lantern, Audacity (Audio) , Desire (astronomy), FreeBasic ( prog lang )

[10X digital zoom on canon 600d , While taking Still Photos, is this possible ?]

10X digital zoom on canon 600d , While taking Still Photos,  is this possible  ? I am using Magic Lantern 2.3

I know you can use a 3x to 10x digital zoom for videos on the 600d but AFAIK (new user)  i cannot take stills using a 10x digital zoom on the canon 600d ( i can press a button and see a zoomed in picture in the live view but it doesn't take what i see)

I am being thick ? (ive spent many hours going through settings etc)  or is this

A not implemented yet on the 600d

B impossible on the 600d

Can some one please put me out of my misery, thanks in advance.


..and yes i know im bumping old thread, photographic newbs use words like digital zoom rather than cropfactor,mock factor whatever so im hoping (praying) that the answer is turn to page xxx