Magic Lantern Forum

Using Magic Lantern => Raw Video => Raw Video Postprocessing => Topic started by: ilia on October 20, 2013, 05:16:22 AM

Title: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: ilia on October 20, 2013, 05:16:22 AM
I recently switched my workflow from After Effects(ACR) to Davinci Resolve 10.  The speed of rendering proxies and the ability to relink and grade the Raw files in Resolve is so much more practical and powerful. What is your preference and why?
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: dude on October 20, 2013, 01:57:49 PM
raw-dng, open via acr in ae. do proxys in ae, safe projekt.
open premiere, import ae sequence.
now you have 16 bit Video in premiere, easy to edit because of the proxies. if you re done, just click next to the proxys in ae to uncheck them for full resolution and bitrate in premiere.
that s the easiest workflow i figured out so far
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: arrinkiiii on October 20, 2013, 02:07:57 PM

I have doing with ACR in after effects and then making the proxy's and edit there, in ae. But im going to try the dude workflow and use premiere, import ae sequence.

I would like to try resolve, yesterday i have install it but need more time to understand it... for working with a good flow.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: vikado on October 20, 2013, 10:57:12 PM
raw-dng, open via acr in ae. do proxys in ae, safe projekt.
open premiere, import ae sequence.
now you have 16 bit Video in premiere, easy to edit because of the proxies. if you re done, just click next to the proxys in ae to uncheck them for full resolution and bitrate in premiere.
that s the easiest workflow i figured out so far
is this the same workflow you're talking about?

Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: Malcolm Debono on October 20, 2013, 11:36:23 PM
I'm round-tripping between Resolve and Premiere (create proxies through Resolve, create rough cut in Premiere, re-link and colour in Resolve, do final corrections, sound mixing etc. in Premiere) as in the following tutorial:

Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: vikado on October 21, 2013, 12:09:27 AM
I'm round-tripping between Resolve and Premiere (create proxies through Resolve, create rough cut in Premiere, re-link and colour in Resolve, do final corrections, sound mixing etc. in Premiere) as in the following tutorial:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jASBwVSOlXk/youtube]

i actually prefer this workflow too, but when i import footage into resolve, i get hot/dead pixels.
but when i import that same footage into After effects/ACR. those hot/dead pixels are gone.
how are you handling dead pixels in that workflow?
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: guilhermemartins on October 21, 2013, 12:37:56 AM
I see a lot of people using resolve, how do you handle your noise reduction? On ACR I get
Useful NR before exporting to tiff and rendering an image sequence to prores or whatever codec I wanna work.

Plus, has anybody experimented with ACR scaling in Photoshop? I usually find it best to export a 3k+ tiff and than downscale to 1080p.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: ilia on October 21, 2013, 03:35:47 AM
I too am getting more hot/dead pixels after importing into Resolve. Hopefully this will be fixed in a future update.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: arrinkiiii on October 21, 2013, 11:15:02 AM
This hot/dead pixels is with resolve 10 lite ??
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: dude on October 21, 2013, 01:15:01 PM
is this the same workflow you're talking about?

No, seems more complicated in this video.
First, check what Andrew says about Proxies: http://www.videocopilot.net/tutorial/proxies_and_workflow_tips/
i have the original dng sequence opened in ae, creating proxies for it, which i can toggle on and of in the explorer.
than open premiere, import ae sequence.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: Malcolm Debono on October 21, 2013, 01:55:28 PM
i actually prefer this workflow too, but when i import footage into resolve, i get hot/dead pixels.
but when i import that same footage into After effects/ACR. those hot/dead pixels are gone.
how are you handling dead pixels in that workflow?

Never encountered any hot/dead pixels so far. I guess that's one benefit of using ACR since it automatically removes them for photos (so that would also apply for image sequences).

Regarding noise reduction, I use Neat Video in Premiere (before exporting the master), and then add a bit of grain through FilmConvert to add some texture.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: hjfilmspeed on October 22, 2013, 02:19:21 AM
I love the detail in acr but hate the wait. forget it if you want to regrade. I love the workflow and speed of resolve but im not impressed with how resolve handles detail. just seems of or pixelish. im not so sure about round tripping the footage as i feel that there are some things that wont transfer correctly from your editor. i hope future software will enable live metadata editing like cineform does but with the power of davinci. that would be sick! or like sony vegas does for red footage. that sounds fun.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: N/A on October 22, 2013, 02:30:38 AM
Convert with Son of Batch, pull the dng's into AE through ACR, adjust wb and apply VisionLOG. Bring footage into AE and run it through Neat Video, do some slight color correction and apply one of the Osiris LOG LUT's, then export to ProRes444. Do the rest of my editing in FCPX.

I've had lots of nice results upscaling the raw footage I'm getting out of the 600d, even going from 720p to 1080p with little to no aliasing.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: Betelgeuza on October 22, 2013, 05:19:25 AM
I recently switched my workflow from After Effects(ACR) to Davinci Resolve 10.  The speed of rendering proxies and the ability to relink and grade the Raw files in Resolve is so much more practical and powerful. What is your preference and why?
u have Canon Dslr ? u must have DPP ..and turst me ..u dont need nothink more for edit RAW file to tiff or jpeg..but ofc u can convert file thousend times if u like

in last year i edited around  12.000 files with DPP ( not including Time lapses )...program is eazy and  there is no problem with editing 100 RAW files in same moment....u can learn basics and later u can jump to PS and realize how eazy is PS ..
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: Betelgeuza on October 22, 2013, 05:21:23 AM
Never encountered any hot/dead pixels so far. I guess that's one benefit of using ACR since it automatically removes them for photos (so that would also apply for image sequences).

Regarding noise reduction, I use Neat Video in Premiere (before exporting the master), and then add a bit of grain through FilmConvert to add some texture.

 all cameras got them...no mater new or dont..u just need to take them out..but those nasty dots are eazy to eliminate..
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: togg on October 22, 2013, 12:07:29 PM
Bring footage into AE and run it through Neat Video
So you do noise reduction before cc and cg. I'm hearing all sort of things about when you should denoise. Someone say to do it at the end, someone else before, someone else for start (after log in ACR ecc). I'm confused : ))
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: dude on October 22, 2013, 01:50:30 PM
Noise Reduction AFTER CC!
From First to last Step:
1st CC: WB,White/ Black Point (levels, kurves,...)
2nd CC: Effects, Colour and stuff
Denoiser
Sharpen

Sidenotes: Do the Colour Correction AFTER doing titles if you want them to fit into the scene.
                  Set a vignette BEFORE the Colour Correction(worst mistake ever, even the tv stations do it wrong..)
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: N/A on October 22, 2013, 02:16:35 PM
Keep in mind that I'm using a 600D, which doesn't quite have the low light capabilities of newer cameras. Also, Neat Video uses a pixel blending method that helps with the aliasing we get with lower rez raw footage. So yeah, slight noise reduction in ACR, sharpening off, Neat Video denoise, maybe some natural grain, THEN cc and lut.

Here's a page about processing h264 straight from the camera, but imo the same thing should apply to lower rez raw footage that's not going to upscale as well.

http://vision-color.com/post-processing/
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: Betelgeuza on October 22, 2013, 02:29:30 PM
what u guys say about Seting GOOD exposure and Forgot about noize  ?!!
.. u knwo what u doing with photo when u removing Bad exposured Noiz from photo ? ..
u lowing sharpnes .. this what u doing later its  making photo looks more `sharpen` .. this is blind circle..
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: dude on October 22, 2013, 07:04:14 PM
I forgot to mention-
exporting dpx in ae is only possible in 10 bit.
really, i tested footage in premiere, one via dynamik link, the other via dpx 10bit and yuvv10 bit- no difference.

you can see this by applying a dramatic curve effect and then watch the rgb parade- a lot of gaps menas 8 bit, at 10 or 16 there are no gaps.

anyway, there is a tool called dpx plus, it s for free and allwos you both to import and export dpx files even in 16 bit in ae and pp !
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: hjfilmspeed on October 22, 2013, 10:01:08 PM
How many frames per second is everyone getting out of arc or lightroom. Im only getting about 1 maybe 2 with a quad core 2.4 and 8 gigs of ram. Resolve spits out like 9 or 10 when rendering. I wish there was more option for dng processing on windows.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: djfremen on October 23, 2013, 04:43:07 AM

Plus, has anybody experimented with ACR scaling in Photoshop? I usually find it best to export a 3k+ tiff and than downscale to 1080p.

Please explain the logic of this. Surely your footage won't become sharper, right?
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: glubber on October 23, 2013, 09:19:58 AM
How many frames per second is everyone getting out of arc or lightroom. Im only getting about 1 maybe 2 with a quad core 2.4 and 8 gigs of ram. Resolve spits out like 9 or 10 when rendering. I wish there was more option for dng processing on windows.

Lightroom only uses the CPU to render while Resolve uses both CPU and GPU (Cuda engine of the Nvidia)
I once rendered 200 CR2 for a timelapse in Lightroom on a DuoCore 3.3 ghz/ 8 GB ram...
it took about 45 minutes and ate up all my pc resources  :(
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: hjfilmspeed on October 23, 2013, 03:39:16 PM
Lightroom only uses the CPU to render while Resolve uses both CPU and GPU (Cuda engine of the Nvidia)
I once rendered 200 CR2 for a timelapse in Lightroom on a DuoCore 3.3 ghz/ 8 GB ram...
it took about 45 minutes and ate up all my pc resources  :(
Soooo frustrating! its a shame because acr or lightroom debayering is just soooo clean!!! like iso 6400 is usable through acr but fagetaboutit in resolve. Davinci is not quite up to par when it comes to dng debayer but it sure is a much faster workflow
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: BrotherD on October 23, 2013, 08:41:54 PM
Davinci Resolve 10 Lite. Color grading and correction is second to none. If I need to get it edited and rendered with the quickness, I'm calling Resolve. AE, PP, FCP, Vegas can do things today that Resolve can't. PP, FCP and Vegas better be very careful... As I look into the future I see having Resolve on your resume as a must. It's professional and free! C'mon man! Resolve is more important to me than a new BMW.

Did you want a technical answer?
 

Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: hjfilmspeed on October 23, 2013, 11:00:30 PM
Davinci Resolve 10 Lite. Color grading and correction is second to none. If I need to get it edited and rendered with the quickness, I'm calling Resolve. AE, PP, FCP, Vegas can do things today that Resolve can't. PP, FCP and Vegas better be very careful... As I look into the future I see having Resolve on your resume as a must. It's professional and free! C'mon man! Resolve is more important to me than a new BMW.

Did you want a technical answer?
What are you shooting on?
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: togg on October 24, 2013, 10:19:49 AM
Noise Reduction AFTER CC!
From First to last Step:
1st CC: WB,White/ Black Point (levels, kurves,...)
2nd CC: Effects, Colour and stuff
Denoiser
Sharpen

Sidenotes: Do the Colour Correction AFTER doing titles if you want them to fit into the scene.
                  Set a vignette BEFORE the Colour Correction(worst mistake ever, even the tv stations do it wrong..)

Thanks a lot! So I was doing it right.
I've never thought about the vignette, this is a useful tip.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: BrotherD on October 24, 2013, 06:55:57 PM
What are you shooting on?
T2i and ML raw.
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: swinxx on October 30, 2013, 06:53:51 PM
why should i apply the vignette before cc? and do you mean primary cc or look cc?
and why denoising after cc and look.?

thx
Title: Re: How are you processing your Raw footage?
Post by: guilhermemartins on November 03, 2013, 09:42:21 PM

Please explain the logic of this. Surely your footage won't become sharper, right?

Slightly! It does. I don't really know why. But when I was running my first raw tests I tried both  exporting 1600x800 tiff than opening in QuickTime 7 and exporting 1080p  with letterbox and exporting an 3k plus tiff and downscaling to 1080 p with letterbox. The latter gives me better results.
My guess is ACR handles upscaling  better than QuickTime, and any video conversion software will handle downscaling better than upscaling.
Does this make any sense to anyone else?