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Showcasing Magic Lantern => Share Your Videos => Topic started by: theBilalFakhouri on September 18, 2018, 10:00:59 AM

Title: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on September 18, 2018, 10:00:59 AM
Original file in Google Drive: Download (https://drive.google.com/open?id=1juv12PM7F1_6J4kh35bJXEG5EPj5_30e)

Shot on 700D:
1504x640 in 3x3 and 1504x1920 in 1x3 downsized to 1504x640 (@ 23.976FPS 2.35:1).
I can shoot up to 1736x736 (1736x2214 in 1x3) 2.35:1 but this requires 80mb/s write speed in 1x3 Binning mode so I reduced the resolution to get more recording times (with sd_uhs).

Aliasing:
There is a little bit of aliasing in some cases (not noticeable) but it's a lot better than normal video in 3x3 without Dual ISO! we can say No aliasing.

This means in our Cameras we have now:
-RAW Video without aliasing and Moire!
-Entire dynamic range which is around 14 Stops!
-No quality loss when using Dual ISO!
-Less noise Better shadows in low light (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg206133#msg206133)!
-Cinema Camera! :D

The problems:
-Very stretched LiveView
-This is require high write speeds (80mb/s in 1736x736 @ 23.976fps 14-bit lossless for 700D).
Solution:
The problems are the write speed now about 80mb/s in 14-bit lossless (1736x736) so no continuous recording but this is the small problem and with some more tries to get higher SD writes speed and using Analog gain to get 10-bit lossless working in increased resolution will become not a big deal.

Annoying one: LiveView is very stretched! you can use ML Framing instead which is slow unfortunately.

How can you try it?
Just wait for the new crop_rec (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg205546#msg205546) to be ported in other cameras and maybe this is easy (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg206047#msg206047), Look at bleeding-edge testing.

Bleeding-edge testing:
700D: Here (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=22818.msg219747#msg219747)
6D:    Here (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=15088.msg206420#msg206420)
5D3:  Here
 (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=22818.msg207368#msg207368)EOS M: Here (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=9741.msg210369#msg210369)

More Details:
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg206040#msg206040
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg206086#msg206086
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg206133#msg206133
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on September 18, 2018, 02:48:44 PM
The +5EV 1x3 dual ISO shot looks amazing. Dude, where's my noise?

Am I imagining things or is the rolling shutter reduced too?

A ML anamorphic stretch should fix the LiveView problem. 

2K 1.5x anamorphic scope (1413x2574) is a slightly lower data rate than 1736x2214 1x3 @80MB/s. 2K 14 stop 5D Mk3 anyone? :D
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: bouncyball on September 19, 2018, 10:43:16 AM
Amazing! You made me respecting DUAL ISO mode for video ;) (really hated this before).

Have to try that out.

Regards
BB
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: togg on September 19, 2018, 02:05:27 PM
This is incredible, thanks so much, also for opening the discussion. It will be easier to follow development here.

Now I'll have to study how to actually post process dual iso, I have no clue if the info are baked into exported dng and work nicelly in Resolve or if you need to export ProRes mmm
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on September 19, 2018, 02:28:45 PM
Now I'll have to study how to actually post process dual iso, I have no clue if the info are baked into exported dng and work nicelly in Resolve or if you need to export ProRes mmm

Nothing to study here.  Just use the latest version of MLV App.  It handles Dual ISO files really nicely and exports to ProRes too. 
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on September 19, 2018, 02:34:41 PM
Bilal, a1ex. Epicness...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Markus on September 19, 2018, 02:53:37 PM
Can you try this on 5D3?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on September 19, 2018, 02:59:15 PM
@squig
Yeah the noise has packed its bags when it saw 1x3 beside dual iso :P . Even without dual iso there is an good enhancement. More tests in the future.

Is the rolling shutter has increased? I am not really sure it shows in 1x3 16.2 µ/line (35.9 ms (86%) at 1736x2214) instead in 3x3 16.5 µ/line (19.1 ms (46%) at 1736x1160). Maybe after stretching down the vertical in 1x3 this affect the rolling shutter I am not sure about this. What do you think @a1ex? I am will make test for rolling shutter in the future.

ML anamorphic stretch can help but in 1x3 the LiveView only showing top of the frame and you can't see the bottom part.

@bouncyball
Yes the aliasing and moire and also the quality loss was very annoying. Now the write speed and stretched LiveView is the new problem we will hate :D

@togg
I just can say Magic Lantern has converted our cheap old toys to really High End Cinema Cameras! @Canon did you know about this before? :P

@Danne
Thank you! I hope this will not stop here until we get normal LiveView (it's really complex! we can find out by comparing between mv1080 and mv720) and also higher write speeds(This will speed up the progress (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=12862.msg202179#msg202179) if we work together and try diffrenet values ). I will not buy a new camera if this happened.  :D

@Markus
I don't have 5D3 unfortunately and the new crop_rec maybe doesn't fully support yet 5D3 not sure. Just wait to be supported for all other D5 cameras and you can try it with your hands :D .
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: togg on September 19, 2018, 03:19:38 PM
@Markus
I don't have 5D3 unfortunately and the new crop_rec maybe doesn't fully support yet 5D3 not sure. Just wait to be supported for all other D5 cameras and you can try it with your hands :D .

I'm not technical savy, not in a hurry either, just curious to know if there're important camera limitations, maybe someone else has got the scale of this already?

Nothing to study here.  Just use the latest version of MLV App.  It handles Dual ISO files really nicely and exports to ProRes too.


mmm thing is I don't want to export to ProRes, I want to export lossless dng to bring them to Resolve. I'm unsure if dualiso info are processed into a normal file when "extracting" dngs. I don't have my camera to try it out!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on September 19, 2018, 04:41:26 PM
For the 5d3, 3x1 mode has probably only benefit for dual iso.
The 5d3 already does vertical pixelbinning instead of lineskipping.
So a plain, straight from Canon factory 5d3 already has the aliasing and noise benefits 3x1 mode gives to lineskipping camera's.


 
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 12georgiadis on September 19, 2018, 04:53:51 PM
For the 5d3, 3x1 mode has probably only benefit for dual iso.
The 5d3 already does vertical pixelbinning instead of lineskipping.
So a plain, straight from Canon factory 5d3 already has the aliasing and noise benefits 3x1 mode gives to lineskipping camera's.
Levas, you mentionned that 3X1 or 1X3 (correct me) triples the bitrate. But is it the case with 5DmkIII ? It seems that the bitrate is the same as the other cameras for the same resolutions...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on September 19, 2018, 05:09:28 PM
The 5d3 does the binning in hardware, if I'm correct, this is done on CMOS sensor level.
So the raw video stream is already normal sized, so normal bitrates.
Alex posted this long ago about pixel binning patterns, interesting read about how the sensor is read in Canon DSLR's:
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=16516.msg160831#msg160831 (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=16516.msg160831#msg160831)



 
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 12georgiadis on September 19, 2018, 05:14:37 PM
thank you levas
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on September 19, 2018, 05:15:13 PM
About the binning, it could be the case that more Canon camera's can do vertical pixelbinnig by default, but that Canon has not enabled it in firmware...
I doubt it, because it would possible be already found by some one messing with the registers.
But hey, we're talking about Canon here, so I wouldn't be surprised  :P
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: togg on September 19, 2018, 09:04:37 PM
The 5d3 does the binning in hardware, if I'm correct, this is done on CMOS sensor level.
So the raw video stream is already normal sized, so normal bitrates.

does this mean that it will be harder/impossible to make the same trick work? Because the dual iso usage would be very important by itself I feel.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on September 19, 2018, 09:59:33 PM
The 5d3 can do the same trick, all canons can do 3x1 1x3 mode.
3x1 1x3  mode is actually a mix between normal view(3x3) and 5xzoom mode (1x1)
But for 5d3 this 3x1 1x3 mode is only interesting for dual iso, the other benefits are already there for 5d3.

Edit: Sorry theBilalFakhouri, used to horizontal x vertical...not vice versa  :P
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on September 19, 2018, 10:24:42 PM
 ::)
@Levas
3x1 and 1x3 Binning mods is completely different things :P we have them both in new crop_rec. Can you please re-edit your posts to 1x3 for not making the users confused.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: togg on September 19, 2018, 10:25:57 PM
The 5d3 can do the same trick, all canons can do 3x1 mode.
3x1 mode is actually a mix between normal view(3x3) and 5xzoom mode (1x1)
But for 5d3 this 3x1 mode is only interesting for dual iso, the other benefits are already there for 5d3.

Ok nice, can't wait for clean dual iso onestly!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Karim on September 21, 2018, 11:22:18 PM

Shot on 700D:
1504x640 in 3x3 and 1504x1920 in 1x3 downsized to 1504x640 (@ 23.976FPS 2.35:1).
I can shoot up to 1736x736 (1736x2214 in 1x3) 2.35:1 but this requires 80mb/s write speed in 1x3 Binning mode


The problems:
-Very stretched LiveView


I just checked your video the dynamic range is so impressive and aliasing is almost gone!

I want to clarify some confusing things
what is 3x3 and 1x3 exactly and what's the difference?
I know about the line skipping thing the sensor does to fit a video is that something related?

why you downsize your videos? after all I cant notice visual difference in the video but it's more technical of course

I own a 6D I think your options doesn't available for my crop_rec but I want to understand how things goes on
also dual iso +mlvapp work with 14 bit only any lower Iget a final glitchy video does it tha same on 700D?

Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on September 22, 2018, 12:43:37 AM
@Karim

Yes 3x3 and 1x3 is about line skipping in sensor.

5D3 can do 3x3 column binning and line binning otherwise the other cameras like 700D it's doing column binning but line skipping so using 1x3 (Bin 3 columns and read every line) instead of skipping lines (skipping lines causing aliasing and moire patterns) now we get the Actual height of sensor 1736x738 in 3x3 becomes 1736x2214 (stretched height) by scaling down the vertical to 738 in post this process look like Binning lines in 5D3 directly in camera but we did it in the post so now we have got clean image without aliasing and moire and with less noise.

More details about Pixel Binning (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=16516.0).

Doing Dual ISO after the Binning process it will show a lot of artifacts and aliasing here will come the big benefit of 1x3 mode applying Dual ISO in full sensor height (using more pixels for dual iso) then stretching it down to the correct aspect ratio. In this way the details will be restored with less aliasing and less noise too.

In MLVApp there are no problems when using Dual ISO with 14/12/11-8 bit lossless and 14-bit uncompressed. But last time I got glitchy footage when I used 10-bit uncompressed with Dual ISO I will make more tests to make sure what's happening. If you have a problem with MLVApp you can explain what's happening and give some samples and screenshots in MLVApp thread (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=20025.msg206392;topicseen#msg206392) to get some help ;D.

And you can speak Arabic you are from Egypt? I am from Syria nice to meet you here in the forum :D

أهلاا و سهلاا
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: bouncyball on September 22, 2018, 07:22:36 AM
also dual iso +mlvapp work with 14 bit only any lower Iget a final glitchy video
As I remember 6D lossless needed some special approach (black level correction for every channel, @a1ex: is that still an issue?) It is not implemented into mlv app. Can you upload some MLVs to test?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on September 22, 2018, 10:13:52 AM
The first days of lossless on the 6d needed indeed a black level fix for all channels.
But this has been solved by Alex, the 6d lossless is now the same as other cams.

I can conform that MLVAPP works for 14 bit dual iso files from the 6d, used it with the lunar eclipse a few months ago.
Never tried any other then 14 uncompressed and 14 bit lossless for dual iso video.
Will try to test today what happens in MLVAPP when using dual iso in 12 bit lossless and 12 bit uncompressed etc.
 


Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on September 22, 2018, 10:17:33 AM
Not tested anything yet, but to be sure, dual iso should work with lower lossless bit like 12 bit lossless, right ?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on September 22, 2018, 11:31:06 AM
On the 6d, dual-iso 12 bit lossless and 12 bit uncompressed are working normal in MLVapp over here.
@Karim, are you sure you didn't accidentally enabled other options in MLVapp, like the option to fix 'pattern noise', right below dual-iso settings in MLVapp ?
Pattern noise option really messes up my dual iso video.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on September 22, 2018, 01:58:55 PM
Made a 1x3 preset in crop_rec module for 6d users to play with.

https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=15088.msg206420#msg206420 (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=15088.msg206420#msg206420)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: JackDaniel412 on September 23, 2018, 03:33:31 PM
This is a great news! Hope we see it on 5D Mk III soon!
Amazing!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: wety67e on September 26, 2018, 10:40:31 AM
 :o Hope we see it on 100d soon
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: mothaibaphoto on October 06, 2018, 07:15:40 PM
How to get 1x3 binning on MKIII?
I compiled "bleeding-edge" 700D crop_rec - it's not workig on MKIII, as advertised :(
Then, I uncommented 1x3 preset in crop_rec from the crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd branch -
yes, it already has one for MKIII, just commented out.
And it works!!! But, vertical resolution is wrong!!!
It shoots 1920x1258 - 1920x419 after resizing.
I tried to increase target YRES in crop_rec settings - no difference.
It looks like I need to fix mlv_lite code - it doesn't recognize that binning and don't let to choose correct resolutions...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 07, 2018, 01:53:18 AM
@mothaibaphoto

I don't think vertical resolution is wrong. Everything is normal the "bleeding-edge" crop_rec is completely different from crop_rec in crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd branch. And maybe the settings like target YRES wouldn't help in this case. The Y resolution is looking like this in new crop_rec "bleeding-edge" : (See the screenshots in camera)
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg206040#msg206040

After applying 1x3 binning without changing Y resolution in 700D it gave 1736x1160 resized to 1736x386 it's similar to what happened in 5D3. But without increasing the vertical resolution.

I don't really know when the new crop_rec will be ready for 5D3. If you really want to increase vertical res in 1x3 binning make a preset in current crop_rec using adtg_gui. like this (https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=15088.msg206420#msg206420). Or maybe the new crop_rec is very easy to be ported in 5D3 I think a1ex will help you to get it working. I don't have 5D3 sorry.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on October 07, 2018, 08:34:23 AM
Bilal,

What you are doing and demonstrating here with the 700D is so exciting !!!  Would it be possible that you also provide a build with this same functionality for the 100D?  So many 100D owners including me, eager to test and provide feedback, should greatly appreciate that.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 12, 2018, 01:45:42 PM
@IDA_ML

Sorry for my late responding, We have tried me and Danne for getting a preset in old crop_rec for 100D and EOS M, Unfortunately it didn't work. 1x3 Binning is working but without increased resolution so you will have very wide aspect ratio 1736x386 I don't think it will be very exciting. It's needs some more tweaking for making it working.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 12, 2018, 02:26:46 PM
Yes, minor road block. Will dive into it some more next week. Thanks for helping out Bilal.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on October 12, 2018, 03:51:06 PM
Yes, minor road block. Will dive into it some more next week. Thanks for helping out Bilal.

Great news, Bilal and Danne!  I will be looking forward to a hopefully working build!  Keeping my thumbs pressed for you!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 16, 2018, 09:36:31 AM
@mothaibaphoto
...
After applying 1x3 binning without changing Y resolution in 700D it gave 1736x1160 resized to 1736x386 it's similar to what happened in 5D3. But without increasing the vertical resolution.
Did some testing by uncommenting in crop_rec.c in crop_rec_4k to get into 1x3 on my 5D mark III and it works with a somewhat limited resolution as the end result the same as reported by mothaibaphoto.
(https://i.postimg.cc/BvDsfTCS/M16-0857-000007-tif-500px.jpg)

MLV file:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/M16-0857.MLV

Now I tried some adtg_gui tinkering but without any success. I don´t think registry changes can be applied when crop_rec setting is applied so changing 713c and 6804 won´t fly. I did some testing without enabling crop_rec but can´t really find all registrys so even if I could expand height to 1440 it wouldn´t contain any image and buggy.
So what are the possiblities here? Is height expandable as with the 700D? Could we enable a version for testing this 1x3 setting specifically?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 16, 2018, 11:41:08 AM
Jumping into registry(got the relevant ones from Bilal and some figures to test)

Check below registers what´s working or not.
Problematic as the file contain no image at the bottom.
example MLV:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_1x3_M16-1115.MLV

1920x1802
(https://i.postimg.cc/2yHG7dwd/Screen-Shot-2018-10-16-at-11-40-07-png-500px.jpg)

    CMOS 1  0x200
    CMOS 6  0x170

    ADTG
    800C       0x0
    8178 N    0x729
    8196 N    0x729
    8179 N    0xa91
    8197 N    0xa91(not working) c91 working

    C0F0
    713C       0x85e(not working)  0x75e(working)
    6804       0x828011b(not working)  0x728011b(working)

Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 16, 2018, 02:23:41 PM
Progress!
MLV file:
EDIT:
Oops, wrong link, try this one:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M16-1404.MLV


Thanks to Bilal of course:
1920x1770. Let´s see if we can go it even higher:
(https://i.postimg.cc/DzyFw1GX/Screen-Shot-2018-10-16-at-14-18-52-png-500px.jpg)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 16, 2018, 03:20:50 PM
Here comes dualiso. No aliasing. Nothing that matters at least. magic!
MLV files:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/1x3_dualiso_M16-1501.MLV
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/1x3_dualiso_M16-1500.MLV

Original
(https://i.postimg.cc/d1g95Pcj/Screen-Shot-2018-10-16-at-15-15-15-png-500px.jpg)

Crop
(https://i.postimg.cc/XqFkhHVS/Screen-Shot-2018-10-16-at-15-15-30-png-500px.jpg)

Original
(https://i.postimg.cc/jd0XNbXs/Screen-Shot-2018-10-16-at-15-15-43-png-500px.jpg)

Crop
(https://i.postimg.cc/jqJcL5yg/Screen-Shot-2018-10-16-at-15-15-50-png-500px.jpg)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on October 16, 2018, 07:23:30 PM
Danne and Bilal,

You seem to be creating history here!  What you guys are doing is absolutely insane! 

I have a question for you.  This 1x3 method with and without Dual ISO, how does it compare with the normal crop-recording method in terms of noise and overall image quality?  I have been filming a lot at 2520x1304 (16:9) resolution with my 100D and am very pleased with the results.  Moreover, using SD-card overclock and 18 fps, I get continuous recording at 14-bit lossless.  Dual ISO also gives me a great advantage in terms of noise and greatly improves my low-light videos.  Am I right by saying that the 1x3 method eliminates the crop factor that you get with crop recording but is limited by resolution due to limited card write speed?  Anyway, to have both options would be fantastic!  The 1x3 method for full-sensor usage and shallow DOF and the crop recording mode for high-resolution shots.  I would love to test and compare both methods.  Any chance for a new build with both options for the 100D?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 16, 2018, 08:18:05 PM
@IDA_ML

I will not accept "creating history" I have only used the tools in different way and it was creative or something new yeah especially with Dual ISO the real creative thing in this game :D. Talking about history you should mention Trammell Hudson, Alex and the early and other developers that bring these things to our hands.

This 1x3 method with and without Dual ISO, how does it compare with the normal crop-recording method in terms of noise and overall image quality?

You should read the first post and the link there. Of course it's has less noise compared to x5 mode. The details is the same in normal RAW video but without aliasing or moire. When using Dual ISO you are bringing the quality to the next level the 14 stops of dynamic range with previous benefits, It's perfectly fantastic thing!

Am I right by saying that the 1x3 method eliminates the crop factor that you get with crop recording but is limited by resolution due to limited card write speed?

It can be true but not really, The resolution is the same in normal RAW video but in 1x3 Max aspect ratio is 2.35:1 or a little bit more. In 700D 1736x2214 resized to 1736x738 @ 23.976 FPS, this requires about 70MB/s write speed in 10-Bit lossless (10-Bit lossless is working yeah using Analog gain and without any problem), I can get from 3 to 4 seconds using sd_uhs.

If I want continuous recording I should drop the resolution to 1504x1920 resized to 1504x640 (@ 53MB/S) Now we will have a small crop factor 1.85x crop . I have some hope to get more write speed in the future maybe it will be continuous in full sensor width! 1504x640 is very enough for me with no aliasing and 14 stops in 10-bit with less noise :) 1736x738 Will be great option too!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 16, 2018, 08:21:37 PM
For 100D
I am trying my best .. no luck with me but it's doable if I had the camera. I will try again.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on October 17, 2018, 12:30:25 PM
@theBilalFakhouri

By saying "creating history" by no means do I neglect the invaluable contribution of A1ex and all the other early developers that made this remarkable project possible and gave ML to all of us.  On the contrary, I have always stated that Magic Lantern is much more a revolutionary than an evolutionary project.  It is an excellent example of what a joint  iternational effort is up to in which not money, corporate interests and profits but intelect, creativity, science, inovation and enthusiasm are the major driving force.  Many of the developments, pioneered by our Magic Lantern developers, such as MLV RAW video, ISO research, Dual ISO, MLVFS, MLV Producer, MLVApp etc., are unique to DSLR technology and turn our cheap amateur cameras into powerful cinema shooting tools while processing RAW video has never been easier and faster - something that has not been demonstrated by any of the mighty camera manufacturers yet.  In my opinion, implementing these developments into future camera models, especially into the mirrorless ones, is just a question of time and therefore, the "creating history" statement is not exaggerated.  In that respect, every small step of progress in ML dvelopment is a giant leap towards making our cameras better. I cannot find the right words to express my deepest gratitude to all people involved in this remarkable project.  I can only hope that the efforts will continue and the ML community will continue to grow and enjoy the results of this fantastic joint international effort.

As far as your continued efforts on implementing your Dual ISO developments into the 100D is concerned, I greatly appreciate them and thank you for that.   Not having this camera in your hands is a problem of course but if you could help Danne who has it and understands its peculiarities, I am sure, you guys will eventually succeed. 
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 17, 2018, 03:13:10 PM
Some progress:
Dualiso MLV:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M17-1448.MLV

1920x2368 after 0.33 set in Mlv App we got 1920x789(not bad)
(https://i.postimg.cc/XqFDNxc4/Screen-Shot-2018-10-17-at-15-03-28-png-500px.jpg)


This was achieved after step by step "schooling" from Bilal. Register settled like so after tested in adtg_gui:
 
Code: [Select]
   switch (reg)
    {
        case 0xC0F0713c:
            return 0x97e;
       
        case 0xC0F06804:
            return 0x97e011b;


        case 0xC0F06008:
        case 0xC0F0600C:
            return 0x1800180;

        case 0xC0F06010:
            return 0x180;

        case 0xC0F06014:
            return 0xa27;

    }

Code: [Select]
cmos_new[1] = 0x280;
So this will work with fps 23.976 if I remember correctly and 1920x2368. Now question is if there are more variables/registers to include to go even higher?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on October 17, 2018, 03:41:17 PM
Cool. Are you getting full-res liveview?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 17, 2018, 03:47:09 PM
nope, liveview is for wimps ;).
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on October 17, 2018, 04:39:09 PM
Exactly, who needs liveview if you have raw  :D
Just fix it in post  :P
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 17, 2018, 06:03:10 PM
@IDA_ML

Your words are in the right place :) I have the same thing here as you said exactly, I can't add more words above your writing.
Great man.

What is the next stage for ML? :P I can't imagine more than the latest developments in the past two years. Maybe in next 1st April :D
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on October 17, 2018, 07:21:21 PM
What is the next stage for ML? :P I can't imagine more than the latest developments in the past two years. Maybe in next 1st April :D

I think, for the near future, we should try to improve what we already have on our camera models, (it is enormous and extremely useful for practical work),  rather than trying to invent and implement more and more new features.  Many people using ML on a regular basis, including me, would like to see one single stable build that works without glitches, a build one can rely on in real-life filming conditions.  This includes:

1) Fast and accurate focusing;

2) WySiWiG preview - bright enough, for proper framing during filming;

3) High-resolution 10/12-bit lossless video in crop mode providing continuous recording with SD/CF-card overclocking.  (Note that the 2520x1304 resolution is working already on the 100D but at 14-bit lossless and 18 fps.  It would be extremely useful to have continuous recording at 2560x1440 resolution and 24 fps at 10 or 12 bit lossless compression);

4) Stable Dual ISO operation for high-contrast and low-light scenes.

5) Stable operation after switching modes;

6) Hard coded optimum ISO values for each camera providing maximum dynamic range and lowest shadow noise, accordingly.

7) Better white balance and faster render speeds for MLV video in MLVApp. 

Let me share with you a small discovery that I made recently trying to process my Dual ISO files with MLVApp.  It concerns the built-in H.265 codec.  I discovered that rendering the MLVApp processed videos in that format goes pretty fast, video quality is stunning and H.265 file sizes are very small (about 50x smaller than the original MLVs at the same resolution).  I was shocked when I opened these files in Resolve.  They playback smoothly and video editing goes really fast if you don't use any complex color grading in Resolve.  Export from Resolve is also blazingly fast.   I may seriously consider this workflow for my future edits since it saves me a lot of time and disk space.  This is just an example of how far ML has gone in terms of video post processing.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 18, 2018, 08:05:00 AM
@a1ex
Me and Bilal are trying to reduce analog gain in crop_rec.c code but there is one issue here. The 5D mark III has two sets of iso registers so seems these registers will simply override each other giving corrupted image:
adtg2:
8882 0x41a
8884 0x41d
8886 0x41d
8888 0x41c

adtg4:
8882 0x41d
8884 0x41b
8886 0x41d
8888 0x41c


Tried putting this after powersave timing register but not working. Works fine with adtg_gui manually outside crop_rec.mo but not when applied as shown below:
Code: [Select]
adtg_new[13] = (struct adtg_new) {2, 0x8882, 0x20};
                adtg_new[14] = (struct adtg_new) {2, 0x8884, 0x20};
                adtg_new[15] = (struct adtg_new) {2, 0x8886, 0x20};
                adtg_new[16] = (struct adtg_new) {2, 0x8888, 0x20};

adtg_new[17] = (struct adtg_new) {4, 0x8882, 0x20};
                adtg_new[18] = (struct adtg_new) {4, 0x8884, 0x20};
                adtg_new[19] = (struct adtg_new) {4, 0x8886, 0x20};
                adtg_new[20] = (struct adtg_new) {4, 0x8888, 0x20};

Also needed to expand this:
Code: [Select]
    /* expand this as required */
    struct adtg_new adtg_new[20] = {{0}};

Would be great if we could shove those missing registers in there to get into 10bit in crop_rec.c.



Sidenote.
Commented out following and getting 1920x2400 now:
Code: [Select]
        case CROP_PRESET_3X:
     /* case CROP_PRESET_1x3: */
            skip_top        = 60;
            break;
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: a1ex on October 18, 2018, 09:13:30 AM
You've got 21 registers there (from 0 to 20).

Overwriting each other would only give some barely noticeable vertical stripe pattern (nothing that our stripe correction algorithm won't fix). These are exactly the registers used to fine-tune the column gains in hardware, so if one is going to implement stripe correction directly in the camera, these are the registers that will have to be touched.

At such low values, it won't be able to correct the stripes, but that's not needed as long as the software correction works.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on October 18, 2018, 09:25:18 AM
@Danne,

This is how it looks and works on 6d, indeed put in the part with the power save timers:
Code: [Select]
  adtg_new[13] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8882, 108};
  adtg_new[14] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8884, 108};
  adtg_new[15] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8886, 108};
  adtg_new[16] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8888, 108};

So first thing you could try is removing the '0x' before the '20' at the end, maybe it needs decimal values ?

Furthermore all the registers in powersave part uses the number 6 before them.
Even the lineskipping registers etc, all number 6, no 4, no 2 as you did.
Not sure where that 6 stands for, but maybe try to use 6 instead of 4 and 2  :-\
Code: [Select]
adtg_new[12] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x800C, 0};
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 18, 2018, 09:35:08 AM
Thanks for info. Initially I used these numbers(check numbers below) in adtg_gui and it will look nice without stripes
Adding the very same numbers in crop_rec.c will give a distorted image with heavy lines:
Here is what comes out with only one set of registers(distortion):
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M17-1700.MLV

Both sets of registers as shown below through adtg_gui
MLV file here(proof of concept, still an amplified line in the middle):
Lower white level in post to around 3500 and image comes back.
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M17-1723.MLV

adtg2
8882   0x45
8884   0x48
8886   0x49
8888   0x48

adtg4
8882   0x47
8884   0x45
8886   0x45
8888   0x48


Not having my camera with me but will try to add the missing register 21 in there later and see if it behaves the same as when doing changes in adtg_gui. The issue here is that if I only change the adtg2 registers it looks only half done so keeping lowering adtg4 will end up with reduced bitrate behaving the same as you suggest on your 6D. Will try your suggestion of course later Levas.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 18, 2018, 11:35:08 AM
Wow! Absolutely working now:
1920x2400 23.976fps.
Effectively 1920x799(might have to skip top 60 as before, noticed black bar at the top image)

Test files:
Import them to Mlv App and set white level to 3000 both the dualiso and non dualiso file. Really great looking footage.
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M18-1109.MLV
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M18-1110.MLV
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M18-1111.MLV


This:
Code: [Select]
adtg_new[13] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8882, 45};
                adtg_new[14] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8884, 48};
                adtg_new[15] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8886, 49};
                adtg_new[16] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8888, 48};

adtg_new[17] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8882, 47};
                adtg_new[18] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8884, 45};
                adtg_new[19] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8886, 45};
                adtg_new[20] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8888, 48};

and this:
Code: [Select]
    /* expand this as required */
    struct adtg_new adtg_new[21] = {{0}};

Thanks a lot for feedback!

reduced bitrate files:

non dualiso
(https://i.postimg.cc/kGJtxvZ8/Screen-Shot-2018-10-18-at-11-24-12-png-500px.jpg)

dualiso
(https://i.postimg.cc/VNtM16nS/Screen-Shot-2018-10-18-at-11-25-13-png-500px.jpg)

non dualiso
(https://i.postimg.cc/9Mj9fhYL/Screen-Shot-2018-10-18-at-11-27-06-png-500px.jpg)


Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on October 18, 2018, 11:47:09 AM
Got a build I can have a play with?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: togg on October 18, 2018, 12:40:19 PM
Some progress:
Dualiso MLV:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M17-1448.MLV

1920x2368 after 0.33 set in Mlv App we got 1920x789(not bad)
(https://i.postimg.cc/XqFDNxc4/Screen-Shot-2018-10-17-at-15-03-28-png-500px.jpg)


This was achieved after step by step "schooling" from Bilal. Register settled like so after tested in adtg_gui:
 
Code: [Select]
   switch (reg)
    {
        case 0xC0F0713c:
            return 0x97e;
       
        case 0xC0F06804:
            return 0x97e011b;


        case 0xC0F06008:
        case 0xC0F0600C:
            return 0x1800180;

        case 0xC0F06010:
            return 0x180;

        case 0xC0F06014:
            return 0xa27;

    }

Code: [Select]
cmos_new[1] = 0x280;
So this will work with fps 23.976 if I remember correctly and 1920x2368. Now question is if there are more variables/registers to include to go even higher?

Impressive, nice aspect ratio already.

Is this continuous? How many MB/s?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: masc on October 18, 2018, 12:50:08 PM
Test files:
Import them to Mlv App and set white level to 3000 both the dualiso and non dualiso file. Really great looking footage.
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M18-1109.MLV
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M18-1110.MLV
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M18-1111.MLV

Thanks a lot for feedback!
Hm... loaded M18_1111.MLV and got a lot of vertical stripes. Correction makes it even worse. Your clips from yesterday were cleaner...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 18, 2018, 12:53:14 PM
Yes, found them also. Didn't mess with with analog gain numbers yesterday. A1ex points out these registers are to be tweaked for stripes so one idea is that maybe it could be fine tuned with even more passes. Might be talking out of my famous ass here but would be worth a try if no one opposes :).

@togg
With reduced gain I could film a lot longer. Lowering vertical resolution a bit and went continuos.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 18, 2018, 01:30:24 PM
Stripe free @masc!
Set them uniform as suggested by Bilal and clean now:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M18-1314.MLV
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M18-1315.MLV

(https://i.postimg.cc/d3CG2RcW/Screen-Shot-2018-10-18-at-13-27-55-png-500px.jpg)

Code: [Select]
adtg_new[13] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8882, 46};
                adtg_new[14] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8884, 46};
                adtg_new[15] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8886, 46};
                adtg_new[16] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8888, 46};

adtg_new[17] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8882, 46};
                adtg_new[18] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8884, 46};
                adtg_new[19] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8886, 46};
                adtg_new[20] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8888, 46};
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 18, 2018, 01:53:02 PM
..so if one is going to implement stripe correction directly in the camera, these are the registers that will have to be touched.

Why we want to do that if there are no vertical stripes anymore when using uniformed values  :-\ ?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: masc on October 18, 2018, 02:10:37 PM
Stripe free @masc!
Yay!  8)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 18, 2018, 02:18:36 PM
Why we want to do that if there are no vertical stripes anymore when using uniformed values  :-\ ?
Could it be that easy  :o
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 18, 2018, 03:48:37 PM
Here is a version to test:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.zip

Branch here:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/branch/crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit

1 - Only useful with 1x3_10bit binning mode. You select 1x3_10bit binning in Crop mode menu. Set resolution so you get 1920x2368. Canon fps menu set to 24 frames per second.
Reason. I redefined white level to 3000 in raw.c. This due to not knowing how to create a crop_rec.h header file so raw.c don´t know what´s going on in crop_rec. Can´t make exceptions here yet. The win here is that full res preview will ook ok and mlv files will have correctly white level 3000 coming out of the camera.
Recommened to import the files in Mlv app. Set Transformation Height stretch to 0.33 if not already when imported.

2 - Liveview will look a little distorted. Strange colors and a little stripy but MLV will look beautiful hopefully.
Reason. I compensate darkened liveview with digital gain trick. A1ex idea of course. Bilal handed me the register:
Code: [Select]
/* correct liveview brightness */
case 0xC0F42744: return 0x4040404;

Happy testing. Please report bugs and good stuff too. sound should work too but as this is bleeding edge a lot of stuff could happen. Use and play with this at own free will.
Thanks again to A1ex, Bilal, Levas, Mlv App gang and others for great energy and open sourcery...

Oh yea, very special thanks to Bilal. Without his patience nothing.



Decided to run these analog gain numbers:
Code: [Select]
                adtg_new[14] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8884, 40};
                adtg_new[15] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8886, 40};
                adtg_new[16] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8888, 40};

adtg_new[17] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8882, 40};
                adtg_new[18] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8884, 40};
                adtg_new[19] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8886, 40};
                adtg_new[20] = (struct adtg_new) {6, 0x8888, 40};
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on October 18, 2018, 04:32:43 PM
Noticing one tiny thing:

You're doing this for clean dual-iso...so for dynamic range...
In order to get good recording times, your lowering analog gain registers to mimic 10 bit output.

Do you get the contradiction, dual-iso and 10 bit  ;D

But 10 bit dual-iso is probably still better then normal 14 bit I guess  8)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 18, 2018, 04:42:42 PM
Doing it for continuous action and dualiso. Nothing more depressing than early stops ;)
But hey. Maybe nothing or very little gained here. Wouldn't be the first time that happens  :P
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 18, 2018, 04:58:08 PM
I don't think it's so much difference, the data that you will loss in 10-bit at 100 iso, it can be restored when using 100/800 Dual ISO .. depending on my real world tests also :D

Updated first to post to try 1x3 Binning in 700D, 6D and 5D3 .
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on October 18, 2018, 06:12:58 PM
Doing it for continuous action and dualiso. Nothing more depressing than early stops ;)
But hey. Maybe nothing or very little gained here. Wouldn't be the first time that happens  :P

Danne,

I disagree. Can't you go even further with vertical resolution at 1x3, to say 1920x3240, so that the final result is Full HD (1920x1080)?  Don't worry about early stops.  These can be eliminated with somewhat lower fps for now and possibly card spanning in the near future.  Why am I asking?  The idea here is to use almost the full sensor area for a crop factor of 1,0 at 16:9 aspect ratio and get the advantage of 14-stops dynamic range (Dual ISO) in aliasing free RAW video.  This will blow the 5D3 out of the water and turn it into one of the best 35mm FHD cameras ever made.  To say nothing of the full-frame vision!  Do you think this might be possible?

I wish, we had this miracle on the 100D at 1736x976 resolution ...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 18, 2018, 06:33:44 PM
@IDA_ML

5D3 can already do 3072x1920 in 1x1 @24 FPS so it can do also 1920x3072 in 1x3 resized to 1920x1024 (I have tested it in 700D I can do 2306x1736 in 1x1 and also 1736x2306 in 1x3 so same thing here). Write speed will be very high 1920x3072 @24 10-bit lossless about ~120MB/s in 5D3
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on October 18, 2018, 06:55:42 PM
In that case, we are very close, Bilal.  With card spanning, the 5D3 should be able to provide continuous recording at 120 MB/s.  I remember A1ex saying that card spanning can be implemented with crop recording on the 5D3.

Danne,

I have just checked the test footage that you linked above.  Gorgeous quality!  Congratulations!  And also MLVApp does a hell of a job with such footage.  The processing latitude is amazing.  I pushed the Exposure slider to the right by 4 stops and did not notice any quality degradation.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on October 18, 2018, 10:53:10 PM
The other way to get the data rate down is to shoot 1280x2368 with 1.5x anamorphics. Preferably 14 bit lossless 1280x2412 for 2.39:1 output.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Lars Steenhoff on October 19, 2018, 12:38:39 AM
Nice idea about the anamorphic, I
happen to have a 1.5x one.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 19, 2018, 08:34:19 AM
Never used anamorpic lenses. Any recommendations? Links?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on October 19, 2018, 09:40:32 AM
Check out SLRmagic for new anamorphic lenses. An Isco Star + a front focus element is a good option. Iscorama 36 is the bomb, costs a bomb too.

I've been doing some tests on the build you posted. Nothing conclusive yet. Definitely less noise than 3x3 but there's some vertical fixed pattern noise. Getting pink frames at the end of every recording and had one in the middle of a 100/800 dual ISO recording.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 19, 2018, 10:13:44 AM
Thanks for tip.
Yes, noticed stripes on the right hand of the image. Not sure why, maybe a1ex knows.
I could upload a build with a little less height to see if that makes it less prone to random pink frames etc. Noticed this too when including audio.
Will post a little later.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 19, 2018, 11:08:40 AM
Updated to a new version. Seems corruption free but needs testing. New resolution is 1920x2352
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.zip

Oh, and canon menu set to 24fps or it will not work I suppose.
Please report any findings.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on October 19, 2018, 11:12:28 AM
Can you upload one with a little less width and 14bit lossless? 1320x2412 would do nicely. I'm trying to figure out whether there's any increase in dynamic range. So far 10bit 1x3 dual ISO looks about the same DR as 3x3 14bit lossless (no dual ISO).

The vertical stripes are hidden in the shadows up to 1600 ISO, beyond that it's visible on the graded shots.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 19, 2018, 11:16:49 AM
You can lower width in Resolution tab. Something like 1312x2352 will work.
Well, more height right now will mean lower fps or corruption. Feel free to play with code and see if you can get more out of this. I am unfortunately out of time atm but will test more when I get the opportunity.

Will upload a 14bit version. Wait a minute...

EDIT:
14bit version. Not tested so needs verifying:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_14bit.zip
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on October 19, 2018, 11:30:54 AM
Cool thx. Yeah it's beer o'clock here too :D

800/100 ISO 1x3 10bit

(https://i.imgur.com/kYdjPpP.png)

same shot +1 EV

(https://i.imgur.com/1XCDwEz.png)

Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Lars Steenhoff on October 19, 2018, 01:01:09 PM
Cool results, and yes I see the stripes in the shadows
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 19, 2018, 01:53:02 PM
If entering canon menu and back before filming stripes are often gone. Except on the right hand of the image. Well, more tests...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: flostro on October 20, 2018, 10:59:55 AM
Here is a version to test:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.zip

Is it for 5D3 113 or 123 ?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Walter Schulz on October 20, 2018, 11:12:20 AM
If you don't know a version you will find a <cam identifier>_<firmware version>.sym file in ML\Modules. Here it is 5D3_113.sym.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: flostro on October 20, 2018, 01:05:12 PM
Good to know, thank you
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 20, 2018, 03:03:21 PM
I tried your 14 bit version and it works very well.  Straightforward and easy!

Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on your point of view) it doesn't seem to provide any benefits compared to the ISO experiments, for me at least...

I will keep watching and playing with any new developments you make, and hopefully you will work some magic!

I think that dual ISO combined with the ISO experiments is the way to get truly incredible results...

If only more people were playing with the ISO experiments, maybe this could happen.

I'll try some more tests with your 14 bit version and see if it beats the ISO experiments in some cases.  The shadows are just so clean in the ISO experiments...

I hope you don't think I'm discouraging you.  Quite the opposite!  Keep up the amazing work!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 20, 2018, 03:47:06 PM
Less stripes?
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.zip
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_14bit.zip
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 20, 2018, 04:50:36 PM

(https://thumb.ibb.co/c9hni0/M20-093-frame-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/c9hni0)
Much better!

But something strange is happening now.  When I load a clip from the "less stripes" version into mlvapp, as soon as I switch to anything except bilinear demosaicing, the brights lose the dual ISO processing.

I checked by reverting to the prior version and it's fine.

I'm using the 14 bit version.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 20, 2018, 05:09:26 PM
Seems problematic still. Think it's fps related. As soon as I lower fps to something like 22 stripes are gone. Finetuning I guess.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 20, 2018, 05:15:00 PM
It was the shutter speed.  Seems like it was somehow set in your version.

Once I set it to 50 in the ml exposure menu, the problem disappeared!

For some reason, when I set FPS override, the camera crashed hard. Display stays on even with the battery door open.  Battery has to be pulled.

This version provides very nice results!  Maybe better than ISO experiments!

I'll do a comparison with this.

EDIT: I can't repeat this.  It must have been a stray neutrino.  But the hard crashing is definitely repeatable :p
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 20, 2018, 05:35:02 PM
Uploaded two new versions. Finetuned, hopefully stripe free.
And yes, stay off fps override...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Levas on October 20, 2018, 05:35:47 PM
FPS override doesn’t combine well with crop_rec presets.
FPS override changes A and B timers, which are already carefully set in the crop_rec preset.
This combination probably also messes up shuttertime, as calculations are done with the settingsfrom the crop_preset.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 20, 2018, 08:32:16 PM
The new version fixed the interlacing issue, but the vertical stripes are very strong, especially if underexposing for highlights.

I did many exposures of this test scene, and even when I exposed exactly for midtones, the stripes are visible on the wall well into the mids...

As for dynamic range, it doesn't beat the ISO experiments yet.  Pretty much the same.

But, if you can eliminate the stripes, it could be a winner!

I still dream of both combined.

The following images are straight from mlvapp with no processing except exposure and shadow strength to match.  No noise reduction nor chroma smoothing applied.

The ISO 109 was shot at 3K and exported at 1080.  BTW, the 3K footage uses less data...

Different framing due to different crop sizes.
(https://thumb.ibb.co/cEsh0f/ISO-109.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cEsh0f)

(https://thumb.ibb.co/gQPHY0/dual-iso.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gQPHY0)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 20, 2018, 08:48:43 PM
I just posted two new versions. Only tested 10bit briefly. Not sure why you still get stripes. Maybe unavoidable. Thanks for testing. Feel free to test these two latest ones as well if you have the time. Thanks.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 20, 2018, 09:16:24 PM
I tried the new version and it's the same.

I hope you can solve this!

Simple test: expose for a light bulb in a dimly lit room just like the scene I did.  You'll know right away!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 20, 2018, 10:00:22 PM
In 700D there are no problems when using 10-bit lossless analog gain possibly also other small cameras like EOS M, 650D and 100D will be not affected. Maybe the cameras which has ADTG4 analog registers will be a little bit tricky like 5D3.

Canon 700D:
(https://preview.ibb.co/gyS7GL/Original.jpg) (https://ibb.co/n16Oqf)

(https://preview.ibb.co/dowZwL/Pushed-5-stops.jpg) (https://ibb.co/eDp9Vf)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 20, 2018, 10:11:00 PM
I tried the new version and it's the same.

I hope you can solve this!

Simple test: expose for a light bulb in a dimly lit room just like the scene I did.  You'll know right away!

Could you show me an example of the problem with the 10bit build please.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 20, 2018, 10:52:32 PM
10 bit version:
(https://thumb.ibb.co/g76HGL/M20-1541-frame-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/g76HGL)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 20, 2018, 11:14:18 PM
Thanks. Will try and reproduce. And fix maybe.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 20, 2018, 11:24:17 PM
Good luck!
I hope you succeed, I'm starting to like this!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 12georgiadis on October 21, 2018, 07:07:40 AM
Hi! If there is a build with eosm dual iso lossless 10 bits, I can do some tests


Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 21, 2018, 11:48:56 AM
Uploaded two new builds.
1920x2320, fps23.976

Tried 10bit in daylight both dualiso and regular raw and footage looks ok. Tried some stress testing against a lamp but couldn't find any stripes.
Feel free to do some stress testing against either build.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on October 21, 2018, 12:07:06 PM
Hi! If there is a build with eosm dual iso lossless 10 bits, I can do some tests

Same question but about the 100D.  Can we see a working build on that camera?  I can't wait to test.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on October 21, 2018, 01:39:11 PM
Uploaded two new builds.
1920x2320, fps23.976

Tried 10bit in daylight both dualiso and regular raw and footage looks ok. Tried some stress testing against a lamp but couldn't find any stripes.
Feel free to do some stress testing against either build.

Stripes still there on the 14bit build.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 21, 2018, 02:10:24 PM
Guess I´m out of options atm. If anyone wants to keep on testing these are the registers in crop_rec.c that I´ve been tweaking.
Code: [Select]
        case 0xC0F0713c:
            return 0x94e;
       
        case 0xC0F06804:
            return 0x94e011b;

        case 0xC0F06008:
        case 0xC0F0600C:
            return 0x1860186;

        case 0xC0F06010:
            return 0x186;

        case 0xC0F06014:
            return 0x9ff;

Not sure what´s related to wht and if/or something else is causing the issue. I recorded a lot of 10bit files which seems to work fine.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 21, 2018, 02:25:27 PM
@Danne

Maybe FPS Timer A in 1080p24 default in 5D3:
0xC0F06008= 0x1b701b7
0xC0F0600C= 0x1b701b7
0xC0F06010= 0x1b7

Your preset
0xC0F06008= 0x1860186
0xC0F0600C= 0x1860186
0xC0F06010= 0x186

Try:
0xC0F06008= 0x1870187
0xC0F0600C= 0x1870187
0xC0F06010= 0x187

It should be fixed I got vertical stripes when changing X values for FPS Timer A in 700D:
0x00X000X

So keep it as original one which is 7.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 21, 2018, 02:42:06 PM
Like this Bilal? Gives 23.972 fps
Code: [Select]
        case 0xC0F0713c:
            return 0x94e;
       
        case 0xC0F06804:
            return 0x94e011b;

        case 0xC0F06008:
        case 0xC0F0600C:
            return 0x1870187;

        case 0xC0F06010:
            return 0x187;

        case 0xC0F06014:
            return 0x9f9;

/* correct liveview brightness */
case 0xC0F42744: return 0x4040404;


Posted versions here:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit_version2.zip
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_14bitversion2.zip
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 21, 2018, 03:00:14 PM
Yes exactly, Is this working?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 21, 2018, 03:09:57 PM
Well got word from 70mmm and still stripes. I think it's maybe too much to handle? If lowering fps override to 22 stripes are more or less gone.
Cutting off height more and still keeping 24 fps might do the trick. Working from 197 timer or so. For me the next latest build is stripefree enough for my needs.

Edit: still don't see a download of the 10bit version...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 21, 2018, 04:19:06 PM
Here's the two latest 10 bit versions stress
(https://thumb.ibb.co/dxdDQf/version-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dxdDQf)

(https://thumb.ibb.co/g79nkf/version-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/g79nkf)
tested at 22fps override:

V2 definitely has less stripes.  Precisely the same settings and conditions, straight from mlvapp.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 21, 2018, 05:37:55 PM
@70MM13
Hm, looks more like resolution loss in shadows than stripe issue in both examples. Are 14bit looking the same?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 21, 2018, 06:49:38 PM
Fresh identical settings comparison of 10 and 14 bit versions...

The brightness difference is not my doing.
Interestingly, there's more aliasing in the 14 bit version.  Look closely at the modulation lever on the keyboard in the background.


(https://thumb.ibb.co/cVGgvf/version-2-14-bit-frame-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cVGgvf)

(https://thumb.ibb.co/mM7X1L/version-2-10-bit-frame-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mM7X1L)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on October 21, 2018, 06:54:57 PM
@70MM13

Turn OFF Fix Bad pixels in MLVApp, is that at 23.976 FPS?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 21, 2018, 07:05:34 PM
You're right, that fixed the aliasing.  I never pay attention to that function...

22 FPS
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 21, 2018, 07:37:42 PM
Ok, just ran tests on both 10 and 14 bit versions and both seems to be working fine with or without dualiso enabled and with 23.976 fps. I erased the version2 for now.

dualiso 14bit
(https://i.postimg.cc/W4Vp8k09/Screen-Shot-2018-10-21-at-19-39-00-png-500px.png)

dualiso 10bit
(https://i.postimg.cc/tgzqM459/Screen-Shot-2018-10-21-at-19-39-28-png-500px.png)


10bit
(https://i.postimg.cc/XNBJV4Nk/Screen-Shot-2018-10-21-at-19-41-34-png-500px.png)

14bit
(https://i.postimg.cc/TwpP5XVG/Screen-Shot-2018-10-21-at-19-41-25-png-500px.png)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 21, 2018, 09:47:40 PM

(https://thumb.ibb.co/etbvO0/iso-109-again.jpg) (https://ibb.co/etbvO0)
They still only work for me at 22fps, but they're the least stripey yet.

The dark areas of the paintings showcase how much you lose with only 10 bits...
(https://thumb.ibb.co/hOr6Vf/version-3-10-bit.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hOr6Vf)

(https://thumb.ibb.co/n1P4GL/version-3-14-bit.jpg) (https://ibb.co/n1P4GL)


Edit: added another ISO 109 shot.  Used the same 35mm prime so I had to move the camera to get approximately the same framing.  Sorry, but 109 still is best for me, especially considering it's 3072 pix across.

But I was reminded of something that might be a clue about the stripes...

In the amplifier hacking mode, any settings change, including 1x/5x/10x liveview mode, requires waiting about 30 seconds for the amplifiers to settle, and during that time, the screen is full of vertical stripes that slowly fade away.

Maybe this is somehow related?

I don't know causes, these are only my observations.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 21, 2018, 09:57:12 PM
Resolution loss is expected with 10bits. That other anomaly with stripes showing should be fixed. At least here at 23.976. If you manage to record corrupted files please shorten the mlv and upload it.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on October 22, 2018, 10:34:17 AM
Big improvement on the stripes with the latest 14bit build. I had to shoot 3200/200 DUAL ISO -3EV to see them.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 22, 2018, 11:22:47 AM
Yes, seems to work with latest builds. Note that right hand "amplified gain" stripes are something different from vertical stripes which seems non existent now with the same iso gain values.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 25, 2018, 08:05:59 AM
Testing out a version with a little less reduced gain hopefully delivering more like a 12bit stream:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_12bit.zip

Commit:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/commits/54eb1c41fda5536af346489daa4bf2d971708c85
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on October 27, 2018, 02:33:24 AM
I gave it a quick test and it looks pretty clean at 22 FPS.  Nasty unusable stripes at default FPS on my camera.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: vstrglv on October 27, 2018, 05:50:24 PM
I have tried magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.zip on 20 (21?).10.2018 and magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_12bit.zip on 25.10.2018. How to use workflow mlv_dump -> cr2hdr->dng? I've got a gray image file as a result.
I have an issue with MLVApp 1.2 and magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.zip version.
(http://farm2.staticflickr.com/1931/45532921362_36c9084990_b.jpg)
The same settings, but less brigthness.
(http://farm2.staticflickr.com/1962/31711207028_3f6e37a1a3_b.jpg)
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=20025.2225
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 27, 2018, 06:22:03 PM
Not sure cr2hdr likes these 10/12 bit files. Bouncyball did a lot of changing in code to make it work with Mlv app. There are still issues it seems but getting better. Most important right now is tht you upload short mlv samples of your files.
One other thing to try is to change white level a little i Mlv App.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: vstrglv on October 27, 2018, 07:04:18 PM
https://cloud.mail.ru/public/CbRb/1JLJBAS26  190MB.
I do not know how to cut mlv file without changing data.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on October 27, 2018, 07:08:41 PM
There is a cut function in MLV App up in the right corner. Just set it to export like 5 frames and the change export settings to MLV. See to it that you rename the shortened file. Can't be same as the original. Will overwrite.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: vstrglv on October 27, 2018, 07:28:14 PM
Thank you.
https://cloud.mail.ru/public/7BKB/e9EV6YWh3 22MB
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: vstrglv on October 28, 2018, 10:08:06 AM
Some pictures from one MLV magiclantern_crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.zip version ->MLVApp 1.2->H264, camera does down :
00:00:09
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1907/45594665771_578a4727a2_m.jpg)
00:00:10 Brighter than 00:00:09
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1920/43776943220_f40f3f187c_m.jpg)
00:15:13
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1929/45594665921_1b04199c36_m.jpg)
00:15:14
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1950/43776943380_cdd64ab34f_m.jpg)
00:15:15
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1972/45594666061_abb6e372d7_m.jpg)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on November 01, 2018, 04:19:42 PM
Just finished a preset which records 1920x3240(perfect 1920x1080 in 1x3). Caveat, it´s 17fps:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.5D3113_presets.zip

There are presets for 10/12/14 bits as well but preview and white balance will be hard coded to 12bit so using other bits will have to account for this. I blame my lack of C-knowledge here. Stick to 12bit 1x3 presets and you´re fine.


Test MLV
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/short_M01-1712.MLV

(https://i.postimg.cc/sXMyGCVH/Screenshot-2018-11-01-at-16-29-06-png-800px.jpg)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on November 01, 2018, 08:43:40 PM
Think I found out why we were getting gain stripes when changing timers. Well found out without really understand why it caused image corruption:
Code: [Select]
                /* assuming FPS timer B was overridden before this */
                int fps_timer_b = (shamem_read(0xC0F06014) & 0xFFFF) + 1;
                int readout_end = shamem_read(0xC0F06804) >> 16;    /* fixme: D5 only */

Changed this to following and image is corruption free!:
Code: [Select]
                int fps_timer_b = (shamem_read(0xC0F06014) & 0xFFFF) - 3;
Also tested below but wouldn´t work:
Code: [Select]
                int fps_timer_b = (shamem_read(0xC0F06014) & 0xFFFF) - 1;
Maybe @a1ex knows the story here?

 
Reduced settings to following in crop_rec.mo. 12bit is gonna work best previewing etc but feel free to test the other bitrates as well for comparison. White balance will be hard coded to 5000 so make sure to test and stretch in post if it looks like it works.
(https://i.postimg.cc/76kHxfzN/VRAM0-PPM-500px.png)


Download here:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.5D3113_presets.zip

Would be good if we could confirm that the gain stripe issue is gone or not now. Please report.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: a1ex on November 02, 2018, 01:00:30 AM
Changed this to following and image is corruption free!:
Code: [Select]
                int fps_timer_b = (shamem_read(0xC0F06014) & 0xFFFF) - 3;
Also tested below but wouldn´t work:
Code: [Select]
                int fps_timer_b = (shamem_read(0xC0F06014) & 0xFFFF) - 1;

Very nice find!

The FPS timer itself is correct with +1; the issue is what gets computed afterwards.

Is it enough to reduce the value just for 0x8179 and 0x8197 (i.e. fps_timer_b - 5 or maybe lower)?

Canon values: https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg202783#msg202783

(https://a1ex.magiclantern.fm/bleeding-edge/lv-resolution/5D3.png)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on November 02, 2018, 02:14:31 AM
@Danne the movie menu options are all greyed out.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: mothaibaphoto on November 02, 2018, 04:43:45 AM
Wow, Danne, congratulations!!!
Greatly appreciate your efforts, you get something new and interesting to experiment with.
Shoot "Battleship Potemkin" remake for example :)
This is what I like about ML most: a big journey could be started just by uncommenting a couple of strings in sourcecode :)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on November 02, 2018, 05:28:55 AM
Is it enough to reduce the value just for 0x8179 and 0x8197 (i.e. fps_timer_b - 5 or maybe lower)?
Yes, works!
Commit(wip):
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/commits/86910cefc6a58e9fc67db8f655ba983df0b0cce4#Lmodules/crop_rec/crop_rec.cF911

Canon values: https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg202783#msg202783
Thanks for that link

@squig
Just to be sure. Are you in movie mode? Works as expected here. Could you show me how it looks(screenshot, video)?

@mothaibaphoto
Agreed :)

Uploaded a new build for testing:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.5D3113_presets.zip
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: squig on November 02, 2018, 06:51:01 AM
Oops, my bad.

I tested the latest build 12bit 1920x2352 3200/100 ISO, same lighting/shot as my earlier tests: it looks completely clean, no vertical stripes or noise. Nice work.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on November 02, 2018, 02:34:55 PM
For me, only the 3240 versions are stable.  Extremely bright areas get that interlacing failure on the 23.976 FPS versions in almost every instance.

But the 3240 versions are very nice.

The stripes are still there but now at the same level as the noise floor, only visible if pushed really hard.

Here's a sample MLV (1 frame) of a good test.  Raise the exposure by 2.5 stops and drop the shadow strength to 8 and you're in the right area.

That light bulb is very unique.  It is a point source with a cylindrical lens, so it's almost as bright as the sun but it puts out very little light.  The scene is actually quite dark.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1F1n39758QmkMqapsJLWnogDTljBEGw51/view?usp=drivesdk

Here's a video with the same bulb in an even darker scene I shot using the ISO experiments.  The artifacting is thanks to YouTube.


I'm shooting a video on Sunday.  I'd love to try this dual ISO if it can be stable at 24 FPS at 2.35:1
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: vstrglv on November 02, 2018, 05:17:09 PM
70MM13, are you talking about horizontal stripes or vertical ones?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on November 02, 2018, 05:46:03 PM
Vertical, but they're basically gone unless you are digging in the shadows, but the noise there is just as strong.

For "easy" lighting conditions, this is fantastic now.  I just really need 24fps (or 23.976) at 2.35:1 working without problems...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on November 02, 2018, 06:02:24 PM
Vertical, but they're basically gone unless you are digging in the shadows, but the noise there is just as strong.

For "easy" lighting conditions, this is fantastic now.  I just really need 24fps (or 23.976) at 2.35:1 working without problems...
But these issues are probably the same or worse with regular raw shooting no?

By the way. Just set Resolution to 1840x2353 and you got 2.35:1

And here is also 23.976:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.5D3113_presets.zip
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on November 02, 2018, 07:14:00 PM
Thanks, Danne.

I will play with it!

It's so great to have these capabilities from our outdated cameras!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: vstrglv on November 02, 2018, 07:17:36 PM
Vertical, but they're basically gone unless you are digging in the shadows, but the noise there is just as strong.
But there is a lot of horizontal stripes. Is it normal?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: dfort on November 02, 2018, 07:26:28 PM
I just really need 24fps (or 23.976) at 2.35:1 working without problems...

Just set Resolution to 1840x2353 and you got 2.35:1

Might be asking for too much and I haven't played around with it yet but would a resolution of 1920x2488 at 23.976 fps be possible?

2488/3 = 816
1920x816 = 2.35:1
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on November 02, 2018, 07:49:20 PM
But there is a lot of horizontal stripes. Is it normal?

Do you mean in the sample MLV I uploaded?

If so, I don't see any horizontal stripes.  Are you sure you turned on dual ISO under the raw correction tab on mlvapp?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on November 02, 2018, 08:20:59 PM
Might be asking for too much and I haven't played around with it yet but would a resolution of 1920x2488 at 23.976 fps be possible?

2488/3 = 816
1920x816 = 2.35:1
Got some good schooling from both Bilal and Levas on pushing the timers and did a fair amount of testing so personally I am pretty much out of ideas atm. I did push the timer a few more steps and it gave me a wee more height but instead it was getting more prone to corruption.
There is some cutting on the image which I don't know why except that it do gives a black border without it so don't think that is an option to tweak.
Good part doing the 2.35:1 a I described is that you get continuous shooting with the 12bit opotion.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on November 02, 2018, 08:29:33 PM
5D3 can already do 3072x1920 in 1x1 @24 FPS so it can do also 1920x3072 in 1x3 resized to 1920x1024 (I have tested it in 700D I can do 2306x1736 in 1x1 and also 1736x2306 in 1x3 so same thing here). Write speed will be very high 1920x3072 @24 10-bit lossless about ~120MB/s in 5D3

I think it's possible but it needs to tweak something. I got above results in new crop_rec.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on November 02, 2018, 08:43:33 PM
What are your results on the 700D? 2306x1736? Far from 16:9. Are the limits the same for 1x1 and 1x3? Didn't Levas get around 100fps from 1x1 but downsized? If we havn't hit rooftop yet we should keep looking  8).
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: vstrglv on November 02, 2018, 09:15:49 PM
Do you mean in the sample MLV I uploaded?

If so, I don't see any horizontal stripes.  Are you sure you turned on dual ISO under the raw correction tab on mlvapp?
Sorry, my fault.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Karim on November 12, 2018, 05:15:22 AM
@Karim

Yes 3x3 and 1x3 is about line skipping in sensor.


Doing Dual ISO after the Binning process it will show a lot of artifacts and aliasing here will come the big benefit of 1x3 mode applying Dual ISO in full sensor height (using more pixels for dual iso) then stretching it down to the correct aspect ratio. In this way the details will be restored with less aliasing and less noise too.

In MLVApp there are no problems when using Dual ISO with

And you can speak Arabic you are from Egypt? I am from Syria nice to meet you here in the forum :D

أهلاا و سهلاا

Nice to meet you too Bilal  :D
أهلا وسهلا بيك يا بلال و مبسوط جداً من ابحاثك و تجاربك فى الكاميرا انت عبقري  8)

I was confused about 1x3 and 3x3 but I think I started to catch it right

I tried MLVapp v1.2 and it gave me stable dual iso results, not like the crappy test I made on v1.0
but still, I got minor artifacts like red and white dots it appears like for 1 frame long.

I shooted a 10-sec video and I spotted like 7 or 10 dots in total that appear and disappear instantly
I tried to mess with some setting in mlv app dots almost gone like 1 or 2 dots

It was 14bit lossless 30fps out of 6d
I used:
in details panel
Denoise window 3x3
strength: 35

export settings
prores4444
ffmpeg kostya
LMMSE
resize 1920x1080 (was 1824x1026)
smooth aliasing tried off, 1 pass , 3 pass
seems like 3 pass was softest image but no small dots also less aliasing (straight lines still looks like a zigzag)


Sorry if it's not even related to your 700d research I just wanna to share with you my experience to know if its common or im having trouble in my raw mlv workflow, I feel that I can't rely on it in serious projects yet :(
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Karim on November 12, 2018, 05:45:19 AM
@Karim, are you sure you didn't accidentally enabled other options in MLVapp, like the option to fix 'pattern noise', right below dual-iso settings in MLVapp ?
Pattern noise option really messes up my dual iso video.
I tried to turn them on / off.. but now I got stable dual iso results on v:1.2 of MLVapp
thanks for your help dude  :D
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: bouncyball on November 17, 2018, 11:37:09 AM
but still, I got minor artifacts like red and white dots it appears like for 1 frame long.
Try turning off the bad pixel removal. This might help.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Tyronetheterrible on November 24, 2018, 12:26:14 AM
I apologize for the naive question, but I was looking into the 1x3 binning module for my 6D.

Are there any advantages in terms of picture quality to using the 1x3 binning for a 16:9 aspect ratio when compared to just using the 6Ds max resolution in 16:9 (1824x1026) in 24 fps in 14 bit lossless?

It might be of note to mention that I have the VAF-6D anti-aliasing filter installed on my 6D, so I am not sure if this further diminishes any advantages to using the 1x3 binning?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on November 24, 2018, 11:39:37 AM
@Tyronetheterrible

The first benefit when using 1x3 Binning was to kill aliasing and moire patterns completely, so if you have a VAF filter it can do the job greatly and you don't need this mode.

But if you are using Dual ISO in video even with a VAF filter after processing you will see horrible alisaing and moire and you will lose the half quality of the image, Now with 1x3 Binning and Dual ISO the 2nd benift comes here No alisaing, moire patterns and no loss in the details at all!

Also when using 1x3 Binning it reduces the noise in the video. Read the first post for more informations.

Okay but this mode has limitations you can't use 16:9 aspect ratio in full sensor size, in 6D Max 1824x600 @ 24FPS a wide aspect ratio (maybe we can push it a few pixels, and of course you can drop the resolution in mlv_lite to get 16:9 with cropped FOV area) with write speed of ~80 MB/s in 14-bit lossless and stretched real-time preview.

Otherwise talking about the image details between 3x3 normal mode and 1x3 mode there is no difference only the aliasing and moire has been gone (you can compare it too).
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: dfort on December 04, 2018, 04:11:32 PM
@theBilalFakhouri -- Do you have your code saved in a Bitbucket repository? I'd like to compare what you're doing with Danne's code (https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern).
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: berechiah on January 04, 2019, 08:47:15 PM
Sorry to be so novis but what is 3x3 and 1x3
I have a 5dmk3
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Walter Schulz on January 04, 2019, 09:49:34 PM
Lines(rows) x Columns. An array.
Native Canon full HD (1920x1080) in 5D3 is processed by 3x3 binning (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_binning#Image_data_processing). Means: The data contents of 3x3 pixels are processed into 1 pixel output.

1x3 binning is done in most other Canon DSLRs: 3 pixels in a line are binned but lines are treated not this way. Only every 3rd line is processed. 2 out of 3 lines are not processed at all, they are "skipped". Visible aliasing effects often occur. Canon fights this by some data manipulation with disputable results.

With ML RAW/MLV it is possible to use one or the other.
And there is a third option 1:1 (or 1x1) where no binning and skipping takes place. But this requires using a reduced sensor area = Crop mode.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: LoO93 on January 04, 2019, 11:34:34 PM
@Walter Schultz Thank you very much for the clear and simple explanation.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: berechiah on January 05, 2019, 11:29:34 AM
Wow thanks you so much

That is the best and most understandable way I heard it explained

I read tons of times every where else but still was no clearer in understanding what it ment

Thanks for taking the time to explain

Much appreciated
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on January 10, 2019, 12:15:07 PM
Eosm now working without restrictions regarding 1x3 binning mode:
https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=9741.msg210369#msg210369
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on January 10, 2019, 01:24:26 PM
Danne,

Bilal and you seem to be creating history here !!!  I knew, it was possible, I knew it !!!  This new 1x3 mode makes the problematic 3x1 modes redundant, right?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on January 10, 2019, 02:24:09 PM
If you know a way to record around 100mb/s we´re all set  8)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on January 10, 2019, 02:25:29 PM
 8) 8)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: IDA_ML on January 10, 2019, 04:27:31 PM
If you know a way to record around 100mb/s we´re all set  8)

Yes, I know a very efficient way that will work 100%.  It's the EOS 7D.  It can write at 90 MB/s as it is, without even overclocking.  If all this new stuff is implemented into the 7D, indeed we are all set.  ;)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on January 10, 2019, 04:30:39 PM
Just set up a sourcetree and start testing stuff. One step at the time...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: ibrahim on January 21, 2019, 06:23:01 AM
What is the highest resolution you guys have been able to record with dual iso on 5d3 12-bit lossless 2.35:1 or 16:9  with the experimental builds?
Does it also involve x5 crop mode? and at what binning for dual iso? Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on January 25, 2019, 03:58:42 PM
I have been resisting the pull of dual iso since day 1 because I have always been happy with the results of gain reduction at iso 200 and the benefit of not dealing with all the issues surrounding dual iso...

But, after a shot yesterday that just didn't cut it, I decided to try again today with dual, and it won!

Now, to be totally clear, in this comparison, the iso200 version was without gain reduction (i was too lazy to change magic lantern versions) but in practice, canon 200 (only 200) is _almost_ as good as gain reduction, so it could have been a little better, plus it would be at 3072 instead of 1920, but even so, dual would win, clearly.

I lifted the shadows only to the point where the single iso was still marginally acceptable, but the dual version could go MUCH higher with no problems.  It's the champion!

So, I am going to start using this today...  I only hope it works reliably, and at 24 fps without too much nonsense.

Keep up the amazing work, I'm a believer!




(https://i.ibb.co/RbL7hVm/iso-200-denoised.jpg) (https://ibb.co/RbL7hVm)

(https://i.ibb.co/bsqyMcc/iso-100-800.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bsqyMcc)


Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Dmytro_ua on January 25, 2019, 04:23:40 PM
(https://i.ibb.co/RbL7hVm/iso-200-denoised.jpg) (https://ibb.co/RbL7hVm)

(https://i.ibb.co/bsqyMcc/iso-100-800.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bsqyMcc)

Why is the DOF so different?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on January 25, 2019, 05:43:07 PM
unfortunately i didn't think about it while shooting.

different exposure levels due to iso 200/100, and since i was using a manual aperture lens, it was quick and easy to just change the aperture to adjust.

sorry about that!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on January 25, 2019, 05:46:36 PM
hey those in the know...

i just accidentally took a photo with dual iso enabled (i didn't think it would affect photo mode when set in video mode) and it is a nature shot that cannot be retaken.

i am so far unable to correct it (using barracudaGUI) because presumably it can't handle the 1*3 binning...

can anyone help me sort this out?  I'd hate to lose the shot.

thanks in advance!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: dfort on January 25, 2019, 06:09:09 PM
Have you processed it through cr2hdr or one of the apps that can handle dual iso? If you are still having problems upload your file so we can take a look at it.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on January 25, 2019, 07:08:56 PM
yes, barracuda is a frontend for cr2hdr.  no joy.

is there a way to convert it to a single frame mlv so i can just load it into mlvapp?

i'd like to try to resolve it first without uploading if possible because it's a full frame cr2 which is a big file...
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on January 25, 2019, 08:58:49 PM
I sorted it out...

for some reason, I had to place cr2hdr.exe in the same folder as the images, even though I was running barracudaGUI from another folder, and then suddenly it worked correctly.

I'm just thankful that I was able to salvage the image, and it turned out beautifully!

thanks for the offer to help.  I appreciate it!
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on February 04, 2019, 09:13:55 PM
I did a serious torture test to compare the results of gain reduction vs your magical dual iso...

The scene was extremely dark, with a direct harsh light as the subject, filled with shadow detail.

Even though the gain reduction version was shot at 3072, thanks to your magic, the dual iso version looks just as good.  The upscaling works beautifully!

FYI, I also shot it in stock canon iso 200, and that was not even worth mentioning.

I'm looking forward to trying this in my next video, I just hope it can work smoothly without any surprise stops.

fingers crossed!

keep up the great work!

addendum:

I am running into a brick wall after a few hundred frames, with a fresh fast CF card.  I get continuous at 3072px normally with iso 109, but obviously this mode requires more bandwidth.  Is there any possibility of card spanning with the sd card to get that little bit extra to at least get a less restricted recording time, if not continuous?

I really like what I'm seeing, but 300 frames just isn't enough...

Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: vstrglv on February 08, 2019, 09:12:07 PM

Uploaded a new build for testing:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.5D3113_presets.zip
Danne, thanks for your builds.
What is the latest build for dual iso "crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_1x3_10bit.12bit.5D3113?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on February 08, 2019, 09:56:04 PM
Not much happened for the 5d3 lately. You could test this build:
https://bitbucket.org/Dannephoto/magic-lantern/downloads/crop_rec_4k_mlv_snd_isogain_1x3_presets_2019Feb08.5D3113.zip

New is the 1x3 binning recordings will be upsampled in Mlv App instead of downsampled so now files comes out 4k or 5k depending on what preset you choose.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on February 08, 2019, 11:15:02 PM
i just took it for a spin, and the 1*3 crop mode instantly locks up the camera, requiring a battery pull to revive again, consistently.

the 17fps preset works though.

the build from january works fine for me.

any suggestions?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on February 09, 2019, 12:44:19 AM
Took it off for now. Will take a look in a few days.
Thanks.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on February 11, 2019, 06:28:06 PM
12 bit test...


edit:

deleted.  i fumbled around and eventually the flickering was resolved.  it was definitely some random confluence of factors.  it's rock solid now.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on February 13, 2019, 10:46:29 PM
12 bit is working really beautifully in my 5d3 testing!

I just finished a wide range of extreme scenarios, and everything is looking excellent.

This example image is almost misrepresentative of the extreme conditions, it looks so good...

Exposed for the bulb, zero clipping, and falling off to near darkness.  so dark that the camera display is basically black except for the bulb.

The curve I made for it in mlvapp linear mode is vertical.

Chroma noise removed with neat video.

That's all that was done outside of mlvapp.

You guys should be extremely proud of what you are enabling with this magic :)

I'll be shooting a film noir video using this, and it's so great to plan shots to take advantage of this!

(https://i.ibb.co/5BvKJZC/Untitled-avi-snapshot-00-00-2019-02-13-16-01-58.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5BvKJZC)
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: timbytheriver on March 21, 2019, 02:36:18 PM
@Danne / @70MM13

What's the correct setup/preset to select this dual_iso 1x3 mode being discussed here – on 5D3 1.2.3 ?

I'm using @Danne's build from 15Feb2019. Is this correct? New to dual_iso…  :-X

Many thanks

Tim
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on March 21, 2019, 02:52:34 PM
I renamed 1x3 to anamorphic. Set 2.35:1 and enable dualiso as a guideline. 1x3, 3x1, 3x3 and so on can be pretty hard to differ from but anamorphic suits the 1x3 preset better since a1ex is manipulating pixel read out in an anamorphic style way here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anamorphic_format
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: timbytheriver on March 21, 2019, 03:05:09 PM
@Danne Thanks! I'm getting 85% compression at 12bit suggested :o

What bit rate is best for dual-iso? I'm on KB1066x 128gb…
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on March 21, 2019, 04:18:32 PM
Not 8 bit.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: timbytheriver on March 21, 2019, 04:29:28 PM
@Danne  :D For sure! 14-bit lossless 12-bit lossless seems to work ok…
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: timbytheriver on March 22, 2019, 01:27:58 PM
I renamed 1x3 to anamorphic. Set 2.35:1 and enable dualiso as a guideline. 1x3, 3x1, 3x3 and so on can be pretty hard to differ from…

@Danne Apart from 'Anamorphic', are there any other 1x3 binning modes in this build? Native 1920x1080 isn't 1x3 is it?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on August 11, 2019, 10:10:14 PM
New build for 700D:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1qnhTArl_DsfyHaLLfQJDPbLD85OBtMxB

-White Level is correct for Analog gain (thanks Danne)
-Now once you load sd_uhs it will patch during start up, no need for script and enabling it manually (thanks Danne)
-There is no 11-bit lossless , it will start from 10-bit lossless to 8-bit lossless depending on ISO (I removed 11-bit lossless to enhance recording time in ISOs 100-800)
-Included Dual ISO fix for ISOless 8 & 15
-Shutter flickering has been fixed (Thanks a1ex)
-Removed Crosshair in crop_rec :D
I forgot a crosshair in that bleeding-edge crop_rec source :) (used it for verifying the centering formulas)

Note: Once you enable crop_rec and change Y or X resolution the actual bit-depth Will be 10-bit lossless , there is no 14-bit lossless (You should always select 14-bit lossless from mlv_lite if you want to use crop_rec in this build , and the final bit-depth will be 10-bit lossless , I did this to enhance recording times and I couldn't figure out how to chose between 14-bit to 12-bit lossless when using crop_rec) and once you disable crop_rec you can use the bit-depths from mlv_lite normally .

How to use 1x3 Binning:
Load crop_rec and restart the camera, activate crop_rec , go to crop_rec submenu by pressing Q button , chose 1x3 Binning , press Menu button to refresh LiveView , That's it! --> To increase the Vertical resolution Just change Y resolution to 2214 (Sweet Spot) and refresh LiveView by pressing Menu button and getting back to LiveView.

Note 2: When you do any change in crop_rec you Must/Should/Have to refresh the LiveView manually ! How? by pressing Menu Button and going back to LiveView otherwise your settings will not be applied , if the settings were saved and crop_rec was activated and you turn on the camera You should also make a refresh .
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on August 11, 2019, 10:37:24 PM
Nice one Bilal!
-Removed Crosshair in crop_rec :D
What´s crosshair :)? So curious.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on August 11, 2019, 11:52:39 PM
(https://preview.ibb.co/hDqiUz/Pixel_binning.png) (https://ibb.co/h57mhK)

This: the Icon in the center "+" , it was showing in LiveView and ML settings once you load crop_rec and without even activate it, it was very annoying same as the mouse on the screen when you are watching a movie :P
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: 70MM13 on August 15, 2019, 01:20:17 PM
I shot a bunch of scenes last night for my next video using dual iso, and while reviewing the footage after converting it overnight using mlvapp, I once again am seeing flickering whenever light levels change.

This is a fatal flaw for any serious work.  I don't know how many people are willing to restrict themselves to filming scenes where the light levels can never change, and the actors are forbidden from walking past a light, shining a light at the camera, playing a piano closeup, casting shadows on bight surfaces, reflecting light off their glasses, etc.

I'm obviously doing something wrong, as always...

Since my reports are always met with hostility and an unwillingness to even acknowledge the issues, I am only adding this repeated report to the record and then leaving it up to someone without this obvious stigma around their neck to check it out for themselves and report it so it may actually get resolved by the powers that be.

In the meantime, I will trash my entire night's work and redo it all at iso 111, which works without "surprises".

any attacks directed at me won't be seen, so don't waste your time - time that should be spent investigating this real problem that exists for people who actually produce real creative works with dual iso.
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Danne on August 15, 2019, 01:27:30 PM
Sample files?
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: theBilalFakhouri on August 15, 2019, 01:51:15 PM
ML is not a paid software , I am facing some problems also with the software I want "someone" to fix it , be a volunteer :D

What MLVApp version do you use ? + Give a sample file as Danne mentioned
Title: Re: Magic Lantern Cinema Camera - Dual ISO without aliasing & without quality loss!
Post by: Jerchongkong on August 19, 2019, 04:02:22 AM
New build for 700D:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1qnhTArl_DsfyHaLLfQJDPbLD85OBtMxB

-White Level is correct for Analog gain (thanks Danne)
-Now once you load sd_uhs it will patch during start up, no need for script and enabling it manually (thanks Danne)
-There is no 11-bit lossless , it will start from 10-bit lossless to 8-bit lossless depending on ISO (I removed 11-bit lossless to enhance recording time in ISOs 100-800)
-Included Dual ISO fix for ISOless 8 & 15
-Shutter flickering has been fixed (Thanks a1ex)
-Removed Crosshair in crop_rec :D
Note: Once you enable crop_rec and change Y or X resolution the actual bit-depth Will be 10-bit lossless , there is no 14-bit lossless (You should always select 14-bit lossless from mlv_lite if you want to use crop_rec in this build , and the final bit-depth will be 10-bit lossless , I did this to enhance recording times and I couldn't figure out how to chose between 14-bit to 12-bit lossless when using crop_rec) and once you disable crop_rec you can use the bit-depths from mlv_lite normally .

How to use 1x3 Binning:
Load crop_rec and restart the camera, activate crop_rec , go to crop_rec submenu by pressing Q button , chose 1x3 Binning , press Menu button to refresh LiveView , That's it! --> To increase the Vertical resolution Just change Y resolution to 2214 (Sweet Spot) and refresh LiveView by pressing Menu button and getting back to LiveView.

Note 2: When you do any change in crop_rec you Must/Should/Have to refresh the LiveView manually ! How? by pressing Menu Button and going back to LiveView otherwise your settings will not be applied , if the settings were saved and crop_rec was activated and you turn on the camera You should also make a refresh .


You can do a build for the 650D Canon, I would like to try all this on my camera and make better videos.