Magic Lantern Forum

General Discussion => General Chat => Topic started by: dynazor on March 22, 2016, 01:51:11 AM

Title: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: dynazor on March 22, 2016, 01:51:11 AM
I'm a 600D user (with ML) for 2 years now.

I'm into making films,
I'm quite satisfied with the codec, it's almost enough for me when I use a flat profile..
But I can't afford lighting mostly and I mostly shoot indoors,
so I was basically always looking for faster glass all the time.
I know it might irritate people but this is the only place I can think of sharing this and discussing thoroughly..
The lenses I currently own:
SMC Takumar 50mm/1.4 (RADS RADS EVERYWHERE!!! XD) - Which is my fastest, but too short for indoors.
Sigma 17-50mm 2.8 VC - My all around lens because it's my only fast wide-angle one, with time this feels very limited
Canon 55-250mm IS II - Usable only in sunlight... (got with the camera, too)
Canon 18-55mm IS (non USM) - kit... too dark, too. (too many "too"s)

Glass gets expensive (for me 100$ is A LOT of money...) with my need of low light performance,
as I already invested in canon-compatible glass.
I see the GH4 and just jealous; I can't afford it, nor the Metabones, nor its little brother the G7...
I know getting performance means getting the money out of my pocket,
but I start thinking that investing hundreds of dollars in glass, just to compensate 600D's sensor,
is a waste.
Should I have upgraded the body prior to buying the 17-50? (which is why I don't have spare money for a year now..)
I'm tired of chasing fast used lenses at bargain prices... (f2.8 is the minimum for me atm)

Currently 3 projects I tried making, got to the point where I sit in front of the editing program and curse the hellish noise in the videos

Please prove me wrong... What solutions do you think are available with no budget?

-I just want to discuss this topic of $$$-vs-Low Light and Video Quality
-I'll probably stay with my 600D until times get better, and I'll keep using ML, maybe wiser if you'll suggest things
Title: Re: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: jtvision on March 22, 2016, 04:32:03 AM
It feels all you need is couple of lights.
Title: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: DeafEyeJedi on March 22, 2016, 04:57:13 AM
Or perhaps you could get yourself a few pairs of lights (from a hardware store) and grab several Gels to diffuse them in order to get that 'soft' look and feel to it. No need No Divas!

Nothing wrong with going into DIY route for budget purposes.
Title: Re: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: QuickHitRecord on March 22, 2016, 08:55:37 AM
You may get more responses in a forum like EOSHD or DVXuser. Magic Lantern is more about the software.

That being said, fast lenses will give you a super shallow depth of field, which when used in a succession of shots is usually a dead giveaway that someone couldn't afford/didn't bother to use any lights, couldn't afford/didn't bother to secure an interesting location, or both. I rarely shoot with aperture faster than f/4.

I think that the other posters have it right. Do an eBay search for "Colortran" or "movie lights". You'll find a lot of affordable options that you can couple with a cheap 5-in-1 diffuser from Amazon to get some pretty good results.
Title: Re: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: PaulHarwood856 on March 22, 2016, 09:28:18 AM
Hey dynazor,

     I completely agree with everyone's suggestions, lighting is key. I would like to add, however, to compensate for the 600D's noise issue, a denoiser.

     I recommend Neat Video, but if you are a student, and on a low budget, you can bargain with Red Giant for Magic Bullet Denoiser for $50 versus $100. I simply chatted with them before purchasing, and they had no problem with it.

    If you aren't a student, I understand, these softwares can be a bit pricy. But, they make a load of difference. I always recommend using low ISOs, but this software works wonders for a situation where you don't have lights and just want to capture that shot.

    That being said, lighting will definitely make your sensor shine. And like you said, using a flat profile will help a lot. I personally use Visiontech.

    By the way, I have the Tamron 17-50 f2.8 VC and absolutely love it for video. Great choice.

    I hope this helps, and please let me know if you have any questions on what I have said.

- Paul Harwood
Title: Re: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: dynazor on March 22, 2016, 10:47:33 AM
Hi thanks for the replies
The main reason light is not in budget is because I usually film in places I have no access to a wall outlet..
And portable power costs alot..
I know I'm a trouble seeker :p but that's how it is for me
Except a denoiser, is there a way to get less noise in camera?
Atm I shoot flat with iso 800, and the noise ruins the shots (even after cc, which is very limited also because of the noise - it actually changes colors of visible areas in the frame)
I currently have a light stand and an adapter to put normal e27 bulbs on it
Problem is - in Israel, because we are committed to save the planet, it's ilegal to sell bulbs that are more than 70w, and all the leds here are cr.p (chinese with fake company labels)
I'll soon try to fix a redhead I found... Wish me luck :p  (it's 800w.. Might just collapse the building's electricity where I shoot the most, and I buy it from china so no indication it's 800w - my only way of getting real light I think)
Title: Re: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: axelcine on March 22, 2016, 02:14:09 PM
Never exceed ISO 1600 with the 600. Manual: Lowest aperture possible, focus in left hand  - NOT auto. 1/25 - 1/50 sec shutter. Lowest contrast profile - rebuild contrast in post. Prepare - and take your time. Redo if necessary.
Seek to film in well-lit surroundings. I bought two $50 building site LED lamps (each ~ 1000W) for indoor lightning. A second-hand 100mm 2.8 at $100? I saw one on eBay recently. I use my nifty-fifty (50 1.8) a lot; it just takes a little more work to get in a good position to shoot. Wish I had a 1.4. Good luck.
Title: Re: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: ansius on March 23, 2016, 07:29:22 AM
flee market is your friend!

On Canon EOS you can adapt many old manual lenses - and for filming that is ok - You can look for m42 mount (Zenit, Praktica), K mount (pentax), and Nikon F lenses. Adapter would cost 5-20$, and manual lenses tend to be cheaper because they are impractical for photography, but are good for video.

As of lights - you either buy them or build them. Kinoflo type lights are pretty easy to build and doesn't require a lot of power, also light is quite nice and soft. youtube is full of DIY solutions for lighting. Sometimes you can find something real cheep that with few modifications would become grate light, so think about that.

Lens wise you are pretty much covered, except you would need like 20mm, 35mm, 85mm fast primes, but in general you are fine. 17-50 2.8 is good for most work, and if it is to dim - only lights can help - going to f/1.4 is only 2 stops, meaning you could go from iso 1600 to 400 but you would have problem focusing, as 2.8 is already hard on that tiny camera screen, and believe me, cinema is not so flat space/shallow depth of field, if not to say opposite. They just can light the place up. Lens and aperture should be a creative decision, not out of exposure.
Title: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: DeafEyeJedi on March 23, 2016, 08:13:29 AM
There was a time when I went to a swap meet and ran into a booth full of old vintage photography stuff including old pre-digital SLR's where I was able to score a few fast lenses for cheap (I mean even a Nikon 50mm 1.4 for $20) and because they are mostly manual only so they usually price them so low (aiming at photographers who enjoy antique collection) and not realizing the actual hidden gem for Video purposes. Try to take advantage of this whenever possible. Very well said @ansius in regards to DIY solutions.
Title: Re: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: kihlbahkt on April 19, 2016, 08:45:24 PM
I also recommend that you seek out non-Canon prime lenses and adapter to fit on 600D. I shoot with 600Ds and I have been using Olympus 28mm (2.8) and 50mm (1.4). Glass that was made in the 1970s. Glass and metal lenses that are built to last. Resale shops, flea markets, and classified ads, like craigslist or other online sources. You might come across someone looking to dump a box of ancient lenses and cam bodies for little to nothing. Buy the whole thing and then grab those yummy primes from days gone by. I also have a 400mm Olympus lens that is literally 18 inches long. Ridiculous. It is for show only at this point, I have shot some photos but it is so unwieldy that is is best seen as a conversation piece only.
good luck dynazor
Title: Re: Can't afford faster lenses for 600D
Post by: keel on April 12, 2017, 09:36:31 PM
PHOTOJOJO led, it is what I use hiking. No idea if this is available in Israel, but if you can get a hold of two of these, and a small sheet of diffusion, it will all fit into your pocket.