Magic Lantern Forum

Using Magic Lantern => Raw Video => Topic started by: mcurran on July 01, 2014, 05:24:22 PM

Title: Monitoring Solutions When Shooting RAW? Is There A 5D Santa Clause?
Post by: mcurran on July 01, 2014, 05:24:22 PM
Shooting a feature film in RAW on Mark III with Magic Lantern - running into tremendous problems seeing shots clearly on the small camera LCD. The director can't see the shot setup very well looking at LCD over cameraman's shoulder and playback is only in slow motion and black and white. What we are seeing in post are problems we could have caught on set but did not because of monitoring limitations.   

Naturally we are still early in the developmental process of shooting RAW on the 5D. We question the existence of a 5D Santa Clause but want to believe he might be out there hiding in the forums.   

Has anyone here found any workable solutions? Is there really a 5D Santa Clause?

From what I am reading, mirroring (simultaneous monitoring on both LCD + HDMI) is possible with Canon's 1.2.3. upgrade, but it is buggy and it knocks out the function menu? Has anyone out there found this to be true? The last thing we need on the set are buggy problems while actors and crew are all in position and we're rolling! 

Is it possible to get full menu function in ML and just go with only an external monitor? If we could monitor on an external monitor in HD full color, even without the LCD, that would greatly solve the problem as the director and cameraman could both watch the monitor while shooting, but if it disables the menu function permanently it seems a moot issue.

Does the menu function work once the HDMI output is disconnected, or is it a thing where the ML menu is disabled permanently?

If none of the above are possible or problematic, then being able to watch the footage shot that day on the set while still on the set,  would be very helpful.

With regards to playback of RAW footage on set, is it possible to load Da Vinci on a laptop and watch the native RAW files directly from a card reader or similar workaround?

We love the look of RAW but would love it more if a reliable, decent monitoring solution could be found - it would be a real Godsend for us here in the midst of a low light horror feature, where gremlins abound and Santa Clause waits patiently somewhere in the 5D chimney.   
     
Title: Re: Monitoring Solutions When Shooting RAW? Is There A 5D Santa Clause?
Post by: Steven on July 01, 2014, 06:53:40 PM
If your shooing schedule is very very packed I would consider a stable camera with a flat log profile and and a proper codec...

If you still want to stick to raw, use the 1.2.3 firmware with fast and stable CF cards (Lexar 1000x, Toshiba 1000x, Sandisk 1000x).
You will be able to use the camera's lcd and an external LCD at full 1080p.
The ML and Canon Menu are working as usual, only any kind of overlay disappears when you plug in the HDMI cable.
Also, if the 5d has some kind of a problem with the connected monitor it might go into some kind of fall back mode
that will disable the 5d's screen an put the hdmi signal into 576p. So better do extensive testing before!

I prefer to record a backup via HDMI to a cheap recorder like the hyperdeck shuttle 2.

When offloading the data from the cards use a checksum checking program.

MLrawViewer is a great tool to play back raw clips directly from the card.



Title: Re: Monitoring Solutions When Shooting RAW? Is There A 5D Santa Clause?
Post by: Midphase on July 01, 2014, 07:23:59 PM
If none of the above are possible or problematic, then being able to watch the footage shot that day on the set while still on the set,  would be very helpful.

With regards to playback of RAW footage on set, is it possible to load Da Vinci on a laptop and watch the native RAW files directly from a card reader or similar workaround?

We love the look of RAW but would love it more if a reliable, decent monitoring solution could be found - it would be a real Godsend for us here in the midst of a low light horror feature, where gremlins abound and Santa Clause waits patiently somewhere in the 5D chimney.   
   

With only 2 posts under your belt, I'd venture to guess that you haven't done a whole lot of reading around these forums. I also have no idea about what you mean by "5D Santa Clause."

The key to successfully shooting in ML raw in a demanding situation is twofold, good monitoring on the set and a capable and knowledgeable DIT. Shooting anything of substance with ML raw without a good DIT on set is a very frustrating experience IMHO.

Regarding good monitoring, I'm talking about a monitor large enough to provide a clear view while also providing much needed focus peaking and zebras.

About the DIT, I mean someone who really knows the tools available such as the excellent MLRawViever and who can provide on set playback quickly and efficiently while also getting a jump on the time consuming conversion process.
Title: Re: Monitoring Solutions When Shooting RAW? Is There A 5D Santa Clause?
Post by: budafilms on August 08, 2014, 08:30:08 AM
Shooting a feature film in RAW on Mark III with Magic Lantern - running into tremendous problems seeing shots clearly on the small camera LCD. The director can't see the shot setup very well looking at LCD over cameraman's shoulder and playback is only in slow motion and black and white. What we are seeing in post are problems we could have caught on set but did not because of monitoring limitations.   

Naturally we are still early in the developmental process of shooting RAW on the 5D. We question the existence of a 5D Santa Clause but want to believe he might be out there hiding in the forums.   

Has anyone here found any workable solutions? Is there really a 5D Santa Clause?

From what I am reading, mirroring (simultaneous monitoring on both LCD + HDMI) is possible with Canon's 1.2.3. upgrade, but it is buggy and it knocks out the function menu? Has anyone out there found this to be true? The last thing we need on the set are buggy problems while actors and crew are all in position and we're rolling! 

Is it possible to get full menu function in ML and just go with only an external monitor? If we could monitor on an external monitor in HD full color, even without the LCD, that would greatly solve the problem as the director and cameraman could both watch the monitor while shooting, but if it disables the menu function permanently it seems a moot issue.

Does the menu function work once the HDMI output is disconnected, or is it a thing where the ML menu is disabled permanently?

If none of the above are possible or problematic, then being able to watch the footage shot that day on the set while still on the set,  would be very helpful.

With regards to playback of RAW footage on set, is it possible to load Da Vinci on a laptop and watch the native RAW files directly from a card reader or similar workaround?

We love the look of RAW but would love it more if a reliable, decent monitoring solution could be found - it would be a real Godsend for us here in the midst of a low light horror feature, where gremlins abound and Santa Clause waits patiently somewhere in the 5D chimney.   
   

You 5D Santa Claus is the build 08-08.
Donate to Santa please! ;)
Title: Re: Monitoring Solutions When Shooting RAW? Is There A 5D Santa Clause?
Post by: Midphase on August 09, 2014, 07:00:29 AM
You 5D Santa Claus is the build 08-08.
Donate to Santa please! ;)

What happened? Please explain...did something new just happen? Can't figure it out from the change logs.
Title: Re: Monitoring Solutions When Shooting RAW? Is There A 5D Santa Clause?
Post by: budafilms on August 09, 2014, 08:02:59 AM
What happened? Please explain...did something new just happen? Can't figure it out from the change logs.

Sure!
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=3072.msg124971#msg124971
Title: Re: Monitoring Solutions When Shooting RAW? Is There A 5D Santa Clause?
Post by: Midphase on August 09, 2014, 08:43:03 AM
Interesting. I'm still somewhat hesitant on jumping on 1.2.3 as I am not sure what specific benefits it has over 1.1.3, but this looks promising.
Title: Re: Monitoring Solutions When Shooting RAW? Is There A 5D Santa Clause?
Post by: budafilms on August 09, 2014, 08:59:34 AM
Interesting. I'm still somewhat hesitant on jumping on 1.2.3 as I am not sure what specific benefits it has over 1.1.3, but this looks promising.

It depends what you do, of course.
The Canon Firmware have some benefits, especially if you use Canon Lenses. The focus it's more precise. Use HDMI outs to external recorder too.
I "feel" more faster.

Respect ML, Like Every software update, the advance are in the newest ;)

I think it's a good time to try. Build works very good.