Author Topic: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView  (Read 110797 times)

a1ex

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #875 on: June 18, 2017, 12:11:50 AM »
Good point about flat frames - they are yet another option for correcting the vertical stripes (alongside with other defects, such as vignette or dirt spots on the sensor or on the lens), and the calibration can be done afterwards.

About Global Draw while recording - the difference I've got on a quick test is pretty small: about 450 vs 500 frames with Preview set to Frozen LV, or about 300 vs 350 frames with Preview Auto, tested in 10-bit uncompressed 1920x800 60p, on 1.2.3, with default overlay configuration - which includes CPU-intensive zebras. That's only one extra second with global draw off, and I'd expect a lower difference on 1.1.3, where zebras are hardware-accelerated.

Kharak

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #876 on: June 18, 2017, 05:04:55 AM »
@Danne,

Thank you very much for the codes.

But the averaging does not work with the 60P Mode files, I tried it on 24p 3x3 Vanilla MLV files and it worked. When I input a 60P file I get "windows has encountered an error" but Command Prompt does not exit or crash. It just generates an empty averaged.mlv

I have tried with short and longer recording times, 1 sec and 6 secs in case it was too little, but its the same. I had the range from 100 - 3200 ISO, 6 MLV files and none of them worked, not the 1 sec or 6 sec MLV's.

I have not tried Normal Lossless 24p 3x3 MLV's, to see if it has something to do with the Lossless mode, I will do that next.

I think the mlv_dump I used is the one from the 3rd or 4th of june (I dont know where to see older builds anymore with the changes on download page) , the one that is 759 KB in size.


@a1ex

I always shoot 14 Bit Lossless 60P 1920x800 with Real-Time Preview and I get about 500-700 Frames and with Pre-Recording ON it was down on 350 Max. Pressing and holding Half-Shutter almost always increase the recording time by atleast 2 seconds (real time). I say "almost" because sometimes but rarely the compression goes crazy, I have many times gotten 10-15 Seconds (real time) recording this way, where I just stop the recording because I probably got the burst shot I was aiming for. Like earlier when I was shooting Lens Cap on for the DF Averaging, first frame it crashed saying Compressed size was bigger than uncompressed. A completely black picture on ISO 100 and it could not compress it.


I have never tried 10 bit mode, but what I see from all the examples it is extremely noisy, perhaps that is why your recording times are so low, maybe the compression goes crazy from all the colour casts 10 bit footage introduces. But yeah.. 10 bit vs 14 bit, mathematically you should have higher record times than I am getting. no?

And why would the difference be lower on 113? I thought fir 113 always had higher performance than 123 because of the extra buffer.
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Danne

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #877 on: June 18, 2017, 07:17:21 AM »
Quote
But the averaging does not work with the 60P Mode files, I tried it on 24p 3x3 Vanilla MLV files and it worked. When I input a 60P file I get "windows has encountered an error" but Command Prompt does not exit or crash. It just generates an empty averaged.mlv
I can confirm lossles 60p 1920x800 yields segmentation fault 11 when trying to create an averaged darkframe.

Workaround:
Decompress your compressed footage prior to darkframe processing. Just tested and working.
Code: [Select]
mlv_dump -d -o OUTPUT.MLV INPUT.MLV

a1ex

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #878 on: June 18, 2017, 08:32:15 AM »
when I was shooting Lens Cap on for the DF Averaging, first frame it crashed saying Compressed size was bigger than uncompressed. A completely black picture on ISO 100 and it could not compress it.

That was a corrupted frame.

http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=19300.msg183115#msg183115

Quote
I have never tried 10 bit mode, but what I see from all the examples it is extremely noisy, perhaps that is why your recording times are so low

I've only used it in order to get constant bitrate. With lossless compression, the recording times will vary a lot with scene contents (so it's harder to benchmark this way; a static scene or a dark frame will make things a bit more repeatable in this case, but I didn't want the extra trouble.)

Quote
maybe the compression goes crazy from all the colour casts 10 bit footage introduces.

I thought I've mentioned "uncompressed"...

Quote
But yeah.. 10 bit vs 14 bit, mathematically you should have higher record times than I am getting. no?

No.

10 < 14
10 > 14 * 60%

Quote
And why would the difference be lower on 113? I thought fir 113 always had higher performance than 123 because of the extra buffer.

The cause is lower CPU usage on both Canon's side (regardless of ML settings), and on ML's side (only when Luma-based zebras are used). Memory bandwidth usage might also be a bit higher on 1.2.3 on Canon's side (didn't check this one, as it's not straightforward to measure). Of course, absolute performance can be higher both with and without global draw, but the difference between these numbers is likely lower (that is, global draw even faster on 1.1.3) iff you use Luma-based zebras (which is the default). I didn't benchmark these cases; it's just what I'd expect to happen.

Kharak

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #879 on: June 18, 2017, 05:04:59 PM »
@Danne,

Yes, now it worked generating averaged.mlv and outputting DNG but it is a very tedious process, having to decompress every file individually, rename it, move it to the appropriate folder... So the next big question, how do I batch process this ? Some command I should know? :)

Or atleast batch the decompression part. After decompression I see all the Metadata, ISO, fstop and so on in the MLV's. That way I can sort the MLV's with the same ISO's to their appropriate folders and do the DFA from there.

After DNG conversion, the metadata is lost again. a bug ?



I thought I've mentioned "uncompressed"...

Apologies, that slipped through.

Quote
No.

10 < 14
10 > 14 * 60%

I don't understand this sorry, 10bit is smaller than 14bit, 10bit is bigger than 14bit at 60% do you mean with the lossless compression? Is there less to compress from 10 bits ?

Sorry for my silly questions all the time, but I do appreciate very much you taking your time explaining these things, so that I know what is going under the hood.

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Danne

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #880 on: June 18, 2017, 05:09:27 PM »
Cr2hdr.app batch processes both decompression and darkframe processing. Mac. Someone with an interest in windows scripting can do the same.

a1ex

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Danne

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #882 on: June 18, 2017, 05:56:11 PM »
By the way. With latest version of mlv_dump on steroids(Bouncyball) the -b switch will work exporting different bits. Good for comparing let's say 14bit file into 8bit dng's.
Code: [Select]
mlv_dump -b 8 --dng Input.MLV

Savely

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #883 on: June 18, 2017, 09:13:04 PM »
Quote
Good point about flat frames
What was the point about flat frames? It's just some coding stuff that didn't yet exist as some executable for Windows users? I'm really interesting about vertical stripes problem cause I have horrible ones (at the sky usually)



 is there a way to get rid of it for Win users?

Danne

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #884 on: June 18, 2017, 09:47:59 PM »
Please use search function. Flat frame or flatframe.
The function exists in mlv_dump which is the same for both windows and mac.
Flat frame workflow isn't trivial. I experimented with it some a while ago but there is more to test out.
Here is one link
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=17795.msg175189#msg175189

g3gg0

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #885 on: June 18, 2017, 09:53:05 PM »
1. take a "flat field" video
  a) put a white shirt over lens
  b) point to the bright sky
  c) record using the same settings as before (same exposure time not strictly needed, but would keep the ISO)
2. average that video using the -a option (e.g. mlv_dump movie.mlv -a -o flat.mlv)
3. process the problematic footage and supply this flat.mlv as flatfield (e.g. mlv_dump in.mlv -t flat.mlv -o out.mlv)

Savely

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #886 on: June 18, 2017, 11:29:39 PM »
Danne, g3gg0 thanks a lot, I will try and will make some tests

g3gg0

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #887 on: June 18, 2017, 11:38:30 PM »
btw.
to only pick the vertical stripes instead of lens speckles and vignetting also, you can add --avg-vertical when creating the flat.mlv
didn't try any of those on my own :)

but that could also introduce some weird left/right bar due to vignetting.
probably not a good thing when you have the lens on

D_Odell

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #888 on: June 19, 2017, 02:29:30 AM »
Anyone who have footage of 1920x1080 @ 45p and 48p (3x3 binning)? I have tried to pull it of but images results in black blocks or other faults. Anyone?

Edit: tried in Canon menu All-I 50p and 48p in FPS ovettige and reciewed this massages:


Edit 2: Changed to 45p now worked a bit better. Got 7xx frames before stoped.

Edit 3: You who managed to record 45p and used it in a NLE, how much did you slow it down? Since 48p is really simple with 24p timeline. I tried to slow it down with 53% and it seemed ok. Any thoughts?
5D3 (OLPF removed) :: 1.1.3 :: Canon FD L Serie

Oedipax

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #889 on: June 19, 2017, 10:00:17 PM »
Edit 3: You who managed to record 45p and used it in a NLE, how much did you slow it down? Since 48p is really simple with 24p timeline. I tried to slow it down with 53% and it seemed ok. Any thoughts?
I think the easiest (in Premiere / After Effects) would be to conform the clip (using the Interpret/Modify command) to 23.976 or 25p depending on your edit needs. Then you won't have to figure out the exact right clip slow-down rate and it will probably be cleaner looking than slowing the clip back down with the NLE, which runs the risk of blending frames or having to generate new ones if it's not dead-on. Hope that made sense :)

D_Odell

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #890 on: June 19, 2017, 11:52:52 PM »
I think the easiest (in Premiere / After Effects) would be to conform the clip (using the Interpret/Modify command) to 23.976 or 25p depending on your edit needs. Then you won't have to figure out the exact right clip slow-down rate and it will probably be cleaner looking than slowing the clip back down with the NLE, which runs the risk of blending frames or having to generate new ones if it's not dead-on. Hope that made sense :)
That made excellent help! Works good in ae also. What shutter speed do you use? At first I left it at 94, but will probably go up to 180 next time? As one can see its quite blurry, also shot from a train...:





Also, anyone notised the black pixel line in bottom and to the left? If so anyone made it correct?
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Kharak

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #891 on: June 20, 2017, 04:12:33 AM »
@a1ex, @g3gg0, @danne

I am thinking if the 60p mode is stressing the sensor so much that it is making the Vertical Stripes more prevalent than  24p 3x3? Is that a possibility? I am saying this because normally I didn't have issues with Vertical Stripes when I was shooting 24p, sometimes I would get some in highlights after heavy grade, but after getting addicted to 60p I am seeing a lot of shots with Vertical Stripes.

And I am not seeing Vertical Stripe fix working properly with 60p footage. These shots have the same exposure and lighting across the entire recording and yet the Vertical Stripes are still there. In the first screenshot its harder to see the the lines, but when playing the recording as this is a Slow pan shot, it becomes very visible. in shot 2 its much more visible, I also zoomed 200%.

Shot 1
https://mega.nz/#!QdpETRZR!_y6mdX7ZWGkVisIamJLLAeyss9uzdsEdMtn3TgETlTc  - Screenshot from AE - ISO 200
The jpeg compression is hiding it in this shot, look furthest to the left, some remnants of the stripes are there.

Shot 2
https://mega.nz/#!wAhwzawJ!jirFfeb5WrvW6YdZ6S9ubqsXbdKTItaw1oGboUQKDh4 - Cropped - ISO 200. Here you can see them.

FYI: In this case, activating Stripe removal on the DNG's in MLRawViewer removed the stripes, but introduced big chunky vertical lines from all the shadow parts of the image.

This same shot without Darkframe Averaging makes the Vertical Stripes less prevalent, but still there, its as if the deep blacks from Darkframe averaging is enhancing the stripes or the contrast of the stripes.

My point with this post is that I think that mlv_dump stripe removal might need some optimization for 60p mode, I might be wrong and doing something wrong in the process introducing this problem myself, I'd love to be proven so. But its a big issue for the 60p mode.

Just a guess here, but when decompressing, is it also doing vertical stripe fix? and then converting to DNG the same process is done again introducing the stripes again? I don't see any text saying so when decompressing, but just a thought.

Anyone else shooting 60p having issues with Vertical Stripes?

Thank you for your time.
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Danne

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #892 on: June 20, 2017, 05:50:01 AM »
Could you post an example MLV with stripes?
Are you sure vertical stripe code is running on all clips?

reddeercity

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #893 on: June 20, 2017, 08:40:26 AM »
Thanks for your answer, but as you can see in my picture :
all my DNG sequence are mixed in a same folder; i see you are using windows 7, maybe this issue is only about windows 10.
Ok  --I see the issue .
So to anyone that want to use the new mlv_dump.exe on Windows platform to batch your UHD/4K/10-12bit & compressed14bit mlv's in to separated file folder.
First I thought of making a .bat (win7) & or .cmd (win10) (really the same thing) but I had problems with importing more one file at a time
(to much code and getting too complex) . Then I considered building a simple .exe batch program , then it dawn on me why I'm I trying to
re-invent the wheel here  ::) , so after a quick search I found a Older Win's app that uses mlv_dump.exe . MLVConverter1.9.2.zip
MLV Converter 1.9.2 for WINDOWS You will need some other tool if you want to have it fully functional --Adobe DNG Converter , mlrawviewer (only to view file not working work compressed raw) & IrfanView .
All I did was to replace the mlv_dump that there with the new mlv_dump from the experimental download page , installed the latest  Adobe DNG Converter (to output compressed dng's)
and  IrfanView . I tested 14 mlv's files which included 10-12bit , 14bit, UHD(3520x1320) compressed raw 14bit and all exported fine in to the respected folders . The dng's import ok in to
After Effect CS6 (Wins) didn't try any other app . *Note* in the tools folder you have (3) mlv_dump's (mlv_dump , mlv_dump1 & mlv_dump2) just copy the new mlv_dump and re-name it
mlv_dump1 etc. .... that's it should work fully from there with 1080p proxy you can add a customs .xmp file from A.E. and have it export to ffmpeg prores4444 if you wish .
If you want to export Dual ISO you need to update  cr2hdr.exe to the latest windows version.
One thing windows will ask permission to run mlv_dump on every file unless you go the properties and in the general tab check "UnBlock" at least on Win7 , win10 should be the same
Hope that helps :D
Edit: update exiftool.exe also

mlv raw converter1
by RedDeerCityTV, on Flickr

mlv raw converter2
by RedDeerCityTV, on Flickr

mlv raw converter3
by RedDeerCityTV, on Flickr


pc_bel

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #894 on: June 20, 2017, 10:42:58 AM »
@reddeercity
Thank you very much!!!

But... I'm on windows 10 now and mlv_dump processes mlv files in separate folders when I select all and use the "send to" comand found here http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=10526.msg102123#msg102123

pc_bel

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #895 on: June 20, 2017, 11:27:12 AM »
Anyway,
I think that using the workflow reddeercity suggest, you have a lot of advantages. Now I'm using it!!
Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!

Oedipax

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #896 on: June 20, 2017, 05:32:45 PM »
That made excellent help! Works good in ae also. What shutter speed do you use? At first I left it at 94, but will probably go up to 180 next time? As one can see its quite blurry, also shot from a train...:



I usually go by the 180-degree shutter rule of thumb, where the shutter speed is 2x that of your framerate. 24fps = 1/48 (or 1/50), and so on. So if you are shooting 45P, 1/90 (or 1/94 if that's what is available) on the shutter should be a good starting place. If it's still too blurry for your liking, you could keep pushing it further like 1/120 or 1/250 and see if you like that additional clarity.

Kharak

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #897 on: June 20, 2017, 07:40:59 PM »
Could you post an example MLV with stripes?
Are you sure vertical stripe code is running on all clips?

Perhaps tomorrow or the day after I'll have access to high speed internet. I will send you a MLV.

Yes, mlv_dump says Vertical Stripe Correction and those numbers appear aswell.

Just saw that Bouncyball made a new version of mlv_dump on steroids --force stripes could be a solution?
once you go raw you never go back


Kharak

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Re: crop_rec on steroids: 3K, 4K, 1080p48, full-resolution LiveView
« Reply #899 on: June 22, 2017, 02:34:26 AM »
No I have not tried flat field yet.

Current conditions are not ideal to make a flat frame. But I will try it out, for sure.

On another note, the --force-stripes has done a terrific job at removing the stripes, there are stripes, but virtually invisible. But it is slow.. Very slow.. Also with no batch process I am seeing a lot of issues ahead. I have a music video coming up, that I wanted to shoot all 60p, but with so many manual steps, decompressing and sorting, converting and having to stay glued at the screen to start next process when one is done, I am feeling like this is way too much to handle. Blaaah..

Screenshot with diagonal split -
https://mega.nz/#!QFYSwZRC!cpK0HV0lpmVNR5JAtETDqA7e5rGMb7LEieT8JGeYGQs

I hope the jpeg compression will do it enough justice for you to see. I did not do darkframe subtraction on the --forced-stripe footage. Did not look in to how I could do both with the Steroids_dump
 

Do you think the flat frame would be a quicker step ? It will also require sorting, even more so I assume, each lens to its own? each f-stop to its own ? Darkframe+Flatframe sounds like the ultimate quality we can get with our Canons, but it seems overly complicated for a project shot with multiple lenses at various f-stops and having some manual lenses, it will be hard matching f-stops to the right flatframe and on top of that having to write in the commands for each shot is very tedious. For photography, it seems like a no-brainer though.

@danne
I'll have 3G access tomorrow, I'll send you the mlv.
once you go raw you never go back