Update by RenatoPhoto:
To install ML on 650D follow the original thread here:
Canon 650D/T4i 1.0.4 [Status: Alpha]
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=7473.msg63845#msg63845
Use this thread to discuss RAW Video on 650D
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I was just wondering if you, guys, think that something close to 1920x720 recording might be possible on the 650D / 700D with their SDXC support, when and if they get the RAW firmware .
I'd like to know too :) especially for 700d, if its UHS-I compatible and support full 90 mbps speed it might be more interesting with continuous autofocus feature compared to 50d...
I can't decide wether to sell my 600d and get 700d or keep 600d and buy 50d as well...
600D + 50D sounds like a winner. One w/ H264 + audio, other with Raw.
Thanks for tip! I'm keen on this solution as well...
Forget the 650D, it can only do 1280x560 pixels at 24p
Quote from: Viente on May 29, 2013, 12:34:30 AM
I'd like to know too :) especially for 700d, if its UHS-I compatible and support full 90 mbps speed it might be more interesting with continuous autofocus feature compared to 50d...
I can't decide wether to sell my 600d and get 700d or keep 600d and buy 50d as well...
it can not handle 90MB/s, I've read the spec sheet of SD controller, you can get max 50MB/s on EOS M, 650D & 700D.
Quote from: 1% on May 29, 2013, 12:47:57 AM
600D + 50D sounds like a winner.
600D + 50D = 650D? ;D
(Just a really poor joke ... couldn't resist :D)
Well. Like qsara said: The 650D and 700D should be too slow to handle 1920 X 720 14-bit raw video at 24 frames per second. This would require 55 Megabyte/s write speed, but it doesn't look like these cameras will be able to get that. Especially since the max. LiveView resolution should be 1734 X 1156 like on the 60D/600D/550D ;D
So even if the cards could handle 1920 width, it wouldn't be possible.
At the moment the 50D looks like the best option for "cheap" raw recording. Maybe the 70D will have a CF card slot again. That would be amazing.
Quote from: qsara on May 29, 2013, 04:22:20 PM
it can not handle 90MB/s, I've read the spec sheet of SD controller, you can get max 50MB/s on EOS M, 650D & 700D.
Does the 700D share the same controller as the 650D? Where did you get that info?
Quote from: nanomad on May 29, 2013, 05:03:55 PM
Does the 700D share the same controller as the 650D? Where did you get that info?
on a french facebook page about canon's new cameras, I'll look for a link.
Quote from: CFP on May 29, 2013, 04:39:29 PM
600D + 50D = 650D? ;D
(Just a really poor joke ... couldn't resist :D)
Well. Like qsara said: The 650D and 700D should be too slow to handle 1920 X 720 14-bit raw video at 24 frames per second. This would require 55 Megabyte/s write speed, but it doesn't look like these cameras will be able to get that. Especially since the max. LiveView resolution should be 1734 X 1156 like on the 60D/600D/550D ;D
So even if the cards could handle 1920 width, it wouldn't be possible.
At the moment the 50D looks like the best option for "cheap" raw recording. Maybe the 70D will have a CF card slot again. That would be amazing.
if the seller accepts, I'll give one of my 550D to exchange with 50D, of course, I'll have to give my cheap 75-300 III too (which is useless lately)
1280x560 is maximum i could get on my 650D with UHS-I card. It seems that controller is limited to 30-40mb/s which is poor
but 1280x560 looks great, even upscaled !
Can the 600D do a continuous 1280x560 for several minutes? Or is it going to be a short burst of a few seconds then stop or have to catch up with buffers? I also thought the 500-650 were all stuck at 21mbps? Which cameras support the UHS-1 (50mbps?) speeds? I have an SDXC card, only 133X (not sure what that translates into). 1280x560 is pretty good if it can do so continuously in 14-bit RAW.
Did a little looking and it looks like the 600D t3i (and later) support the 100Mhz bus speed (50MBp/s) UHS-1. That's more than 2x the speed of what I was reading about the other day, which said the T2i/3i/4i would be stuck at 21mbp/s speeds thus limited to 960x540. Too bad we can't get a full 1280x720 RAW going! So it looks like on amazon about $60 or so for a 45Mbp/s 64GB UHS-1 SDXC card. I see Sandisk and Lexar cards.. hope those are good enough for this RAW recording?
600D is not UHS-I compatible though, unfortunately. I think the 650D is... But it may have/does have other bottle necks preventing it from writing that fast.
I've got a 95mb/s Sandisk 16gb card, that bangs on the 20-21mb/s limit with my 600D.
Vs 50-70mb/s that I get with the 50D & CF card so far...
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3140278
This is what I read (and another thread can't find it now) that seemed to me that the T3i would support the 45mb/s UHS-1. If the max is 21Mb/s then we're not going to do no better than a very low detailed 960x540, which is 1/4 HD. I would think if this is the best resolution we can do, using HDMI out uncompressed to my Shuttle 2 at 1620x1080 would result in better quality. It's not RAW, but it's almost 4x the detail.
I gotta ask, I know RAW stores various meta info, and it does give you some advantages in post, but is the quality of uncompressed RAW vs uncompressed HDMI out that much superior in post? I seem to be able to do some color correction and such with H.264, I would think that even without the RAW info, the uncompressed video out of HDMI out would be "close" to as good, and with almost 4x more detail due to resolution, I would then think it would be even better.
Here's the thing though... the 'real' resolution from H264 isnt 4x as much or probably even twice as much, or less.
I cant remember the exact resolutions, but it takes the original raw data from the sensor, then creates a downscaled raw image (presumably the raw file we're poaching) then squashes it down to a resolution of approximately 1000 lines across, and then stretches it back out to 1920x1080 and encodes it in h264. As best I know more or less the same applies when recording to an external device, the footage has already been through this process of getting mashed around before it makes it out of the HDMI port.
When people dont want to upsample from a smaller clip because they'd rather not lose resolution... They arent necessarily getting any more resolution from a full sized 1080p 'Canon' shot anyway. But they are definitely getting worse colours/highlights etc.
Quote from: Roman on June 03, 2013, 02:43:12 AMI cant remember the exact resolutions, but it takes the original raw data from the sensor
It was 1732 X 974. Canon rezises that a few times, applies some chroma subsampling, applies some bad sharpen and noise reduction algorithms and finally compress it using the H.264 codec. :( They really know how to screw up an image ;D
That's why even 0.5 Megapixel RAW videos are looking sharper than Canon's default H.264 videos, although they have
really heavy aliasing.
And it's true that the EOS 600D/Rebel T3i is compatible with SDHC and SDXC cards
but it can't use their write speeds. The SD-controller is limited to 21.3 Megabyte/s write speed. If the 650D and 700D have a write speed limit of ~ 40 Megabyte/s they'll probably be able to record 1280 X 720 (Requires 37 Megabyte/s write speed at 24 frames/second) wich is 2 times the resolution of what the 600D can get! Don't complain about that.
Still, the 50D can record 1590 X 890 at 24 frames/second and has a really lovely look. And it can use the full width of its sensor so you don't get higher crop factors than 1.6. If audio and flipscreen aren't needed, a 50D might be the best option for RAW videos for less than 1000 €. I'm curious to see how well it compares to the BMPCC ...
If (and it's a big "if") we'll have 12 or 10 bit raw recording true, than bitrates shrink a lot and 650/700D become best options, giving swivel screen, audio and potentially 1734 X 1156 raw video feed.
Only 5DMIII could beat them in this scenario.
Quote from: riccardocovino on June 03, 2013, 11:46:55 AM
If (and it's a big "if") we'll have 12 or 10 bit raw recording true, than bitrates shrink a lot and 650/700D become best options, giving swivel screen, audio and potentially 1734 X 1156 raw video feed.
Only 5DMIII could beat them in this scenario.
Hoping for this :D
Even if we'll get 12 / 10 / 8 bit compression, 1728 X 960 would only be possible with 8-bit. And that would probably kill the dynamic range.
In 10-bit it would require 47 Megabyte/s write speed. That's simply to much for our tiny Rebel cameras :(
The 50D can actually record 1592 X 1062 14-bit RAW videos already. Once the developers find a way to increase the write speed from the current 60 Megabyte/s to the maximal possible 91 Megabyte/s the 50D could even record 1920 X 1080 14-bit in crop mode.
Since the audio on the Rebels isn't really great anyway I would say get a 50D or a BMPCC if you're searching for a cheap RAW camera.
But I am really hoping that Canon equips the 70D with a CF card slot again. Then it would be able to handle 1728 X 960 14-bit raw videos or maybe even higher resolutions.
Or maybe the developers can find a way to access the lossless huffman compression that is used to compress the usual CR2 RAW stills.
That would save between 10% - 50% file size without loosing quality ...
So what? No one tried RAW on 650D?
Youtube has a lot of sample raw videos, and here I can't find any, even can't find an official 650D raw thread (except this one)...
It have been tryed, and I have tried it myself. But the main bug is that the contrast-focuspoints is showing up on the pictures. You'll find discussions and examples in the main 650D Alpha thread: http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6320.0
Quote from: CFP on June 03, 2013, 08:42:52 PM
The 50D can actually record 1592 X 1062 14-bit RAW videos already. Once the developers find a way to increase the write speed from the current 60 Megabyte/s to the maximal possible 91 Megabyte/s the 50D could even record 1920 X 1080 14-bit in crop mode.
They unlocked 70mbs recentely, I took some crop footage at 2000*824 yesterday. Havig this crop mode is really nice, it means you can sell all your telephoto ;) and unlike the blackmagic pocket cinema camera you can still have wide FOV at almost 1600px, wich looks really really sharp compared to old H264. I sold my 550D for a 50D and I'm really happy of the switch!
Quote from: vicnaum on June 15, 2013, 09:36:58 AM
So what? No one tried RAW on 650D?
Youtube has a lot of sample raw videos, and here I can't find any, even can't find an official 650D raw thread (except this one)...
I tried, but it is to much work for 500 small frames with artifacts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Cwz_WGEGHk
Please find a way to record at least 720p raw. i just saw how good raw videos look like and my jaw dropped on the floor. (i'm a newb 650d user)
i've read it up there 650d/700d has 50mb/s writing speed so it should be possible to have 720p raw :|
Please make it happen, beg ya. :'(
Okay, i have managed to record my raw videos. i tested my 650d with 2 sd cards.
First one was a toshiba exceria 16gb 30mb/sec write speed. it recorded 1280x580 or something (not remember exactly) quite well. but for 26secs.
Second one was a Sony Sd card with 45ms/sec write speed. and i managed to record 1280x640 without frame skipping for 26 seconds again. after that camera shutted itself off. and i tried 1280x720 and it was going well for 7-9 seconds after that frame skipping started and if i remember correctly it skipped 13frames and recorded near ~400.
so i think the first problem is with the buffer size, yes? because after 26-27 seconds the camera shuts itself down...
@midnight:
Do you have the "automatic turn off" function of the camera on?
It could be possible that recording RAW video is not noticed by the Canon firmware so it shuts itself of after 30 seconds of no use.
You can find this setting in the menu, if you go to the second screw-wrench. Standart would be 30 seconds.
I don't see any reason why the camera should shut down otherwise. Full buffer would just cause the video recording to stop, or to slow down, similar to the burst mode with stills. (if I am not wrong)
Quote from: _DK_ on June 21, 2013, 04:18:02 PM
@midnight:
Do you have the "automatic turn off" function of the camera on?
It could be possible that recording RAW video is not noticed by the Canon fimrware so it shuts itself of after 30 seconds of no use.
You can find this setting in the menu, if you go to the second screw-wrench. Standart would be 30 seconds.
I don't see any reason why the camera should shut down otherwise. Full buffer would just cause the Video recording to stop, or to slow down, similar to the burst mode with stills. (if I am not wrong)
solved! http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6320.msg53598#msg53598
thanks, you too!
Using a1ex's method with an exfat formatted sony 45mb/s sd card, i managed to record 20 seconds of 720p video with 650d.
you can go on forever with a proper UHS-I card and 24p :)
WOW! Thank you so much!
That is amazing! continuous RAW recording in 720p ;D I wonder if a Sandisk extreme 45MB/s is enough for that?
Now the only thing that could be beter are the red dots. But they seem to be already pretty managable.
I am so exicted right now, but due to my lag of experience with ML (650D is my first DSLR) I fear breaking something, so I guess will wait a while. Maybe until a tutorial with video instructions on how to properly set it up and enable RAW, but I guess at least for beta...
Quote from: nanomad on June 22, 2013, 12:24:25 PM
you can go on forever with a proper UHS-I card and 24p :)
What do you mean with "proper"? like 90mb/s writing speed? that would be awesome!!!1!
Quick test: enable fps override, low light 5 FPS, record a 720p raw video and see what speed it says. If it's around 39 then it's all good
Hi,
Incredible work being done here. 720p RAW continuous on a 650D!!! I'm in! :)
I have a few questions:
1. It seems that the 650D will handle exFAT formatted SDXC cards. http://www.photoplusmag.com/2013/01/08/free-canon-memory-card-compatibility-chart/ (http://www.photoplusmag.com/2013/01/08/free-canon-memory-card-compatibility-chart/). Do the developers think that these cards will make a difference on the 650D given yesterdays news on the 6D dev forum re. exFAT format cards: http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=3904.2275 (http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=3904.2275). Or they think that the 650D bandwidth limits will prevent this impacting on write performance? I'm thinking of getting a Transcend 64GB Ultimate SDXC UHS-I 600x 45Mbs write speed card.
2. Will there be a ML RAW format with a low res audio guide track embedded? Even with external digital audio tracks it can be useful to have a guide track when editing? Or SMPTE timecode maybe? Or is that just too old fashioned...
3. Out of interest, what is left to do on the 650D port before it goes to Beta status?
Cheers,
saul
If the SD controller (read MX25L6436EM2I-10G - Macronix somewhere here on the forum) can run up to 104MHZ, wouldn't that mean that it could max out at 52MB/s? That would enable resolutions of up to about 1920x640, no? Or do I have my wires crossed?
Well, the key word is up to :p right now we can achieve 40. Some speed is lost due to CPU usage I think
Is the RAW module being developed along with the Alpha build or does the 650D alpha build just use the module already being developed in unified?
I wonder, why this thread is so small. Is the SD-Card controller from 650d really two times faster than 600d? And 720p@24 is possible? That is what the 550/600d user dreaming for ...
Quote from: frontloop on June 25, 2013, 10:46:12 AM
I wonder, why this thread is so small. Is the SD-Card controller from 650d really two times faster than 600d? And 720p@24 is possible? That is what the 550/600d user dreaming for ...
Yeah...It does kind of seem like the 650D is getting looked over in the RAW aspects of ML compared to other cameras. However, this development has been moving incredibly fast (including the dev of ML for 650D alone) so it probably needs a bit of time to grow some attention.
How is the behavior at 1536x656? That is what 600d making with 11,988fps very good.
Since it requires only 41 Megabyte/s write speed 1536x656 at 24 frames/seconds should be possible on the 650D. At least for more than a few seconds.
I think this thread isn't as big as the others because the 650D wasn't in the 2.3 stable release. So many people are still thinking that Magic Lantern doesn't work on the camera.
Quote from: AgentJJ on June 24, 2013, 11:03:40 PM
Is the RAW module being developed along with the Alpha build or does the 650D alpha build just use the module already being developed in unified?
650D uses the unified RAW module. There is some 650D support required for the module to work, like defining where the necessary functions are in the Canon firmware.
Quote from: CFP on June 25, 2013, 03:28:09 PM
Since it requires only 41 Megabyte/s write speed 1536x656 at 24 frames/seconds should be possible on the 650D. At least for more than a few seconds.
"Should be possible" is a funny thing when it comes to software/hardware performance. 41 MB/s is the average write speed over some amount of time. There is no accounting for variance. If the write speed slows down for a few frames, you don't keep up with the buffer and drop a frame. Also, that statistic, I believe, is gathered using a different method of writing to the SD card than RAW video. No matter what math you do, it can only do what it does.
There may be some optimizations available somewhere, somehow, but the code looks pretty straight forward. Copy to buffer, write buffer to disk. Getting other stuff out of the way (off of CPU) may be the best option for improving performance.
Quote from: dngrhm on June 25, 2013, 04:34:41 PM
Getting other stuff out of the way (off of CPU) may be the best option for improving performance.
Which makes me wonder:
Is it possible to create a Magic Latern version with only RAW and very essential controls? Just for RAW video shooting?
Quote from: dngrhm on June 25, 2013, 04:34:41 PMIf the write speed slows down for a few frames, you don't keep up with the buffer and drop a frame.
With a good SD-Card you'll get constant write speeds. So I'm not sure what it is that you want to tell me. And what does this have to do with any statistics or math? 1536 X 656 14-bit RAW videos at 24 frames/s requires 41 Megabyte/s (1536 X 656 X 14 / 8 X 24 = 42,319,872 bytes). That's a fact. At least until the developers find a way to compress the videos.
The developers also said that making a "RAW-only" build won't inrease the performence at all.
The biggest improvement would be a (lossless) compression of the videos. But I doubt that we'll see that soon in any DSLR.
Quote from: CFP on June 26, 2013, 12:48:24 AM
1536 X 656 14-bit RAW videos at 24 frames/s requires 41 Megabyte/s (1536 X 656 X 14 / 8 X 24 = 42,319,872 bits).
That's math. I didn't say the card was the problem. A 95MB/s card still runs at 41 because of the hardware not the card. Let me backtrack a bit and say that no, just reducing CPU load will not improve RAW video. However, to run additional processing on the RAW video you will need CPU cycles for it. Whether you are chopping off the 2-4 LSB (which sound like crazy bit-shifting nightmares) or trying to find the "Huffman encoding" used for RAW (cropped RAW? which has been labeled as a camera crasher), you will still need to fit that time somewhere to shrink the data to fit through your approximately 41MB/s pipe.
i have got a 45mb/s sd and its maximum writing speed is ~33mb/s on my 650d. i've read it somewhere here, with a 90mb/s card you are going to have that maximum writing speed 0f ~40mb/s (or whatever it is) because of the stability. i hope i am clear enough.
it is like; a 45mb/s card's maximum writing speed is 45mb/s. it does not mean it will write data continuesly on 45mb/s. it may drop to 13-15mb/s. that is why i'm not getting 40mb/s (writing limit) on my camera.
Quote from: midnite on June 26, 2013, 08:21:56 AM
i have got a 45mb/s sd and its maximum writing speed is ~33mb/s on my 650d.
Is that running the benchmark in video mode or photo mode? Try both and see if there is a difference. I think you can run RAW video in photo mode with live view turned on.
EDIT: From the old 650D thread...
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=3697.msg43310#msg43310
Quote from: dngrhm on June 26, 2013, 03:32:09 PM
Is that running the benchmark in video mode or photo mode? Try both and see if there is a difference. I think you can run RAW video in photo mode with live view turned on.
EDIT: From the old 650D thread...
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=3697.msg43310#msg43310
"Raw video Works only in Video Mode" this is what ML info says. Yes i got those numbers in VideoMode.
this is my benchmark result:
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=do709f&s=5
this is the maximum quality of raw video i can have.
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2jcwzsp&s=5
this is "1" step better quality of raw video. as you can see it is in yellow text. which means it skips frames after some time.
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2qc194x&s=5
Can some one tell me how to install ML in 700D
Quote from: mohanplays on June 26, 2013, 09:01:39 PM
Can some one tell me how to install ML in 700D
Read this...
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5951.0
Quote from: spider on June 15, 2013, 11:32:25 PM
I tried, but it is to much work for 500 small frames with artifacts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Cwz_WGEGHk
I am happy now.
About 500 frames in 720p24 with my 33MB/s Card and a great tool for removing the dots http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6658.msg55543#new
I was able to record 720p without having to resize post processing.
i am not sure if it is user error (prob), rawdng, or ML build (june 27), but i came across a small bug/glitch.
I didnt have any notification on liveview of any frame skipping, but when i was converting the raw file to dng, it said frame skipping: 1 on one of the command lines.
I had the following settings:
Res: 1280x720
Frame skipping: off
FPS override: 23.973
total frames was a little over 2500
below is the outcome in very quick post processing. each time the lap button was pressed is about 1gb of footage
screenshots below:
(http://i42.tinypic.com/6oec0p.jpg)
(http://i44.tinypic.com/8vw9ah.jpg)
(http://i40.tinypic.com/4grux3.jpg)
i just bought a "32gb Sandisk Extreme Pro Sd 95mb/s" and i've made some tests with it.
now i can record 1579frames (1minute 4-5 seconds) of 1280x720p raw until it skips a frame.
i use the ML build 14.06.13 and raw_rec.mo is made in 21.06.13
i ll make some tests with newer builds soon. nanomad has said 1280x720p continious is possible with a decent sd card but i couldnt make it. (i don't know if sandisk extreme pro 95mb/s isn't decent what is...)
edit: i just tested satriani's 28.06.13 build and got 1860frames.
Quote from: midnite on June 29, 2013, 04:48:21 PM
i just bought a "32gb Sandisk Extreme Pro Sd 95mb/s" and i've made some tests with it.
now i can record 1579frames (1minute 4-5 seconds) of 1280x720p raw until it skips a frame.
i use the ML build 14.06.13 and raw_rec.mo is made in 21.06.13
i ll make some tests with newer builds soon. nanomad has said 1280x720p continious is possible with a decent sd card but i couldnt make it. (i don't know if sandisk extreme pro 95mb/s isn't decent what is...)
edit: i just tested satriani's 28.06.13 build and got 1860frames.
wow so its a big difference between sandisk 45mbs and 95mbs
Ok iwill invest that card.
1860/24=77, 5sec
1860frame 720p24 without drop frames? Or it records continously after that?
Quote from: mdfaisal on June 29, 2013, 05:51:50 PM
wow so its a big difference between sandisk 45mbs and 95mbs
Ok iwill invest that card.
1860/24=77, 5sec
1860frame 720p24 without drop frames? Or it records continously after that?
720p 1860frames without dropping. it dropped the 1861th frame. :)
i used to record ~20seconds with my 45mb/s card until drop a frame.
yeah 95mb/s is a huge improvement.
Quote from: midnite on June 29, 2013, 06:24:46 PM
720p 1860frames without dropping. it dropped the 1861th frame. :)
i used to record ~20seconds with my 45mb/s card until drop a frame.
yeah 95mb/s is a huge improvement.
how big your total files (1860 frames) ? If you try to record raw video second times, is there any change ? or it will dropped again at exactly 1861 frame? and have you formatted your card to ex-Fat ?
well i wonder what card did kmcray use that can make 2500 frames.
Quote from: mdfaisal on June 29, 2013, 08:08:28 PM
how big your total files (1860 frames) ? If you try to record raw video second times, is there any change ? or it will dropped again at exactly 1861 frame?
well i wonder what card did kmcray use that can make 2500 frames.
i did another test and here are the results: 1280x720p, frame skipping:off, 24fps, 28.06.13 satriani build - sandisk extreme pro 32gb 95mb/s
1st test: 1945frames. 2,92gb
2nd test: (after the first recording i pressed rec button immediately) 2334frames. 3,50gb
edit: i just saw "small hacks" and "card warm-up" options under raw video menu. i'll make a test after enabling them too.
edit2: 3rd test: i enabled those options. at start i got an error message "hack error at 0" i think that means one of them didn't work.
anyway i got 2466 frames this time.
I think one of you should take a few minutes to fill this table: Canon EOS RAW Comparison (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgQ2MOkAZTFHdFFIcFp1d0R5TzVPTVJXOEVyUndteGc#gid=5)
It surely would help some people. The 650D/700D line is almost empty ...
At least check the buffer size ("Debug" Tab -> "Free Memory" -> press "Q" -> "shoot_malloc total" is what you're looking for) and post it since it's the most important variable together with the write speed.
And please go through all picture quality settings ("RAW", "RAW + JPEG", "JPEG large & fine", "SRAW", "MRAW" (Does the 650D have those settings in the Magic Lantern menu?) ...) then reboot the camera and check shoot_malloc again. On the 600D and 60D that increased the buffer size extremly (600D's best setting is "SRAW", 60D's best setting is "JPEG small & fine") and allowed us to get much more frames, even in high resolutions.
I guess that should help to get at least 1280 X 720 continous if you find the right "Pic Quality" setting.
i tried most of the picture quality settings but it was all same.
(http://oi44.tinypic.com/2zszq0z.jpg)
nothing seems to change by changing picture quality. (global draw off, and other unnecessary things that are unrelated to raw video turned off like zebras, rgb charts etc)
i have run another test. the other tests ive made so far was globall draw on, and some the other seetings was turned on. i turned off all and set pic quality to Small Fine, warmed up the card and... that's a record:
3295 frames. 4,95gb (card exFatted)
Quote from: CFP on June 29, 2013, 08:51:12 PM
And please go through all picture quality settings ("RAW", "RAW + JPEG", "JPEG large & fine", "SRAW", "MRAW" (Does the 650D have those settings in the Magic Lantern menu?) ...)
where is pic quality setting in ML? ???
i am using ML_N_26.06.2013
Thank you very much for the screenshot :)
Only 91 Megabyte Shoot_Malloc ... My EOS 600D has 103 Megabyte Shoot_Malloc (With "Pic Quality" set to "SRAW". Otherwise it's only 75 Megabyte). The EOS 60D's Shoot_Malloc is 280 Megabyte big. I hoped the 650D/700D would lay somewhere in between those two.
Quote from: mdfaisal on June 29, 2013, 09:55:01 PM
where is pic quality setting in ML? ???
The "Pic Quality" setting should be in the "Shoot" tab. Can you set it to "SRAW" and "MRAW"? Or is the 600D the only XXXD with this feature? I know that the 550D doesn't have it, because it was too buggy.
Make sure to reboot the camera or switche the mode dial after you changed the "Pic Quality" setting (If it exists on your cameras). Otherwise it won't change the buffer size.
EDIT: Here is a screenshot of the 600D's "Shoot" tab. I hope yours look similar Shoot | Google Drive (https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B1Hu7J2NCF4vUnp2RUljR0UtMEU/edit?usp=sharing)
there is no Pic Quality setting in 650d's ML. i changed my settings on canon's firmware.
Quote from: CFP on June 29, 2013, 10:01:13 PM
Thank you very much for the screenshot :)
Only 91 Megabyte Shoot_Malloc ... My EOS 600D has 103 Megabyte Shoot_Malloc (With "Pic Quality" set to "SRAW". Otherwise it's only 75 Megabyte). The EOS 60D's Shoot_Malloc is 280 Megabyte big. I hoped the 650D/700D would lay somewhere in between those two.
The "Pic Quality" setting should be in the "Shoot" tab. Can you set it to "SRAW" and "MRAW"? Or is the 600D the only XXXD with this feature? I know that the 550D doesn't have it, because it was too buggy.
Make sure to reboot the camera or switche the mode dial after you changed the "Pic Quality" setting (If it exists on your cameras). Otherwise it won't change the buffer size.
EDIT: Here is a screenshot of the 600D's "Shoot" tab. I hope yours look similar Shoot | Google Drive (https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B1Hu7J2NCF4vUnp2RUljR0UtMEU/edit?usp=sharing)
(http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn79/lelakipenulis/f35f8da8-e836-40cc-b4bb-a5a418af9977.jpg)
hei how do you guys -printscreen your menu ;D sory OOT
Quote from: midnite on June 29, 2013, 10:17:24 PM
there is no Pic Quality setting in 650d's ML. i changed my settings on canon's firmware.
And? Did it change anything?
On the 600D the only settings that affect the Shoot_Malloc size are "SRAW" and "MRAW". "MRAW" decreased it from 75 to 43 Megabyte and "SRAW" increased it to 103 Megabyte (It used to be 104 Megabyte until A1ex changed something ...).
The Canon settings had no effect. But since the "SRAW" and "MRAW" settings aren't available without Magic Lantern and can't be changed from the Canon GUI, I guess on the 650D you can't increase Shoot_Malloc at the moment?
Maybe a developer might put the "Pic Quality" setting on the 650D/700D too?
Quote from: mdfaisal on June 29, 2013, 10:20:45 PM
hei how do you guys -printscreen your menu
In the "Debug" tab you'll find an option that says "Screenshot - 10s". Press it and wait 10 seconds and you'll get a screenshot of whatever you see on the display ;) The screenshot can be found as .BMP image on the SD-Card.
Hi all,
Trying to keep up with all the posts.. this keeps getting better and better. I am confused though.. does the 600d (t3i) do as well as the 650/700? I thought they all had 21mb/s limits on the SD card? Do the 650/700 handle 720p and the 550/600 do not? I can't seem to find specific info on the differences between the 4 models but up until now I thought they all had the same 21mb/s limit and thus would all have the same opportunities to record at the same resolution/frames?
If there is a 21mb/s limit on the SD card slot, then how does a 95mb/s make it any better than a 45mb/s card? Is there some sort of faster cache on the 95mb/s card or something that makes it faster? I am just not sure I understand how at a 21mb/s limit anything faster makes it possible to record more frames without skips and at higher resolutions?
Thanks.
The 500D/550D/600D are limited to 21.4 Megabyte/s write & read speed because their SD-Controllers don't support UHS-I.
So the highest resolution they can record continously is 0.52 Megapixel (E.g. 960 X 540 = 16:9). The 650D/700D/100D's SD-Controllers support UHS-I so they can get much higher write speeds. Theoretical up to 50 Megabyte/s.
So on the new XXXD cameras you can record much higher resolution. With some more improvements and a slightly bigger buffer recording 1280 X 720 at 24 frames/s should be no problem for these cameras since it would require only 37 Megabyte/s write speed.
The 95 Megabyte/s SD-Cards are slightly better than the 45 Megabyte/s cards because they are more stable. On the 45 Megabyte/s card the write speed is actually 20 Megabyte/s and jumps up to 21 Megabyte/s from time to time. On the 95 Megabyte/s cards it stays at 21 Megabyte/s. So the very fast SD-cards are a little bit better than the normal ones.
To see the differences between the Canon DSLRs, check this list: [ML] Canon EOS Raw Video Comparisons (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgQ2MOkAZTFHdFFIcFp1d0R5TzVPTVJXOEVyUndteGc#gid=5)
The 650D/700D/100D users have to add some information, but it's enough for a quick overview.
I hope that helped a bit.
Still, I'm curious about the 650D/700Ds capabilities. Sad that 1% doesn't have a 650D/700D. He did a lot of very good things for the 600D.
I guess you don't have GOP and Slice control either?
Thanks for the info. I think for my T3i I am going to stick to my BM Shuttle 2 recorder and HDMI out, since I bought the recorder. It will give me close enough to RAW with DNxHD 220 minimal compression at 1620x1080 resolution, with a minor crop/upscale I'll have very good 1080p quality. I think for the t2i/t3i that will be the better option than 960x540 raw with a 4x upscale to get 1920x1080 resolution. If I had the 650D I'd consider the 95Mb/s cards if it got 1280x720 continuously, but it still seems most people are only able to get a minute or so of video before it cuts out. At least you could use it for superb 720p short takes, which for short films and and such would be just fine. I am looking to purchase the BM 4K and pocket cameras soon anyway, so I'll use those for their 12-bit raw 4K and 1080P capabilities and keep my t3i with hdmi out for now.
Quote from: CFP on June 29, 2013, 10:32:54 PM
And? Did it change anything?
On the 600D the only settings that affect the Shoot_Malloc size are "SRAW" and "MRAW". "MRAW" decreased it from 75 to 43 Megabyte and "SRAW" increased it to 103 Megabyte (It used to be 104 Megabyte until A1ex changed something ...).
The Canon settings had no effect. But since the "SRAW" and "MRAW" settings aren't available without Magic Lantern and can't be changed from the Canon GUI, I guess on the 650D you can't increase Shoot_Malloc at the moment?
Maybe a developer might put the "Pic Quality" setting on the 650D/700D too?
In the "Debug" tab you'll find an option that says "Screenshot - 10s". Press it and wait 10 seconds and you'll get a screenshot of whatever you see on the display ;) The screenshot can be found as .BMP image on the SD-Card.
as i said before, it doesn't changed anything. i didnt mention i changed the settings from canon firmware though, sorry.
Quote from: midnite on June 29, 2013, 04:48:21 PM
i just bought a "32gb Sandisk Extreme Pro Sd 95mb/s" and i've made some tests with it.
now i can record 1579frames (1minute 4-5 seconds) of 1280x720p raw until it skips a frame.
Curious I can record 720p24 continuous with my SanDisk 45MB/s Card
Quote from: spider on June 30, 2013, 12:49:43 PM
Curious I can record 720p24 continuous with my SanDisk 45MB/s Card
On the 650D or 700D? Could you please check your "Shoot_Malloc" size ("Debug" tab -> "Free Memory" -> Press "Q")?
Maybe you have more than 91 Megabyte. That would explain why you are getting better results with an average SD-Card ...
Quote from: andjarnic on June 30, 2013, 03:32:14 AM
I think for my T3i I am going to stick to my BM Shuttle 2 recorder and HDMI out, since I bought the recorder. It will give me close enough to RAW
Have you tried working with the RAW videos? I can get 18 seconds of 1280 X 512 (2.5:1 aspect ratio) on my 600D which is enough for many situations and gives you a 2.1 crop factor. Upscaling it to 1920 X 768 makes it look really nice, even better than H.264 in terms of sharpness and detail if you use the right debayering and upscaling method. Although the aliasing is quite bad, I had no problems with moiré so far and the dynamic range is just incredible. Of course, the uncompressed HDMI out videos are slightly better than the default H.264 videos. But the RAW videos are even nicer in my opinion. And they look more like film.
By the way, I use Lightroom 4 to edit the DNG files from RAW2DNG (Almost no sharpening to avoid aliasing) and save them as TIFF images. Then I use an AviSynth script to upscale and sharpen the videos, open them in VirtualDub and export them as AVI videos using the lossless Lagarith codec. The result looks stunning and still has all the information from the RAW files in it, since the workflow is basically lossless. So you can process it in a better color grading software than Lightroom if you want.
Here's my AviSynth script if anybody is interested:
[Spoiler]LoadPlugin(ScriptDir()+"..\Avisynth-plugins\nnedi3.dll")
# Get the Plugin here: http://web.missouri.edu/~kes25c/nnedi3.zip
# Edit the path if necessary
LoadVirtualDubPlugin(ScriptDir()+"..\VirtualDub\plugins\msu_sharpen.vdf", "MSUSmartSharpen", 0)
# Get the Plugin here: http://www.compression.ru/video/smart_sharpen/src/smart_sharpen.zip
# Edit the path if necessary
ImageSource("PATH TO YOU TIFF FILES\%d.tif", FIRST_FRAME'S_NAME, LAST_FRAME'S_NAME, FRAME_RATE, false, false, "RGB24")
# That works only if your TIFF files are named like this: 1, 2, 3, 4, [...], 678
nnedi3_rpow2(rfactor = 4)
ConvertToRGB32()
MSUSmartSharpen(3)
ConvertToRGB24()
Spline36Resize(1920, 768)
# If your aspect ratio isn't 2.5:1 you may want to change the second number ;)
[/Spoiler]
Quote from: CFP on June 30, 2013, 01:14:34 PM
On the 650D or 700D? Could you please check your "Shoot_Malloc" size ("Debug" tab -> "Free Memory" -> Press "Q")?
Maybe you have more than 91 Megabyte. That would explain why you are getting better results with an average SD-Card ...
650D
shoot_malloc total 95MB
Quote from: spider on June 30, 2013, 01:20:53 PM
650D
shoot_malloc total 95MB
Thank you :D
Interesting. It wouldn't help me at all but I think some of the other 650D guys may be interested in your exact settings. Maybe you can share them? It looks like the normal Shoot_Malloc size (That's the RAW buffer by the way. The bigger the better) is only 91 Megabyte big on the 650D. At least if midnite's 650D isn't odd or something. These 4 Megabyte are probably making the difference between a few thousand frames and continuous recording.
And if there's a way to increase Shoot_Malloc from 91 to 95 Megabyte I guess it will be possible to push it at least to the 600D's level (103 Megabyte). By the way: The developers aren't really present in this thread, are they?
RAW 95MB
RAW + L 91MB
All other 59 MB
Quote from: spider on June 30, 2013, 12:49:43 PM
Curious I can record 720p24 continuous with my SanDisk 45MB/s Card
What version ml have you installed?
Quote from: spider on June 30, 2013, 02:08:36 PM
RAW 95MB
RAW + L 91MB
All other 59 MB
So the Picture Quality setting does change the Shoot_Malloc size. Just like on the 600D and 60D. Good to know.
I wonder what you've done that midnite haven't done? He said that changing the picture quality wouldn't affect the buffer size.
So, how far can you push the resolution? If 1280 X 720 (16:9 | 37 Megabyte/s at 24 frames/s | 2.2 crop factor) works, does 1536 X 614 (2.5:1 | 38 Megabyte/s | 1.8 crop factor) work continously too? It would make the 650D almost as good as the 50D in 1X mode. But the 650D has audio and flipscreen. If the 70D won't be really awesome I might upgrade from 600D to 700D once the price droped a little bit more.
But thank you for confirming my suspicion :D Still somebody has to fill the gaps in the Comparison Table (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgQ2MOkAZTFHdFFIcFp1d0R5TzVPTVJXOEVyUndteGc#gid=5).
Quote from: mdfaisal on June 30, 2013, 02:16:49 PM
What version ml have you installed?
Satriani build from 26.06
Quote from: CFP on June 30, 2013, 02:32:51 PM
does 1536 X 614 (2.5:1 | 38 Megabyte/s | 1.8 crop factor) work continously too?
No, maximum speed is 37.1 MB but 1600*600 at 24 frames works 1000 frames and more.
Quote from: spider on June 30, 2013, 03:08:40 PM
No, maximum speed is 37.1 MB but 1600*600 at 24 frames works 1000 frames and more.
Don't make me jealous. On the 600D I'm getting 57 frames at this resolution ;D
But thank you for the info. You are using the SanDisk 45 Megabyte/s SD-Card, right? So ... How much is possible with a 95 Megabyte/s card?
Since the hardware limit of the camera is 50 Megabyte/s and not 37.1 Megabyte/s, there's still space for improvements on the firmware side. And the buffer could be a little bit bigger too, I guess.
The 650D/700D's only issue would be the focus artefacts.
But I think the cameras have a great potential for RAW video.
Quote from: spider on June 30, 2013, 02:08:36 PM
RAW 95MB
RAW + L 91MB
All other 59 MB
How do you set this setting? Canon menu or ml menu?
Sorry connection error...
Double post ;D
Quote from: CFP on June 30, 2013, 03:23:20 PM
How much is possible with a 95 Megabyte/s card?
I dont think we will never get any benefit from a 95 MB/s card.
Quote
Since the hardware limit of the camera is 50 Megabyte/s and not 37.1 Megabyte/s, there's still space for improvements on the firmware side.
I think the HW limit is 37.1 to 37.3MB/s
Quote from: mdfaisal on June 30, 2013, 03:35:34 PM
How do you set this setting? Canon menu or ml menu?
In the regular Canon menu.
Quote from: spider on June 30, 2013, 04:54:55 PM
I dont think we will never get any benefit from a 95 MB/s card. [...] I think the HW limit is 37.1 to 37.3MB/s
You may be right.
But I could swear that I saw a few benchmarks from the 650D in one of the older threads which stated 42 Megabyte/s speed.
And since the camera supports UHS-I the hardware should be capable of doing almost 50 Megabyte/s. But there's only one way to find out what's the real limit: Turn the mode dial to "M", disable LiveView and run the Read/Write benchmark ("Debug" tab -> "Benchmarks" -> "Card R/W benchmark (5 min)"). After the benchmark finished, upload the .BMP image from the SD-Card and post it here.
Please do that with a 45 Megabyte/s card and a 95 Megabyte/s card so that we can see if there's a difference or not.
And make sure that you are in "M" mode with the LiveView turned of, since we don't want the firmware to limit the speed.
The more information you gather the higher are the chances to find and remove the current limitations :D
Heh.. .the EOSM controller is just like the 6d controller.. you'll probably get at most 41MB until something new is found. You probably need to hack dialog timers to get that. Theoretical is 50MB, thats being eaten somewhere.
Quote from: 1% on June 30, 2013, 05:43:45 PM
Heh.. .the EOSM controller is just like the 6d controller.. you'll probably get at most 41MB until something new is found. You probably need to hack dialog timers to get that. Theoretical is 50MB, thats being eaten somewhere.
... Eaten by the firmware, right?
Still, I'd like to see a benchmark from the 650D. Maybe it's different from the EOS M and 6D? Who knows.
But of course I can't test it. All I can do is showing you how a hardware limit looks like: Benchmark EOS 600D + SanDisk 45 Megabyte/s (https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B1Hu7J2NCF4vTWZJa1NfQk8xR00/edit?usp=sharing) ;D
And at least a developer showed up ;)
On 50D I'm writing faster than I'm benchmarking. I don't think they're any different.. same generation interfaces all around and sandisk 45MB/s being all winner.
650D/EOSM just have more crap running and constantly resizing the LV to 720P60 (eosM.. 650D has normal lv?)with halved FPS.
(http://s21.postimg.org/o1k9gvyh3/VRAM2.png)
With this card: http://www.amazon.de/SecureDigital-Capacity-Speicherkarte-Frustfreie-Verpackung/dp/B00422J0CG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1372608707&sr=8-1&keywords=sandisk+sdhc
Quote from: CFP on June 30, 2013, 02:32:51 PM
So the Picture Quality setting does change the Shoot_Malloc size. Just like on the 600D and 60D. Good to know.
I wonder what you've done that midnite haven't done?
i was lazy to go through 'em all. i tried only S M and L settings:) sorry. anyway its good to hear 650d has 95mb buffer:)
*moar tests are comin
my 650d's benchmark results:
made with that card: http://www.amazon.de/SanDisk-SDSDXPA-032G-X46-Extreme-SDHC-Speicherkarte/dp/B005LFT3QG/ref=sr_1_10?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1372613343&sr=1-10&keywords=sandisk+sdhc
(http://oi43.tinypic.com/j8cg7q.jpg)
settings didnt showed up like spiders's. but i got same settings. global draw:off, photo mode (m), build satriani 28.06.13
(Pic Q set to Raw) - Just got 4070frames of 1280x720 which is close to continuous right? or should i call it continuous? :)
Quote from: midnite on June 30, 2013, 07:47:29 PMJust got 4070frames of 1280x720 which is close to continuous right?
Almost 3 minutes! Nice :D
Not continuous (If you can fill your card I'd call it continuous) but enough for many situations. And way more than you can get with the 600D.
Good to see some benchmarks and more information about the 650D and 700D. So there
is space for improvements. Squeezing out a bit more buffer and killing what ever eats the write speed should be possible. But with 95 Megabyte buffer and 37 Megabyte/s write speed the cameras are quite usable for RAW videos in my opinion.
By the way, are you German? Because you're using the German Amazon page ... :D
Quote from: CFP on June 30, 2013, 08:31:56 PM
Almost 3 minutes! Nice :D
Not continuous (If you can fill your card I'd call it continuous) but enough for many situations. And way more than you can get with the 600D.
Good to see some benchmarks and more information about the 650D and 700D. So there is space for improvements. Squeezing out a bit more buffer and killing what ever eats the write speed should be possible. But with 95 Megabyte buffer and 37 Megabyte/s write speed the cameras are quite usable for RAW videos in my opinion.
By the way, are you German? Because you're using the German Amazon page ... :D
No, i'm not german, spider is... probably. (i was lazy to search my card in google so i copied his link and did my search there)
so... 95mb/s sd has an advantage of ~1mb/s to 45mb/s sd right?
Quote from: spider on June 30, 2013, 06:17:32 PM
(http://s21.postimg.org/o1k9gvyh3/VRAM2.png)
With this card: http://www.amazon.de/SecureDigital-Capacity-Speicherkarte-Frustfreie-Verpackung/dp/B00422J0CG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1372608707&sr=8-1&keywords=sandisk+sdhc
I have sandisk extreme pro 45mbs but my benchmark is lower than spider. Write is about 20...
I have no clue why spider have a very fast r/w benchmark
My Raw video recording 1280x720, 24p only 4 second.
I can confirm spider's benchmark numbers.
If you have an USB 3.0 cardreader you can test your card with something like CrystalDiskMark (Windows only).
It is possible - sadly - that your card is a fake.
Ciao, Walter
Quote from: mdfaisal on July 05, 2013, 10:23:41 PM
I have sandisk extreme pro 45mbs but my benchmark is lower than spider. Write is about 20...
Where did you buy the card?
You have to be carefully there are a lot of fake cards.
Example:
http://www.ebay.com.au/gds/beware-of-fake-1gb-2gb-4gb-8gb-usb-flash-drives-on-ebay/10000000000792498/g.html
http://www.ebay.com.au/gds/fake-sandisk-extreme-compact-flash-cards-exposed/10000000001449653/g.html
I also made a new video with 650D
Did some card speed tests in USB3.0 card reader in the PC with the CrystalDiskMark software:
The Sandisk Extreme 45MB/s 32GB SDHC UHS-1 Class 10 can read at 46,8MBps and Write from 40.5MBps to 42.7MBps
A sucessful ML benchmark run will write a file called VRAMx.BMP (x=number, starting with zero) to the root of your SD-card. Please upload it to a file/image hoster and link it here.
Ciao, Walter
thanks for the tip.
I do not own a 650d or 700d, I own the 600d.
In 600D the benchmark keeps around 21MBps
- Oops! Mistook you for "mdfaisal". My wrong! -
Ciao, Walter
Ive made this vid with 650D with Satrianis Build from 04.07.2013.
It was only a bit of testing the RAW funcionality.
Quote from: Walter Schulz on July 05, 2013, 10:47:04 PM
I can confirm spider's benchmark numbers.
If you have an USB 3.0 cardreader you can test your card with something like CrystalDiskMark (Windows only).
It is possible - sadly - that your card is a fake.
Ciao, Walter
(http://s7.postimg.org/7y9rx1d0b/VRAM0.png)
using this card http://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Extreme-UHS-1-Memory-SDSDXP1-016G-X46/dp/B004JJN262
my card is fake isnt it ? :'(
idont have USB 3.0 card reader. maybe i will check it latter another time
Doesn't look like 45 MByte/s to me ...
Just to be sure: You're using one of satriani's latest builds on 650D?
If you are about to purchase a USB 3.0 cardreader I can recommend Kingston FCR-HS3. Transfer speeds are very good with CF and SD. Mechanically it is not that convincing. The SD slot is not that well designed. Often the SD card is misaligned and gets stuck. If it happens, no harm is done to the card's and reader's contacts. And no reservations with CF slot.
Buying an USB 3.0 device makes not much sense if your computer only runs USB 2.0. You may need an additional USB 3.0 interface card then.
Ciao, Walter
Quote from: Walter Schulz on July 08, 2013, 09:56:02 AM
Doesn't look like 45 MByte/s to me
Ciao, Walter
Iam using satriani 1 july 2013
What are your settings? Maybe you have something enabled that eats the speed?
Try to set the mode dial to 'M' and leave the LiveView. Also, disable Global Draw before you run the benchmark.
It's worth a try - if you haven't used these settings for your benchmark yet - But I guess that won't help much.
Actually your benchmark looks like your card or your camera doesn't support UHS-I. Your card might be fake. Or your camera ;D
Btw: I have a question. 1% mentioned that the EOS M and the 650D/700D probably all have the same issue: The recorded raw image is squished and has to be streched vertically in post. That happens on the 600D if you record in the 720p mode. But is it true that it can't be avoided on the 650D/700D? Or is it only an issue with the EOS M?
How strong is it squished? I havent seen it on my videos from 650D.
i have problems too with the same card my card is original and new from extreme pro 16 gb 45mbs... but i read now this topic to understand what is my wrong settings in the camera or not...
Regarding the writing speed on 650D. Is it possible to overclock the controller that writes to the sd card in order to get more speed out of the camera and RAW?
Quote from: spider on July 09, 2013, 05:23:04 PM
How strong is it squished? I havent seen it on my videos from 650D.
Very strong. On the 600D you have to strech it by 166%. So I guess if you haven't noticed anything like that, it isn't squished and the EOS M is the only camera which has this issue. If you set the resolution in the Canon menu to 720p and record a raw video with Magic Lantern you'll see what I meant which squished.
@ Aborgh: Not at the moment. Otherwise the 600D wouldn't suck so much ;)
Once the Magic Lantern version for the 650D/700D gets better and the RAW feature gets more stable it should be possible to get a bit more speed. The benchmarks show that the hardware can handle ~ 41 Megabyte/s write speeds. And maybe more. But even with the current 37 Megabyte/s you shouldn't be too unhappy.
Quote from: CFP on July 09, 2013, 06:33:13 PM
Very strong. On the 600D you have to strech it by 166%. So I guess if you haven't noticed anything like that, it isn't squished and the EOS M is the only camera which has this issue.
You could see it at the beginning of this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5i1i9dZoiOI&feature=player_embedded , but it looks quite round.
Quote from: Fuma on July 07, 2013, 05:38:51 PM
Ive made this vid with 650D with Satrianis Build from 04.07.2013.
It was only a bit of testing the RAW funcionality.
did you use the pinkdotremover? this looks GREAT. what was your workflow?
Quote from: khurra on July 11, 2013, 12:14:52 AM
did you use the pinkdotremover? this looks GREAT. what was your workflow?
Yes, I did.
Right after I´ve used RAW2DNG the Pink Dots were Removed by pinkdotremover.
Ive converted the resulting DNGs into another format, i think it was tiff, dont know why i used that one ^^
In Adobe Premiere the tiffs were imported and rendered.
Quote from: Fuma on July 07, 2013, 05:38:51 PM
Ive made this vid with 650D with Satrianis Build from 04.07.2013.
It was only a bit of testing the RAW funcionality.
This look awesome! Which card do you have?
I am using this card below:
http://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Extreme-Class-Memory-SDSDXPA-032G-AFFP/dp/B007NDL56A/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1373622299&sr=8-5&keywords=sandisk+sd+32gb+extreme+pro
I Think I can confirm that 1280 x 720 24p, can record continously in raw video
im using
http://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Extreme-Class-Memory-SDSDX-016G-X46/dp/B0037FLUYU
1. Im formated my new card with exFat in diskutility (im using mac)
2. Im using satriani 1st july, and copy all files from my old memory card (DCIM, ML, Misc, Rom.dat, autoexec.bin, 650 safe dumper) in to a new card
3. open macboot to create bootdisk in my new card, and prepare a card
4. put my new card in 650D and running ML
5. disable global draw
6. start recording raw video 1280 x 720, 24p
7. record until my card full
First Try:
(http://s22.postimg.org/rb7x2bge9/screen_shot.jpg)
left is my file size (more than 15 gb)
right is my my available free disk space
Second try:
(http://s14.postimg.org/t0u5g973l/Screen_Shot_2013_07_15_at_11_21_34_PM.png)
and this is my card benchmark, pretty much the same like spider
(http://s24.postimg.org/pdjmnfmmt/VRAM1.png)
Hi,
I encountered a little problem.
I set the RAW video to 720p, but I only get files that are 8 pixels smaller on each side of the frame (1272 X 712).
Am I doing something wrong?
This bugs me because I have no idea how to stretch it, in Sony Vegas :/
Hi,
I'm getting the following results with a Transcend SDHC UH1 32Gb card in a Canon 650D:
1280x720
16:9
card warm up off
small hacks off
The following frame runs:
1728
1491
1126
1665
Not bad for an approx. 36 m/s (benchmarked) low cost card. Good to know a faster card will give continuous 1280 x 720.
ML rocks!
Quote from: saulbass on July 16, 2013, 12:04:00 AM
Hi,
I'm getting the following results with a Transcend SDHC UH1 32Gb card in a Canon 650D:
1280x720
16:9
card warm up off
small hacks off
The following frame runs:
1728
1491
1126
1665
Not bad for an approx. 36 m/s (benchmarked) low cost card. Good to know a faster card will give continuous 1280 x 720.
ML rocks!
Try to dissable global draw.
anybody running this on the 700d?
I got it working in 720p without stopping on a Sandisk Extreme 45MB/s 16GB.
I use the build from 14.07.
Just a little test shot of one of my pet geckos:
You can find settings, workflow etc. in the video description.
This was shot in low light, and it has barely any noise :)
Thank you so much for this! You guys are great :D
Quote from: mdfaisal on July 15, 2013, 05:56:42 PM
I Think I can confirm that 1280 x 720 24p, can record continously in raw video
im using
http://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Extreme-Class-Memory-SDSDX-016G-X46/dp/B0037FLUYU
Can you please tell me if this card works fine with 1280x560 24p ?
95mb/s cards are too expensive for me and I'm thinking of getting this one.
P.S. I can purchase
95mb/s 8 GB or
45mb/s 32 GB and It will be great if someone can recommend me ^^. Thanks in advance!
Continuous 720p24 16:9 works with that card.
Quote from: mdfaisal on July 16, 2013, 04:49:32 AM
Try to dissable global draw.
I'd already done this.
I can't seem to get a screengrab of the benchmark that mdfaisal posted. How do you do this? When I run the 5min benchmark
I get writespeed buffer 2048K 31.0 Mb/s
Read speed 2048K 118.0 Mb/s
which doesn't match mdfaisals posting.
Quote from: saulbass on July 16, 2013, 11:46:48 PM
I'd already done this.
I can't seem to get a screengrab of the benchmark that mdfaisal posted. How do you do this? When I run the 5min benchmark
I get writespeed buffer 2048K 31.0 Mb/s
Read speed 2048K 118.0 Mb/s
which doesn't match mdfaisals posting.
Than try to buy a new card :D
If you read my previous post, i bought sandisk extreme pro 45mbs 16gb that only get writespeed 21mbs >:( i think its a fake card. After using sandisk extreme 45 mbs i get writespeed almost the same as spider.
I think sandisk extreme 45mbs is the most affordable card that 650d can have 720p at 24fps raw video. But you have to disable global draw.
I dont know whether sandisk extreme pro can record 720p with global draw turn on.
I think we should ask members who has sandisk extreme pro 95mbs.
Quote from: dreamARTz on July 16, 2013, 07:26:44 PM
Can you please tell me if this card works fine with 1280x560 24p ?
95mb/s cards are too expensive for me and I'm thinking of getting this one.
P.S. I can purchase 95mb/s 8 GB or 45mb/s 32 GB and It will be great if someone can recommend me ^^. Thanks in advance!
If you bought 8gb card trying to record a raw video, than you only got +/- 4 minutes before your card is full. I dont think its a good idea.
Quote from: _DK_ on July 16, 2013, 07:14:33 PM
I got it working in 720p without stopping on a Sandisk Extreme 45MB/s 16GB.
I use the build from 14.07.
Just a little test shot of one of my pet geckos:
You can find settings, workflow etc. in the video description.
This was shot in low light, and it has barely any noise :)
Thank you so much for this! You guys are great :D
ehm.. Only I can't watch the vid?
The Video is private only he can watch it.
Huh? The video is not set to private :o
I checked it on a different browser (without being logged in to youtube) and it works there too... Maybe server problems...
Quote from: _DK_ on July 18, 2013, 01:19:34 PM
Huh? The video is not set to private :o
I checked it on a different browser (without being logged in to youtube) and it works there too... Maybe server problems...
I cant watch it either...
Now it is public.
I made a new video too.
How many seconds can you shoot in maximum resolution (1728x...)? Anyone tried?
720p seems to work continuisly with a fast card.
Quote from: Seb86 on July 25, 2013, 04:56:47 AM
How many seconds can you shoot in maximum resolution (1728x...)? Anyone tried?
2.6s @ 24fps
fps override works well while using raw
But HiJello gives me a lot of vertical banding/noise
RAW Crop Mode
partly moon behind clouds
You guys see this announcement?
http://www.engadget.com/2013/07/16/toshiba-exceria-pro-sd-cards/
Will these cards allow us to record higher resolutions of RAW on our t4i's??
No
Quote from: Fuma on July 26, 2013, 02:05:28 PM
RAW Crop Mode
partly moon behind clouds
What lens do you use? 200? 300?
300 mm
http://www.amazon.de/Tamron-70-300mm-4-5-6-digitales-Objektiv/dp/B003YUBTIU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1375132917&sr=8-1&keywords=tamron+70-300
Hi guys,
i'm testing some SD Cards and i have question : do any of you tryied to use 95Mb/s SDHC/XC for geeting max resolution? Or 650D is 'blocked' at 41Mb/s write and just CAN'T get more that 720p 24fps?
QuoteOr 650D is 'blocked' at 41Mb/s write and just CAN'T get more that 720p 24fps?
Yes, it is 'blocked' and just can't.
Well, it can, but not continuously. For example, I'm succesfully shooting 1536x640 (cinemascope 1:2.4) for about 40 secs. That's enough for virtually any cut in feature film (within my framework).
I really want to go 1600 x 6xx - it will be great. Just need Sandisk Extreme with 60mb/s write for tests. Have 45mb/s one and i will test it tommorow - my card reader is dead so i cant download files from my 650 -> PC :/
Quote from: WinstonWolf on September 05, 2013, 03:05:10 AM
I really want to go 1600 x 6xx - it will be great. Just need Sandisk Extreme with 60mb/s write for tests. Have 45mb/s one and i will test it tommorow - my card reader is dead so i cant download files from my 650 -> PC :/
At this resolution it will give you around 14-15 secs at 23.976 fps.
It's enought for what i need :)
Can someone tell me why there so much "pink dots" on my DNG files? Where i made mistake? What is wrong?
anybody editing in vegas? i haven't yet found a workflow that works. what's your workflow?
thanks.
I use PremierePro, earlier i was using Edius, but PPro use CUDA for Editing so it's a little faster... Buddy was working in Vegas, now he uses Premiere too.
what's your workflow? as in, RAW from camera xx2xx, LR...PPro?
Quote from: wacru1 on September 09, 2013, 10:32:49 PM
anybody editing in vegas? i haven't yet found a workflow that works. what's your workflow?
thanks.
I use Vegas (Movie Platinum Version 12). Heres my Workflow:
1: Create Pictures with RAW2DNG
2.Use the PinkDotRemover
3. Drag all my files into Adobe Lightroom, edit them there. (you could also use Photoshop, but there you have to edit them and wait till they are all in jpeg format for each shot. In Lightroom you can edit every shot and then export them all together, so you are not forced to make many little breaks)
4.Export as .jpeg
5. Import.jpegs as a movie Sequence in Vegas
6. Do the rest of editing, cuts etc. and export the final Video
Hope it helps a bit ;)
Quote from: _DK_ on September 10, 2013, 02:54:41 PM
3. Drag all my files into Adobe Lightroom, edit them there. (you could also use Photoshop, but there you have to edit them and wait till they are all in jpeg format for each shot. In Lightroom you can edit every shot and then export them all together, so you are not forced to make many little breaks)
How do you do it exactly?
I made this longer video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYIFX5P2r6U&feature=youtube_gdata_player with a lot a short shots.
And it was a lot of work in LR, because I had to select each shot, open the export window and change the output folder.
Or do you export them all into one output folder?
thanks, dk, i'll try that.
@spider: I just select it to create sub folders, for the output jpegs. It then puts each sequence in an individual sub folder.
Why can't we get the write speeds close to sd controller limit?
With fast sd cards benchmarks are about 41MB/s, which is exactly what you'd expect.
But actual write speeds when recording raw are never goes higher than 37,4 — 37,5 MB/s. Why is that?
Our 6D friends for example says, they achieve speeds around 40 MB/s.
2.5k on 650D test with the new raw2dng
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6658.msg80222#msg80222
Are they still pictures or my flash player went crazy?
Yes, it is almost still.
Now we can use digital dolly on 650D
I love the chroma smooth.
It makes the image so clear but still detailed and sharp.
..I installed nightly builds on my t4i...but I don't see where can I load the modules for the Raw video...any help will be appreciated...btw the Alpha builds has the M - to load modules for the Raw Videos.......thanks
...I can't use the Alpha builds cuz I found a bug and there a early stop on Video Raw..
Quote from: spider on October 04, 2013, 10:36:07 PM
I love the chroma smooth.
It makes the image so clear but still detailed and sharp.
It may be the matter of personal preference, but when you apply chroma smoothing to all the image, you actually... well, smoothing the chroma. The footage looks more like usual h.264, where due to 4:2:0 chroma subsampling the things become similar to what you are doing )
Nice chroma resolution — is one of the main aspects of RAW, which makes it 'filmic'. For me it's obvious:
(http://moredo.ru/raw/compare/compare3.gif)
I don't think so because normally you don't watch Movies at 200%
Quote from: spider on October 05, 2013, 12:16:15 PM
I don't think so because normally you don't watch Movies at 200%
It's all about feeling. Tiny color details are one of those magic things what make you believe its filmic.
This stuff is not even arguable for professionals — thats's why they shoot raw )
Why even bother with raw, if you just blur the color info?
I am not an expert but for me it didn't affect the sharpness of the video in a noticeable way.
So can anyone tell me whats the "bad" thing about the chroma somooting?
Is it only noticeable if you apply color grading? Or is it something different that makes it "bad"?
Quote from: _DK_ on October 05, 2013, 08:43:34 PM
So can anyone tell me whats the "bad" thing about the chroma somooting?
Is it only noticeable if you apply color grading? Or is it something different that makes it "bad"?
You lose some chroma detail, but the eye is much more sensitive for luma.
Also only the blue and red chennels are filtered but the eyes most importent color is green.
And the most importent thing is: DVD, Blu-Ray, mostly h.264... all of them use chroma subsampling.
At first you have to find a way to deliver 4:4:4
Hi everyone,
First time posting here, I apologise if my question has been answered elsewhere, but after an hour and more searching I couldnt find anything quite like it...
So, I have installed the most recent version of ML (from the 19th of Sep) on my 650D. The raw module is on. I have tried to record under several different settings (I tried almost all resolutions, keeping frames at 24 per second), but the result is always the same. Once I decompress the raw files using MagicRAW, I get .dmg files that are entirely magenta. Im not talking about a hue, but totally magenta, you can barely see what the subject was. Like a thick wall of colour. And all of them are like this.
Has anyone got this before? any ideas or links on what to do?
(Im sorry for the lack of apostrophes, Im writing from Peru and cant find most of the punctuation on this keyboard. Also, for the same reason, I will only be able to check the internet once a week, so if I dont reply immediately its not because I dont appreciate your help!)
Thank you very much in advance!
The most recent version was built 2013-10-08 02:55:09. 10 = October.
Top of page -> Downloads -> Nightly builds
Install, test, report.
Ciao
Walter
Hey all,
i noticed that the eos 650D recording continuously at 1280x720 @23.973p !? Could it be right?
(http://s14.directupload.net/images/131008/temp/23or7kx4.jpg) (http://s14.directupload.net/file/d/3404/23or7kx4_jpg.htm)
(http://s1.directupload.net/images/131008/temp/gapxmjjc.jpg) (http://s1.directupload.net/file/d/3404/gapxmjjc_jpg.htm)
Nightly build Date: 2013-10-07 02:55:09 +0200
Oh really? I am so surprised.
Ok,
I have to apologize
the recording ends after 1:58 minutes, 2823 frames and 4289 MB of memory.
Idle jumps from minute 1:30 to 1:53 from 45ms to 603ms.
(http://s7.directupload.net/images/131008/temp/v82ks2pw.jpg) (http://s7.directupload.net/file/d/3404/v82ks2pw_jpg.htm)
(http://s7.directupload.net/images/131008/temp/8pfdxdhs.jpg) (http://s7.directupload.net/file/d/3404/8pfdxdhs_jpg.htm)
use exfat
It´s done ;)
19002 frames 28,5GB 13:05 Minutes of Raw Video @ 1280x720p 23,973 fps
(http://s7.directupload.net/images/131009/temp/23lk48bi.jpg) (http://s7.directupload.net/file/d/3405/23lk48bi_jpg.htm)
(http://s1.directupload.net/images/131009/temp/skfexkq6.jpg) (http://s1.directupload.net/file/d/3405/skfexkq6_jpg.htm)
(http://s1.directupload.net/images/131009/temp/p6aipdgj.jpg) (http://s1.directupload.net/file/d/3405/p6aipdgj_jpg.htm)
Hey all,
do you think 23 fps are enough to film fireworks in raw?
(http://s7.directupload.net/images/131011/temp/4b95px7p.jpg) (http://s7.directupload.net/file/d/3407/4b95px7p_jpg.htm)
Questions
Hi all,
Just found this forum group. Have some questions
1. When I set FPS override to 23.976 what i get is 23.973 <-- is this normal? My answer from what I see here would be yes correct?
2. in 720P mode it takes over 1000 frames to get to a write rate that is continuous (around 36.6 ish) <-- is this normal? using extreme 45 mbs.
3. my shoot_malloc is 30 mb but my shoot total is 95 mb. I saw that others have talked about the shoot_malloc being 95 mb. <-- So were they really talking total and not malloc?
Thanks
dave
I made something new, but I should compare the output from LR with and without exifs.
The difference is really huge
LR4
Noise reduction
Luminance 50
Color 25
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/fi5b4g876l1zi6j/compare.gif?token_hash=AAHncxRHP-V-ukIwZ1_n85Jx7n1od4w_efpZ4h8ahc3XUg&dl=1)
Tried RAW n it doesn't work, on 650D, tried small sizes like below 900-500, the data rate (as shown on the ML RAW video menu) was way below 20mbps, like 13mbps, even 7mbps.
All the clips have a PINK DOTS GRID, used RAW2dng (0.14) even Raw magic to pores, all the output have the Pink Dots Grid.
I just read a reply above, that says its the "contrast-focus points" well the grid does resemble the focus points pattern of the T4.
Also severe CROPPING has to be taken into account, when u shooting at smaller frame size.
The kit 18mm lens was like an 80mm! Not kidding.
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6658.0
That's cool, Spider.
When I saw the first few frames, I thought, "what a mess of hot pixels!", but on watching it play, I love the way the clouds move to reveal the starscape.
I really enjoy timelapse film making, and Magic Lantern makes beautiful, raw-quality, full-resolution films possible on even the most basic cameras - without racking up the wear and tear of thousands of mechanical shutter cycles.
Quote from: spider on October 21, 2013, 12:12:15 AM
I made something new, but I should compare the output from LR with and without exifs.
<youtube>
Quote from: Deni2Br on October 05, 2013, 12:15:53 AM
..I installed nightly builds on my t4i...but I don't see where can I load the modules for the Raw video...any help will be appreciated...btw the Alpha builds has the M - to load modules for the Raw Videos.......thanks
In the ML menu (u access it by pressing the Trash button) on the Last menu page, where it says Load ML modules, and a couple of items appear at the end of the menu, n the last is "Rec RAW" vid, if the module is loaded then there will b a green light/button-on next to it, else go to the top of the menu n select, Load ML modules now, it will "spin" for a few seconds n the green light next to Rec RAW, now go to the video menu page (within ml menus) n select what size u want to "try-test"
(sorry, not not specifying exact menu items, as I don't have my camera 650D with me right now)
Hey
I'm having some trouble with the raw video for my 650d. When i record a video it looks fine on the camera screen then I go to my computer and convert it to a dng. I will bring it up in after effects and in the middle of the screen there is a pattern of blue dots. Any advice for me? I also tryed recording in the normal h.264 and there are no dots.
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6658.0
Spider, what exactly do you call digital dolly (your video in the previous page) ?
Because, it has always been possible with a simple picture and some after effects simple movement, but i doubt you're talking about that. Is there a way to move the crop region in movie crop ?
I looked for the wiki's page on that subject but always ended up on the cropmarks help page...Any idea ?
If you activate digital dolly you will be able to move the crop window.
(http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/box0639m9qhyxsy/digital%20dolly.BMP?dl=1&token_hash=AAHfMgjhnxl-FZvUvE2PMqTa4CrPS5_ucm4qkHksJ9Dm5A)
Sorry if this is a very stupid question, but how do i get Magic Lantern to show up in the movie menu? I have downloaded and installed the latest build (The one with the nicer looking menus), but i cannot see an option to enable RAW shooting anywhere.
Any ideas?
Press Trashcan button, go to Modules menu, enable RAW_rec module, restart. RAW video will be shown after.
how many frames can be done on t4i, with 1728 wide and aspect ratio of 2.39? the calculation says 41 mb/s. thanks.
Quote from: mlrocks on November 11, 2013, 07:32:57 AM
how many frames can be done on t4i, with 1728 wide and aspect ratio of 2.39? the calculation says 41 mb/s. thanks.
175-177 frames at 1728x720 @23.976 fps
Highest write speeds currently are lower than actual SD controller limit. 38.6 – 38.7 MB/s for 650D.
Thanks Spider, too bad it's not working without Raw enabled.
I'll have to dive into ML Raw processing soon.
hey all
I once tried around a bit, and I noticed that I get a write speed of 39.7 mb / s. Can one confirm?
(http://s14.directupload.net/images/131118/temp/kqht3pm9.jpg) (http://s14.directupload.net/file/d/3445/kqht3pm9_jpg.htm)
Yes at 12fps nothing special.
Ok, thx
Ok, just some additional info for those looking to shoot RAW on their 650D"s
With global draw and all other features turned off, using sandisk extreme 45mb/s formatted exFAT 128kb allocated unit size I'm getting continuous video using 1152x648 @ 23.976 with write speed 29mb/s (I stopped it at 4 mins with 7gb file size and it was still going strong).
Also, experienced continuous video using 1280x720 @ 23 fps with write speed of 35mb/s and no signs of slowing down, but this seemed to be at its limit (not sure if card write speed limit or camera SD write speed limit).
Waiting for sandisk extreme pro 95mb/s cards to arrive and will post results of that soon, which should tell the final story regarding write speed limit for this camera model.
Thanks again to all Dev Team members and forum posters! Without which none of this would be possible :-)
Dear All,
I hope that you could help me and also I hope this is the right place to ask this.
I want to buy a 650D for Astrophotography (Sun, Moon and planets) using the 14 bit raw video crop mode capability, substituting the old 8 bit 10 fps 640x480 webcam.
I have a 500D but unfortunately somethings is not working.
My wish could be a 1024x1024 at >24 fps (1024x1024 is the minimum size to get full sun disk with my H-alpha solar telescope at direct focus without barlow lens or eyepiece projection)
I need to know before to buy the 650D (for sure)
1) if the mlv_play module works (if it's possible to review the raw video stored in the SD card) - in 500D is not working
2) if the liveview is working during raw video recording - in 500D is not working
3) the maximum x_res and y_res and frame rate obtainable (es at 1024x1024 what is the max frame rate? Is it possible get 30 or more fps?) in 500D there is a 508 y_res limit
4) Intervalometer and bulb timer are working? - I use them a lot
5) LCD sensor remote is working? - I use it a lot to substitute the remote shutter
Thanks to all developers for the amazing ML firmware! :)
4) What are the current issues (what is not working yet) in 650D?
5)
You mean 18 mb full resolution timelapse without mechanic shutter wearing. Please confirm, because this is huge.
18 mb full reslution? That is ground breaking.
Quote from: Haliburton on October 31, 2013, 03:32:51 AM
That's cool, Spider.
When I saw the first few frames, I thought, "what a mess of hot pixels!", but on watching it play, I love the way the clouds move to reveal the starscape.
I really enjoy timelapse film making, and Magic Lantern makes beautiful, raw-quality, full-resolution films possible on even the most basic cameras - without racking up the wear and tear of thousands of mechanical shutter cycles.
Quote from: jimmyD30 on November 29, 2013, 02:06:23 AM
Ok, just some additional info for those looking to shoot RAW on their 650D"s
With global draw and all other features turned off, using sandisk extreme 45mb/s formatted exFAT 128kb allocated unit size I'm getting continuous video using 1152x648 @ 23.976 with write speed 29mb/s (I stopped it at 4 mins with 7gb file size and it was still going strong).
Also, experienced continuous video using 1280x720 @ 23 fps with write speed of 35mb/s and no signs of slowing down, but this seemed to be at its limit (not sure if card write speed limit or camera SD write speed limit).
Waiting for sandisk extreme pro 95mb/s cards to arrive and will post results of that soon, which should tell the final story regarding write speed limit for this camera model.
Thanks again to all Dev Team members and forum posters! Without which none of this would be possible :-)
Quote from: mlrocks on December 05, 2013, 06:55:19 PM
You mean 18 mb full resolution timelapse without mechanic shutter wearing. Please confirm, because this is huge.
I dont know what you mean.
Neither do I with this one:
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5780.msg90823#msg90823
Just an update, still waiting for my fast SD cards to arrive, Amazon says they'll be here by Dec-11, can't wait to see the results, just need to eke out a few more MB/s to get continuous 1280x720p @ 24fps RAW!
IBIRRU, I answer some of your questions below, but I barely know how to do some of the basic things in ML and only on the 650D, so maybe look for additional verification of my answers.
YOU WROTE (in black) - I ANSWERED (in red):
I need to know before to buy the 650D (for sure)
1) if the mlv_play module works (if it's possible to review the raw video stored in the SD card) - in 500D is not working
Yes, you can preview RAW on the camera, but not at proper frame rate, it plays back slower and of course there will be NO audio, as it doesn't record sound in RAW mode.
2) if the liveview is working during raw video recording - in 500D is not working
Yes, live view works whilst recording in RAW.
3) the maximum x_res and y_res and frame rate obtainable (es at 1024x1024 what is the max frame rate? Is it possible get 30 or more fps?) in 500D there is a 508 y_res limit
1024x1024 for RAW recording is not an option from the preset selections presently available (developers could probably add it, but this is a question for them), either way I don't think you'd get 30fps RAW @ 1024x1024 as the the highest frame rate being captured right now is 24fps @ 1280x720p and only under the best of conditions (fast SD card, all other features turned off, etc.), but you could shoot at slightly lessor settings to get your 30fps and then up-res and crop in post??? Considering its RAW, you'll have the detail to do it and it'll probably still look pretty good, better than H.264 compressed native video output anyway.
4) Intervalometer and bulb timer are working? - I use them a lot
I haven't tried this, but I believe it's working from what I've read in other posts.
5) LCD sensor remote is working? - I use it a lot to substitute the remote shutter
First off, I believe you mean IR (InfraRed) remote sensor, but either way I have no idea, I suggest you search the forums for an answer or post the question separately in a more appropriate thread with a similar topic.
How can I get rid of the EV display depicted in red? I've seen a screenshot of someone else's and it doesn't show that.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v645/duceduc/ss/screenshot_zpsdd01b626.jpg)
It's normal.
Not changeable without deeper changes in Canon FW I think.
Liveview -> press INFO until MLs info screen appears. Done.
Ciao
Walter
Quote from: Walter Schulz on December 09, 2013, 02:46:20 PM
Liveview -> press INFO until MLs info screen appears. Done.
Isn't working for me. Sometimes it shows still up.
Finally got the fast cards! I can report that I am getting 1280x720@24fps continuous RAW using SanDisk Extreme Pro 95 MB/s card. This occurs after about 15-45 seconds of recording with a write speed of 36.9 MB/s and idle time reaching over 200ms after a few minutes and then slightly over 300ms thereafter. Not sure how much format allocation unit size matters, but setting between 64KB-128KB seemed to work best.
Recorded for about 11.5 mins with file size of 25.7 GB on a 32 GB card when it shut down automatically (on its own).
One thing to note, in the past when I set the fps override to 24fps it would display actual fps of 23.973, now when I set it to 24fps it states an actual frame rate of 24.002, so I don't know what's up with that.
UPDATE Dec-14-2013: Using the latest nightly build (Dec-13-2013) the actuall fps is back to 23.973 (whether setting Desired fps to 24.000 or 23.976), so I guess that's good.
Also, on a side note related to the new MLV raw video format, on the 650D .mlv is a little slower than .raw recordings, to the point that it won't record continuously for 1280x720p @ 24fps, I can see the MB/s slow down jnto the low 36.x MB/s when in MLV recording mode, all else being equal.
Quote from: spider on December 07, 2013, 11:26:03 PM
I dont know what you mean.
I mean can ml do raw recording 18 mp at 1 fps without using the mechanical shutter? Thanks for all of your help and sharing. Great community.
Quote from: mlrocks on December 15, 2013, 02:11:49 AM
I mean can ml do raw recording 18 mp at 1 fps without using the mechanical shutter? Thanks for all of your help and sharing. Great community.
I think what you are asking is can ML do a complete 18 megapixel sensor (for 650D) write to the SD card at 1 fps in video/movie mode??? While probably technically possible, no ML version that I know of is presently setup to do that, all the versions I'm aware of basically use various video formats (e.g. 720p) and write it to the SD card at various frame rates, mostly maxing out at around 1280x720 @ 24 fps on the 650D.
Is this what you are asking? Or do you mean using the intervalometer in still picture mode with RAW image, if this is the case, then yes, I believe it's possible, but I'm not well versed in this area of ML, so you may want to re-post your question with more clarity and maybe someone else can answer it better than me.
Quote from: mlrocks on December 15, 2013, 02:11:49 AM
I mean can ml do raw recording 18 mp at 1 fps without using the mechanical shutter? Thanks for all of your help and sharing. Great community.
Not possible because ML only dumps the LV stream on the card.
And the resolution of the stream is as it is.
Well, here's my first video shooting RAW on the 650D: https://vimeo.com/81964818 (https://vimeo.com/81964818?utm_source=email&utm_medium=clip-transcode_complete-finished-20120100&utm_campaign=7701&email_id=Y2xpcF90cmFuc2NvZGVkfDg3Y2EwNjgyYWJlOTMzYjQ2ZGIxMWZiMWZjYTkxMzcxNjkxfDIzNDEwNjg3fDEzODcxNjE1MTh8NzcwMQ%3D%3D)
Workflow as follows: Shot RAW 1280x720 @ 23.976 fps continuous video with Canon 650D/T4i then used Pink Dot Remover v0.08 on RAW file. Used RAWMagic 1.0 (Mac) to convert RAW file to DNG files. Opened DNGs in Adobe After Effects which started Adobe Camera Raw where I did some minor color correction (mostly auto-this and auto-that). After that I rendered in Adobe After Effects as lossless (animation). Opened lossless file in Adobe Premiere Pro and added audio then exported as H.264 10 Mb/s for Vimeo upload.
Note: Although not part of the workflow, I also played the lossless animation file in QuickTime Player which converted it to ProRes 4444 for viewing on my Mac and I was prompted to also save the file as such.
Cool, what did you use for the sound. I am playing around with a surround sound recorder.
dave
Quote from: davidtlong on December 17, 2013, 06:53:45 PM
Cool, what did you use for the sound. I am playing around with a surround sound recorder.
dave
Being a last minute kinda thing I didn't have all my gear with me, so I shot with a kit lens and captured sound on my iPhone with a 4-track recording app called Audiostar on best quality setting using just the phone's mic. You can still hear the wind blow even after I reduced it quite a bit in post. The alarm ringing was for the crossing gates just behind me, so this was actual audio of the event. I was lucky enough to have the train engineer blow the horn as he was passing by me giving that Doppler effect usually associated with trains.
We had just gotten 13.5 inches of snowfall the day before in upstate NY, so I thought it would be cool to catch the train blasting through the new snow and I wanted to try shooting RAW, so it was a good enough excuse for me to get out there and do it :-)
Quote from: jimmyD30 on December 17, 2013, 10:35:34 PM
Being a last minute kinda thing I didn't have all my gear with me, so I shot with a kit lens and captured sound on my iPhone with a 4-track recorder app called Audiostar on best quality setting using just the phone's mic. You can still hear the wind blow even after I reduced it quite a bit in post. The alarm ringing was for the crossing gates just behind me, so this was actual audio of the event. I was lucky enough to have the train engineer blow the horn as he was passing by me giving that Doppler effect usually associated with trains.
We had just gotten 13.5 inches of snowfall the day before in upstate NY, so I thought it would be cool to catch the train blasting through the new snow and I wanted to try shooting RAW, so it was a good enough excuse for me to get out there and do it :-)
Nice, What technique did you use to sync the audio?.
d
Quote from: davidtlong on December 18, 2013, 06:46:27 PM
Nice, What technique did you use to sync the audio?.
d
Syncing was pretty easy considering it wasn't a dialogue type scene or some such thing. I just pressed the record buttons on both the camera and phone at the same time and then the stop buttons at the same time also, this left me with a 47 sec video recording and about a 47.25 sec audio recording. So, overlaying the audio on top of the video was straight forward as I was working with basically the same length for both with both being recorded at very nearly the same time. I ended up stretching the audio a bit in post, so that it played when the title was showing at the beginning of the video.
Keep in mind, I had initially forgot that recording in RAW wasn't going to capture audio, so like I said previously, I was kind of scrambling at the last minute to pull this off and just used what I had immediatlely available, hence using the iphone for audio recording.
You mention you were looking to record in 'surround sound', will you be using a special device or a stereo mic or maybe two uni-directional mono mics facing in different directions?
Quote from: jimmyD30 on December 18, 2013, 11:36:10 PM
Syncing was pretty easy considering it wasn't a dialogue type scene or some such thing. I just pressed the record buttons on both the camera and phone at the same time and then the stop buttons at the same time also, this left me with a 47 sec video recording and about a 47.25 sec audio recording. So, overlaying the audio on top of the video was straight forward as I was working with basically the same length for both with both being recorded at very nearly the same time. I ended up stretching the audio a bit in post, so that it played when the title was showing at the beginning of the video.
Keep in mind, I had initially forgot that recording in RAW wasn't going to capture audio, so like I said previously, I was kind of scrambling at the last minute to pull this off and just used what I had immediatlely available, hence the iphone.
You mention you were looking to record in 'surround sound', will you be using a special device or a stereo mic or maybe two uni-directional mono mics facing in different directions?
When I found out how easy it is to make surround sound audio files, yes two stereo microphones would work (two Iphones:)). But I bought a ZoomH2n. It has 5 microphones and for surround it records to two wav files (two channels in the front and two in the back). Much easier than having two separate microphones as I really want to try field recordings/video. One thing I want to do is the train video like you did with surround sound.
I use Audacity to take the Zoom files into either 5.1 or 7.1 surround sound (SS). (I did not know Audacity could do this and how easy it was). There is a nice video on the web about making 5.1 but once you do that 7.1 is a snap. I export either as SS wav or ogg or m4a audio files. Ogg and m4a files are much smaller. After "developing" the raw video (I use Photoshop to edit as well as render the video. I used to use Quicktime for rendering. I have compared output form both and I like PS so for me it so easy to do all "developing" in one piece of software) as to I combine the audio and video files in PowerDirector (v. 12). I sync via clapper board (hence my original question). I really need to find a small finger size clapper board or make my own. PowerDirector as far as I can tell through comparing video editors is the only editor to be able to combine ss ogg and m4a audio. The problem however is that PowerDirector does not assign the speakers properly for ss ogg or m4a. For example the left rear speaker maybe assigned the center speaker channel. I have worked out how PD maps the audio to the speakers and have sent this study to Cyberlink (they make PD). They are now working on this and hopefully have a fix soon. WAV files work fine but as I said they are large files that can make the video large.
Hope this is of interest.
dave
Quote from: davidtlong on December 19, 2013, 03:20:52 PM
When I found out how easy it is to make surround sound audio files, yes two stereo microphones would work (two Iphones:)). But I bought a ZoomH2n. It has 5 microphones and for surround it records to two wav files (two channels in the front and two in the back). Much easier than having two separate microphones as I really want to try field recordings/video. One thing I want to do is the train video like you did with surround sound.
I use Audacity to take the Zoom files into either 5.1 or 7.1 surround sound (SS). (I did not know Audacity could do this and how easy it was). There is a nice video on the web about making 5.1 but once you do that 7.1 is a snap. I export either as SS wav or ogg or m4a audio files. Ogg and m4a files are much smaller. After "developing" the raw video (I use Photoshop to edit as well as render the video. I used to use Quicktime for rendering. I have compared output form both and I like PS so for me it so easy to do all "developing" in one piece of software) as to I combine the audio and video files in PowerDirector (v. 12). I sync via clapper board (hence my original question). I really need to find a small finger size clapper board or make my own. PowerDirector as far as I can tell through comparing video editors is the only editor to be able to combine ss ogg and m4a audio. The problem however is that PowerDirector does not assign the speakers properly for ss ogg or m4a. For example the left rear speaker maybe assigned the center speaker channel. I have worked out how PD maps the audio to the speakers and have sent this study to Cyberlink (they make PD). They are now working on this and hopefully have a fix soon. WAV files work fine but as I said they are large files that can make the video large.
Hope this is of interest.
dave
I have to laugh, I just bought the Zoom H2n last night! What I especially like about it, in addition to all the awesome features at a great price, is that it uses full size SD cards, the same as my camera, not micro-SD like a lot of other recorders are using these days.
I would suggest not to worry so much about the WAV file size, especially in relation to the RAW video recording file size. And considering you want to capture audio as surround sound, the uncompressed WAV format will be far superior in quality than any compressed format.
Have you looked into a smart phone or tablet Clapboard app? I don't know how good they are, but some are free.
Hey people,
What would you choose rather in RAW MOVI ? :)
(Canon 1280x720 50p)
1536x616 (23,980p) = 946176 PIXEL stretch to 1536x864 in post and scale it up to 1920x1080 24p
or
(Canon 1920x1080 25p)
1280x720 (25p) = 921600 PIXEL scale it up to 1920x1080 25p
Looking forward to your answers. ;) :)
Quote from: jimmyD30 on December 19, 2013, 08:57:10 PM
I have to laugh, I just bought the Zoom H2n last night! What I especially like about it, in addition to all the awesome features at a great price, is that it uses full size SD cards, the same as my camera, not micro-SD like a lot of other recorders are using these days.
I would suggest not to worry so much about the WAV file size, especially in relation to the RAW video recording file size. And considering you want to capture audio as surround sound, the uncompressed WAV format will be far superior in quality than any compressed format.
Have you looked into a smart phone or tablet Clapboard app? I don't know how good they are, but some are free.
Interesting. Hand not thought about that, the app, that is. Actually in my test quality of the sound for the none wav files is good.
I know this is all slightly off topic but seeing as there are a number of people that are using the Zoom H2 I thought I would mention that I also have one, and as clunky as the thing is - it's a great little device.
I made a modification to it that allows you to hijack the points where the audio is fed to the recorder. It allows you to have four separate audio inputs (the H2 only has 2). The inputs are switchable between MIC/Line level.
My one has cables hanging from it with a a couple of connectors that switch out the onboard microphones when you insert alternative sources.
The mod was 'fiddly' but it does work. You just have to be willing to 'hack' your device a little. Believe me, I was nervous because I don't have millions of $$$$ to mess around with. Neither am I an expert in electronics. I was careful and methodical and thankfully I did it. It works, and as you can tell: - I love what it has allowed me to do.
There was a video on You Tube that inspired me to do it. With instructions. I think there is also more stuff around the internet too. Just google 'Zoom H2 mod'
Anyway if you are interested here is a little video for it: -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1vJq13ukrk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1vJq13ukrk)
Hello! I badly understand English text to translate, sorry.
Tell me, if you write the RAW video on my camera 650d, make such artifacts
(http://radikale.ru/data/upload/69fda/49112/6767fed296_preview.jpg) (http://radikale.ru/full/69fda/49112/6767fed296.jpg.html)
how to solve this problem please help? or give a link to the topic where they talk about it?
once again sorry, I have not found a solution to this problem, due to the poor knowledge of the language :(
thanks for the help !
p.s. I have installed a version of ML v2.3.NEXT.2014Jan04.650D104
PinkDotRemover
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6658.msg73736#msg73736
Quote from: Walter Schulz on January 04, 2014, 09:02:31 PM
PinkDotRemover
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6658.msg73736#msg73736
thank you very much! everything works, artifacts disappeared!!!!!
you helped me a lot! ...and Google translator ;D
First test in 1280x720 - 24fps
Far from perfect (also the workflow was really annoying too) but would now love to have a 5dmk3 and playing with 1080 raw because coming from 1080 h264 to 720p even in raw is a bit of a shock...!
I Have an Error on my 650D (T4i) when i record RAW, it stopped immediately and after says: Early Stop (17) Please report this bug. What happened? Thanks.
The raw recoriding module over-estimated your card speed a little, so it stopped earlier than normal. It might have squeezed a few more frames (1-2 seconds).
I added this message so I could get an idea about how often it happens.
Quote from: a1ex on January 07, 2014, 05:41:53 PM
The raw recoriding module over-estimated your card speed a little, so it stopped earlier than normal. It might have squeezed a few more frames (1-2 seconds).
I added this message so I could get an idea about how often it happens.
So i need a faster card, right ?
Depends. 650D is bottlenecked by a slow SD-card interface. You get about 41 MByte/s transfer rate. No more. Period.
Ciao, Walter
Quote from: Walter Schulz on January 07, 2014, 09:20:57 PM
Depends. 650D is bottlenecked by a slow SD-card interface. You get about 41 MByte/s transfer rate. No more. Period.
Ciao, Walter
Thanks Walter!
there are cards fast for our cameras, I recommend to buy the card at 90-95mb/s
here
http://ru.sandisk.com/products/memory-cards/sd/extremepro-sdxc-sdhc-uhs-1-95mbs/ ;)
Quote from: sivencov_v on January 08, 2014, 06:07:08 AM
there are cards fast for our cameras, I recommend to buy the card at 90-95mb/s
here
http://ru.sandisk.com/products/memory-cards/sd/extremepro-sdxc-sdhc-uhs-1-95mbs/ ;)
Yes, 95 MB/s cards worked well for me too, also although the 650D max SD card write speed is about 41 MB/s, 45 MB/s cards would not record for long at 1280x720@24fps (they wrote about 1 MB/s too slow for continuous recording). With 95 MB/s cards I recorded continuously at 1280x720@24fps until the the card ran out of free space, about 15 mins on a 32GB card.
Be aware that for some reason even with fast SD cards it could take 15-45 secs for the camera to enter continuous recording mode, some say the card needs to 'warm up'.
Even with 45MB/s cards it is possible to record continuous 720p24
Quote from: spider on January 08, 2014, 11:52:10 PM
Even with 45MB/s cards it is possible to record continuous 720p24
I would think so too and I believe you when you say this and I have heard others say the same, but when I tried my SanDisk Extreme 45 MB/s cards they seemed to write just a hair too slow for long term continuous recording, they were writing low to mid 36.x MB/s and it just wasn't enough, needed mid to high 37.x MB/s for continuous. BUT, maybe it was just the build I was using at the time or the copy of those particular cards. I wish they would have worked for me, because the 95 MB/s cards weren't cheap!
dear friends! anyone else have flash with speed 95mb/s ? I would like to hear feedback from the owners? I want to buy such a vehicle, but I think worth it to take or not?
P.S. sorry for my English )
Quote from: Roger2004 on January 06, 2014, 08:50:57 PM
First test in 1280x720 - 24fps
Far from perfect (also the workflow was really annoying too) but would now love to have a 5dmk3 and playing with 1080 raw because coming from 1080 h264 to 720p even in raw is a bit of a shock...!
Roger,
Nice video. Helps us understand what the shock is :)
dave
Thanks David, i really never shoot in 720p so that was a bit surprising !
But still, Raw on those cameras is clearly amazing (ML Team / Alex is incredible), what you can pull out of it is great.
Quote from: jimmyD30 on January 09, 2014, 04:51:30 AM
I would think so too and I believe you when you say this and I have heard others say the same, but when I tried my SanDisk Extreme 45 MB/s cards they seemed to write just a hair too slow for long term continuous recording, they were writing low to mid 36.x MB/s and it just wasn't enough, needed mid to high 37.x MB/s for continuous. BUT, maybe it was just the build I was using at the time or the copy of those particular cards. I wish they would have worked for me, because the 95 MB/s cards weren't cheap!
Same here, have SanDisk Extreme 45MB/s and can rec only ~26sec @720p. That's it or can do something?
And cant get it atm, if i have 95MB/s card can i rec continuous @720p, but not higher res?
Quote from: HrRaiko on January 11, 2014, 06:54:38 AM
Same here, have SanDisk Extreme 45MB/s and can rec only ~26sec @720p. That's it or can do something?
And cant get it atm, if i have 95MB/s card can i rec continuous @720p, but not higher res?
Although the card may be rated 45 MB/s, they don't always achieve that speed, that's been my experience (and others on this forum) anyway, probably because those ratings are usually READ speeds, WRITE speeds are usually a bit lower.
Yes, with a 95 MB/s card you can DEFINITELY achieve continuous 1280x720@24fps all day long, but that's the max I can get (reason being, the camera itself can't write any faster to the SD card). And if you format the card exFat, you can write larger than 4 GB file size. For example, I have recorded continuous video on a SanDisk Extreme Pro 95 MB/s 32 GB card until it was full, about 15 mins.
Quote from: jimmyD30 on January 11, 2014, 02:09:38 PM
Although the card may be rated 45 MB/s, they don't always achieve that speed, that's been my experience (and others on this forum) anyway, probably because those ratings are usually READ speeds, WRITE speeds are usually a bit lower.
Yes, with a 95 MB/s card you can DEFINITELY achieve continuous 1280x720@24fps all day long, but that's the max I can get (reason being, the camera itself can't write any faster to the SD card). And if you format the card exFat, you can write larger than 4 GB file size. For example, I have recorded continuous video on a SanDisk Extreme Pro 95 MB/s 32 GB card until it was full, about 15 mins.
if I understand you, then all it is worth to buy this card?
Quote from: sivencov_v on January 11, 2014, 05:25:29 PM
if I understand you, then all it is worth to buy this card?
If you want to shoot continuous RAW at 1280x720@24fps on 650D then Yes!
The 95MBps cards will guarantee you can achieve this, as long as your camera can meet the 41MBps SD write speed the specs/forum members say it can do (which should be no problem and have not heard of anyone not getting this speed out of the camera). Reason I say this is because every electronic component every manufactured has some variation to it from the 'mean' stated in the specs, but usually very little and the better the manufacturer, the closer to the expected specs it will be.
For the 650D this isn't really a problem, because to get continuous 1280x720@24fps you need to write at a little above 37MBps, which falls well within the 41MBps spec even including some +/- variation.
Slower rated cards MIGHT be able to do it, depends on the 'copy' you get (every memory card made varies slightly in its read/write speed, the ratings given to a card are general and usually denote the read speed which is typically faster than the write speed).
This where the quality of the card comes into play, where as a SanDisk or Lexar would not be a problem, I have heard of KomputerBay cards causing issues.
Quote from: sivencov_v on January 11, 2014, 05:25:29 PM
if I understand you, then all it is worth to buy this card?
Well as successes, bought a card ? Share your thoughts and observations.
RU/ Ну как успехи, купил карту ? Поделись мыслями и наблюдениями.
Quote from: FALLOUT on January 14, 2014, 05:58:44 PM
Well as successes, bought a card ? Share your thoughts and observations.
RU/ Ну как успехи, купил карту ? Поделись мыслями и наблюдениями.
о, наши люди) в моем городе не продаются такие к сожалению ...заказал по почте, card приедет 20го числа, как проверю ее, поделюсь впечатлениями ;)
translate -
Oh, our people)) in my city are not sold such unfortunately ...ordered by mail, the card will come 20th of the number, how to put it, share impressions ;)
Quote from: sivencov_v on January 14, 2014, 06:06:39 PM
о, наши люди) в моем городе не продаются такие к сожалению ...заказал по почте, card приедет 20го числа, как проверю ее, поделюсь впечатлениями ;)
translate -
Oh, our people)) in my city are not sold such unfortunately ...ordered by mail, the card will come 20th of the number, how to put it, share impressions ;)
And...
Translate -
и ...
my card came!) BUT! I not long rejoiced. Indeed, the recording speed of RAW restricts the camera itself. And that would be a lot not to write, publish picture:
моя карточка приехала!) НО! я не долго радовался. Действительно, скорость записи RAW ограничивает сама камера. И что бы много не писать, выкладываю фото:
(http://radikale.ru/data/upload/4efc3/4efc3/283417eeb4_preview.jpg) (http://radikale.ru/full/4efc3/4efc3/283417eeb4.jpg.html)
hence the conclusion:
on our cameras (650d) buy very high-speed card does not make sense (
отсюда вывод:
на наших камерах (650d) покупать очень скоростные карты нет смысла (
Quote from: sivencov_v on January 22, 2014, 05:37:30 PM
my card came!) BUT! I not long rejoiced. Indeed, the recording speed of RAW restricts the camera itself. And that would be a lot not to write, publish picture:
моя карточка приехала!) НО! я не долго радовался. Действительно, скорость записи RAW ограничивает сама камера. И что бы много не писать, выкладываю фото:
(http://radikale.ru/data/upload/4efc3/4efc3/283417eeb4_preview.jpg) (http://radikale.ru/full/4efc3/4efc3/283417eeb4.jpg.html)
hence the conclusion:
on our cameras (650d) buy very high-speed card does not make sense (
отсюда вывод:
на наших камерах (650d) покупать очень скоростные карты нет смысла (
Ok, where did you buy your card? Maybe counterfeit? Doubt it, but try doing in-camera card speed test and post results. If card write speed is less than 37MBps the card may be fake or just a bad copy (return for replacement if not a big hassle). Also, the particular ML build you're using may affect RAW recording performance. Another thing is to turn all other ML stuff off and use fps override and set to 23.976 (ML may show 23.973), this little bit of difference can actually make it work versus 24 fps.
You really shouldn't give up on getting 720p@24fps out of the camera, the combination of your camera and card should allow you to (just barely) record at this rate. Also, in your regular Canon menu, set picture type to RAW, this will give you the largest image buffer even for using ML RAW and set video to 1920x1080@24fps even though you will be shooting ML at 1280x720p.
I can tell you that you will need to play with the settings to get the greatest performance out of the camera for shooting RAW at 720p 24fps.
Hello People!, i have my New Sandisk Extreme 8GB 45 MB/s, I ordered 4 cards with 8gb each one because using small capacity card is better for keep cooler the camera, i read this in a forum and is true! One card is full? you change to another card and the camera will be cooler again.
Today I tested the RAW Video with this card and I have 1 minute and 20 seconds of continuos 720@24p video! For me is enough because I do cinema and the takes are very small.
I tested at 648@24p and I have continuous video with no problem!
(http://img.dxcdn.com/productimages/sku_289238_1.jpg)
Regards!
PD: I used the option "Card Warm Up with 64mb" and i put the camera in Raw photo mode.
Quote from: sivencov_v on January 22, 2014, 05:37:30 PM
hence the conclusion:
on our cameras (650d) buy very high-speed card does not make sense (
отсюда вывод:
на наших камерах (650d) покупать очень скоростные карты нет смысла (
Use the ML GUI overlay while recording. The canon GUI draws a lot power or turn small hacks on.
Quote from: gabolandia on January 22, 2014, 10:15:02 PM
Hello People!, i have my New Sandisk Extreme 8GB 45 MB/s, I ordered 4 cards with 8gb each one because using small capacity card is better for keep cooler the camera, i read this in a forum and is true! One card is full? you change to another card and the camera will be cooler again.
Today I tested the RAW Video with this card and I have 1 minute and 20 seconds of continuos 720@24p video! For me is enough because I do cinema and the takes are very small.
I tested at 648@24p and I have continuous video with no problem!
Regards!
PD: I used the option "Card Warm Up with 64mb" and i put the camera in Raw photo mode.
Sweet, and if you really need to shoot for longer than a minute or so and want 720p@24fps you can always up-res the 648@24p footage, the RAW video (especially in 3x crop mode) should hold up well :-)
jimmyD30
thanks for the tip! I conducted a test with 25 frames, it was modest result.
Today I will try your request 24 frames. I think everything will work out! :)
Quote from: sivencov_v on January 23, 2014, 05:54:02 AM
jimmyD30
thanks for the tip! I conducted a test with 25 frames, it was modest result.
Today I will try your request 24 frames. I think everything will work out! :)
Sounds good! Let us know how it works out, also keep in mind it can take 15-45 secs before you get continuous footage OK message, meaning you will see yellow indicator for that period of time, then finally should see green (depending on build or if using MLV raw you may see different indicators).
Quote from: jimmyD30 on January 23, 2014, 01:26:35 PM
Sounds good! Let us know how it works out
after my tests (recording 720p) is the following: Record 24 frames = 35 seconds, a record 23,976 frames = 45 seconds, recording 23 frames = more than 2 minutes.
in this case, you can safely record video where the frame will last a short time. :) (Commercials, music video, etc.)
All of course understandable, but ... how do you solve the problem with the red and green dots.
And what developers think about this ?
Here's the topic : http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6658.350 but nothing good here not found.
PIC
768x326 I here about it :
____________________________________________________________________________________________
Всё конечно понятно, но ... как вы решаете проблему с красными и зелёными точками.
И что думают разработчики по этому поводу ?
Вот есть тема : http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6658.350 но ничего хорошего тут не нашёл.
PIC
768x326 Я вот про это :
(http://radikal.ua/data/upload/04012/4fa6c/7e140d0ca9.jpg)
raw2dng_cs2x2 didn't help?
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=6658.msg89534#msg89534
все правильно, пару страниц назад мне тоже помогли этой программкой PinkDotRemover ...я думал ты(вы) в курсе.
вот держи http://www.fayloobmennik.net/3519323
Quote from: FALLOUT on January 25, 2014, 12:02:38 PM
All of course understandable, but ... how do you solve the problem with the red and green dots.
And what developers think about this ?
Pink dots are from fixed location focus points and as per sivencov use PinkDotRemover (which it looks like you may not have done yet), red and blue pixels (which happened to me when I shot footage in snow also in addition to the expected pink dots) are probably overexposed areas and best fix is per A1ex using chroma smoothing or take extreme care not to overexpose when capturing footage (hard to do in shot with snow though).
Вчера я снимал ролик магазину сувениров, ну и ради експеремента отснял все в RAW. Скоро смонтирую, покажу что получилось. Можно будет считать это видео как тест со слабой освещенностью :)
Yesterday I shot the video clip gift shops, well, for the sake of all eksperementa filmed in RAW. Fit soon, will show what happened. Can be considered as a test of this video with poor lighting :)
here are a few shots, see how it happened:
canon 650d + ML (v2.3.NEXT.2014Jan19) + canon 50mm f 1.8 + zenitar 16mm f 2.8
iso = 320-400, 1280*720 25p
Вау, впечатляет. Всё, в начале февраля покупаю extreme pro card или extreme. Ты говорил, что есть ограничение потока в камере ? сколько Mb/s твоё RAW видео?
Да и спасибо за ссылку на ДотРемувер, сегодня поюзаю, что за зверь такой :).
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Wow, very impressive. All, in the beginning of February, buy extreme pro card or extreme. You said there was restriction of the flow in the camera ? how many Mb/s your RAW video?
Quote from: FALLOUT on January 26, 2014, 02:12:16 PM
Вау, впечатляет. Всё, в начале февраля покупаю extreme pro card или extreme. Ты говорил, что есть ограничение потока в камере ? сколько Mb/s твоё RAW видео?
Да и спасибо за ссылку на ДотРемувер, сегодня поюзаю, что за зверь такой :).
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Wow, very impressive. All, in the beginning of February, buy extreme pro card or extreme. You said there was restriction of the flow in the camera ? how many Mb/s your RAW video?
ну моя камера при записи писала поток 35+ mb/s ...но я записывал кадры не больше 10-15 секунд )
...если у тебя есть вопросы, можно писать мне на http://vk.com/sivencov ...что бы тут не путать людей русским языком ;D
I have a 700D/t5i, which should work exactly the same as this model. Can someone just tell me what memory card I can use that offers the correct read/write speed to shoot 720p RAW , with decent capacity and a cheap price. Went through this thread and people have had pretty inconsistent results (though it may be because some people with issues had fake cards).
my card is not fake. verified.
as discussed above, limits the flow rate of the camera itself.
so you need to buy card 10 class write speed 35-45 mb / s
Well I have a 30 mb/s card, its too slow, and apparently the 45 mb/s cards don't actually write at 45 , but close to. Theoretically, with the 100 mhz bus apparently these cameras should be able to do around 50 mb/s, so I'm looking at something more like:
http://www.amazon.ca/SanDisk-Extreme-microSDHC-Class-Adapter/dp/B00D6XXL7M/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1390841264&sr=8-2&keywords=sandisk+80mb+SD
Is the extra speed a waste of money? what is a tried and trusted card to shoot the best possible resolution RAW on the 700D?
@christo:
Why would you want to use a Micro SD card? I don't know what the adapter will do to the speed.
I think it is a waste of money anyways. I use Sandisk Extreme with 45MB/s, and I can do 720p without any trouble. The card gives me around 40MB/s write speed.
http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B004Q3C98S/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&keywords=sandisk%20extreme&qid=1390851920&sr=8-3 (http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B004Q3C98S/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&keywords=sandisk%20extreme&qid=1390851920&sr=8-3) ( I am not canadian I just used it to show you the card I use)
There is also a version of this card wich is colored gold instead of black. It's label/name is the same, but I don't know how this version performs. Maybe it is just something that is different in some countries, or a newer version of the card perhaps.
Quote from: _DK_ on January 27, 2014, 09:06:21 PM
@christo:
Why would you want to use a Micro SD card? I don't know what the adapter will do to the speed.
I think it is a waste of money anyways. I use Sandisk Extreme with 45MB/s, and I can do 720p without any trouble. The card gives me around 40MB/s write speed.
http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B004Q3C98S/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&keywords=sandisk%20extreme&qid=1390851920&sr=8-3 (http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B004Q3C98S/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&keywords=sandisk%20extreme&qid=1390851920&sr=8-3) ( I am not canadian I just used it to show you the card I use)
There is also a version of this card wich is colored gold instead of black. It's label/name is the same, but I don't know how this version performs. Maybe it is just something that is different in some countries, or a newer version of the card perhaps.
Sorry i guess i didn't check that it was micro. So you can shoot continuously till the end of the card? no dropped frames? If that's the case I'll get it. Also how many minutes of raw footage can you get with 32 gb? i probably need two. Also, does sound recording work? i believe the module is mlv_sound (which to my understanding records the sound separately so you have to sync it later)
So i ended up getting a deal on this card (price matched to 50 bucks) http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/sandisk-sandisk-extreme-plus-80mb-s-32gb-sdhc-class-10-uhs-i-memory-card-sdsdxs-032g-x46s/10262059.aspx
Can't do 24 fps at 720p. I test write speeds on my computer, its capped at about 41 mb/s, i do test speeds through ML and i get like 35-37mb/s. I do 720p for about 10 seconds before a frame is skipped and it fails. So clearly this card is a scam as it isnt going anywhere near 60 mb/s in write speed. I guess i'll return them tomorrow and try the 45 mb/s variant..
I suppose you used a decent USB 3.0 cardreader on your PC for testing.
Quote from: Walter Schulz on January 28, 2014, 03:05:15 AM
I suppose you used a decent USB 3.0 cardreader on your PC for testing.
It's built into my thinkpad. At any rate, it's no where near the speed on the camera tests either. I should also note I'm using a T5i (but that thread is pretty dead) and I'm using the nightly builds. Should I be using something more optimized for RAW? I just want to be able to do 16:9 720 p at 24 fps.
So you have no clue if your PC based test is bottlenecked by the card or the card reader. Therefore test results are invalid. Any conclusions based on this test are meaningless, too.
Quote from: Walter Schulz on January 28, 2014, 03:47:08 AM
So you have no clue if your PC based test is bottlenecked by the card or the card reader. Therefore test results are invalid. Any conclusions based on this test are meaningless, too.
I concluded this off the camera test as well.. When it's telling me the card will only do something like 35.5 mb/s and is inadequate for 720p, I think I can safely conclude its the card.
There may be a number of reasons why you were getting those numbers. No proper testing method involved -> Invalid results -> Invalid conclusions.
Ex falso quodlibet
Quote from: Walter Schulz on January 28, 2014, 03:56:59 AM
There may be a number of reasons why you were getting those numbers. No proper testing method involved -> Invalid results -> Invalid conclusions.
Most of the pages on this thread show people running the RW test from ML , and basing conclusions off that. As i just explained, im averaging like 30 mb/s, varying from 29.3 to 34 or so.. this is nowhere near the 60 mb/s it's advertised at. I'm not understanding why it's a proper testing method for others but not in this case, can you elaborate?
EDIT
(http://i.imgur.com/dQHYMTn.png)
Quote from: christo on January 28, 2014, 04:00:25 AM
Most of the pages on this thread show people running the RW test from ML
Most = More than half of.
Let's see:
1: Nope
2: No
3: Njet
4: First one
5: Second one
6: And a no again
7: None either
8: Nada
9: Zilch
10: niente
11: And number 3.
3 out of 11 ... most?
Thank you for your help. I see being an elitist is easier than offering any kind of direction!
Quote from: jimmyD30 on January 11, 2014, 06:31:35 PM
If you want to shoot continuous RAW at 1280x720@24fps on 650D then Yes!
The 95MBps cards will guarantee you can achieve this, as long as your camera can meet the 41MBps SD write speed the specs/forum members say it can do (which should be no problem and have not heard of anyone not getting this speed out of the camera). Reason I say this is because every electronic component every manufactured has some variation to it from the 'mean' stated in the specs, but usually very little and the better the manufacturer, the closer to the expected specs it will be.
For the 650D this isn't really a problem, because to get continuous 1280x720@24fps you need to write at a little above 37MBps, which falls well within the 41MBps spec even including some +/- variation.
Slower rated cards MIGHT be able to do it, depends on the 'copy' you get (every memory card made varies slightly in its read/write speed, the ratings given to a card are general and usually denote the read speed which is typically faster than the write speed).
This where the quality of the card comes into play, where as a SanDisk or Lexar would not be a problem, I have heard of KomputerBay cards causing issues.
Hi All,
first of all thanks for the wonderul work you all are doing. really appreciated the efforts Dev team & this community.
I have recently installed ML to my canon 650d, because I was curious about the dual ISO & Raw video feature (using sony 95mb card). I am impressed with the result of dual ISO footage. But on the other hand I am facing challange in raw video. I converted the raw file to dng using raw2dng.exe however non of my application is recognizing DNG format. so far i have tried PS cs6, LR5. i also updated my Adobe Camera Raw to version 8.2 but still no hope. I would really appreciate your help on this.
Thanks
TJ
Quote from: christo on January 27, 2014, 10:37:50 PM
.... So you can shoot continuously till the end of the card? no dropped frames? If that's the case I'll get it.
...
No dropped frames. It records until the 4GB limit is reached. I never tried out more, since for me there is no need to remove the 4gb limit. Other users reported the same thing back in the old 650D thread.
I just think there are a lot of different versions out there, some might just be fake and some might not come close to the speed written on the card. Your card seems a bit low, even I though I can't tell if it is your card reader... This particular card works for me, so I' fine with it :)
I have no clue about your audio questions. I record music videos, so I have no need for Audio. I never even tried it.
Quote from: _DK_ on January 28, 2014, 09:43:14 PM
No dropped frames. It records until the 4GB limit is reached. I never tried out more, since for me there is no need to remove the 4gb limit. Other users reported the same thing back in the old 650D thread.
I just think there are a lot of different versions out there, some might just be fake and some might not come close to the speed written on the card. Your card seems a bit low, even I though I can't tell if it is your card reader... This particular card works for me, so I' fine with it :)
I have no clue about your audio questions. I record music videos, so I have no need for Audio. I never even tried it.
Hey I'm returning the cards I got. I settled on these: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007M54E1M/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
4 gigs is about 2 minutes of footage, I don't think I'll be recording that long on one clip. I noticed the preview is really laggy, how do you preview your shots? Or do you just do as many takes as possible and then check your work in post
I only preview my videos later on the computer. I make sure that I get the focus and that's it. For this I use a second display, and/or a viewfinder,both along with focus peaking, depending on the situation/space I have.
As I said I almost only do music videos.I let the song play and record everything in one take (or at least much of it) than I choose another angle and do most of it again. I keep changing angles/locations again and again if it fits the song. Like this I have many different shots that I can combine so there is no need to preview everything on set. I have a song of 2-4 minutes, but in some circumstances 2 hours of footage, to choose from. This is the safest way to get it done, and also the way to have most possibilities. I also copy the memory cards on set, to have enough space with not that many cards.
If you really need to record something that is unique or that is important to nail it in one try, I suggest you should use normal recording.
Raw comes in handy for situations in darker areas and/or for situations with a lot of contrast (very dark and very light parts). For the rest you should be fine with normal video.
if you do it like an adult, then the music video, you must first draw the storyboard! then to take only those frames that are needed;) looks like this:
Hi All,
first of all thanks for the wonderul work you all are doing. really appreciated the efforts Dev team & this community.
I have recently installed ML to my canon 650d, because I was curious about the dual ISO & Raw video feature (using sony 95mb card). I am impressed with the result of dual ISO footage. But on the other hand I am facing challange in raw video. I converted the raw file to dng using raw2dng.exe however non of my application is recognizing DNG format. so far i have tried PS cs6, LR5. i also updated my Adobe Camera Raw to version 8.2 but still no hope. I would really appreciate your help on this.
Thanks
TJ
Quote from: sivencov_v on January 29, 2014, 10:20:04 AM
if you do it like an adult, then the music video, you must first draw the storyboard! then to take only those frames that are needed;)
...
Storyboards are only possible if there is a specific plan. Especially for rap videos this is very unlikely.
For most of the music videos this is how it is done. This way especially when working with people who are unfamiliar with cameras it is not important if they make mistakes like looking away from the camera. This is very likely for newer artists who never done this before.
Of course when there is a story in the video, a storyboard would be pretty useful. However it is not like I go out and randomly shoot scenes. I have the places and the things I want to get, but I just use many different angles to get more variation and to avoid the mistakes of the actor/musician.
You know new musicians have very tight time schedules so they can't redo a scene very often ;)
Quote from: tjgehc on January 29, 2014, 12:54:13 PM
...
I converted the raw file to dng using raw2dng.exe however non of my application is recognizing DNG format. so far i have tried PS cs6, LR5.
...
Even PS CS2 is capable of opening it. Lightroom 5 works fine for me too.
Are you sure you used the converted frames? Maybe you accidentally used the unconverted file. Every picture should be a single item (~24 pictures for each second of video). If you use the file where they are all saved in one file it does not work.
Even PS CS2 is capable of opening it. Lightroom 5 works fine for me too.
Are you sure you used the converted frames? Maybe you accidentally used the unconverted file. Every picture should be a single item (~24 pictures for each second of video). If you use the file where they are all saved in one file it does not work.
[/quote]
Thanks for the relpy DK, i guess i am messing up with something here as i was also quite shocked that even PS CS6 is not reading my files. Althoug i am quite sure that i converted my raw file to dng as there were tones of DNG farmes in my extracted folder..
Hello everyone, I've been the silent tester for Magic Lantern for a bit now. I'm finally going to leave my findings of the ML 650D RAW video here for you to read.
First a BIG thank you to the developers of Magic Lantern.
I've read through the threads that you need a SDXC Extreme Pro card 95/mbs for continuous shooting @ 1280 x 720p.
Its not the case for me. I use a SDHC Extreme card 45/mbs for continuous shooting @ 1280 x 720p.
My first run made the 4gb limit, so what I did was reformat to exfat and then did another test which it made it past the 4 minute mark and no signs of stopping.
My next finding was that the RAW format used on Magic Lantern is indeed shooting at 1920 x 1080p but being cropped to a 1280 x 720p frame. Let me elaborate.
I first filmed using the original canon codec @ 1920 x 1080p, setting the camera on a tripod, then leaving the camera in the same exact position, I switched to the RAW format @ 1280 x 720p and the center of the image stayed in the same exact position in the frame. The 720p RAW image is a cropped frame ( all four sides of the image cut off ) of the 1080p.
Next the RAW video was then converted to DNG format and placed along with the canon codec 1080p on a SONY Vegas 1080p timeline. I then took the 1080p image and zoomed it to match the 720p RAW cropped image and the results were astonishing to me.
Now since both images are equals of each other 720p RAW image ( a crop of 1080p ) and Canon codec 1080p ( cropped to match RAW 720p ), the 720p RAW image surpassed the image quality of the Canon codec by leaps and bounds in detail and dynamic range.
Here is a video I made of the comparison.
My next test will be similar except of leaving the camera in the same position as the Canon 1080p image, I will reframe the 720p RAW to match the Canon 1080p frame.
Please let me know what you think.
Quote from: bubsiec on January 30, 2014, 02:51:46 PM
Please let me know what you think.
The scenes you're shooting don't really have a lot of range to them to begin with, hard to see the real benefits of shooting RAW. I'm surprised you can get such images on both with 0 noise though.. I can't seem to do that without reasonable lighting.
What's the accepted best workflow for retaining as much quality in RAW's while minimizing processing time and workload on the computer? I'm going to be using the MLV_snd and rec modules (so i can extract wav) , i guess use mlvdump to get RAW files, then use raw2dng with the pinkdotremove built in. But then I'm unsure of what to do with the DNG's from there on
Quote from: christo on January 31, 2014, 04:28:58 PM
The scenes you're shooting don't really have a lot of range to them to begin with, hard to see the real benefits of shooting RAW.
I agree they don't have a lot of range, but what I was trying to achieve was more capabilities in detail with raw. The raw file was upscaled in a 1080p timeline vs the original 1080p footage cropped to match the 720p as far as framing. Raw truly excelled.
Quote from: christo on January 31, 2014, 04:28:58 PM
I'm surprised you can get such images on both with 0 noise though.. I can't seem to do that without reasonable lighting.
The camera settings were the same for both raw and h.264.
ISO 400
Shutter @ 1/48 magic lantern hack
I used a 35mm rokinon cine lens @ T-Stop 2.8
I turned off all the lights and closed all blinds in my home and used 1 Umbrella lighting with a 45watt cfl bulb.
The combination produced an amazing image with no noise as I did not do any post editing.
Quote from: christo on January 31, 2014, 04:28:58 PM
What's the accepted best workflow for retaining as much quality in RAW's while minimizing processing time and workload on the computer?
I don't use the MLV I use regular RAW both are offered in magic lantern.
First I take all the raw files and put them on my desktop in a folder.
Second pass the raw file folder through " Pinkdotremover " which will override the orignals. So keep another copy elsewhere before using Pinkdotremover! Also when you use it and press convert you will not see anything happening, which is OK,
DON'T TOUCH IT! It will let you know when complete.
Third pass the overidden raw file folder through " BATCHelor_3.0_Alpha3 ". It will create your DNG files.
Forth is the tricky part, I open the files in Adobe After Effects. I hit the import tab then click on the first DNG file of the sequence, then click sequence in the same import box.
Fifth Adobe Camera Raw (ACR) will open which will let you do any color corrections you need to do. Once done hit OK.
Sixth is now sending it to render. Render it at settings Best, and Lossless. Render will take the longest of steps. But worth it.
Voila !!Now you have and avi lossless file which you can edit freely AND do color corrections if needed again.
Quote from: bubsiec on January 30, 2014, 02:51:46 PM
Hello everyone, I've been the silent tester for Magic Lantern for a bit now. I'm finally going to leave my findings of the ML 650D RAW video here for you to read.
You beat me to it! Nicely done, I was in the process of doing a similar test comparing H.264 to ML RAW myself, now I can think about doing something else :-)
For a better presentation with a test of this nature I would suggest using Vimeo, even with a free account you can control the quality better than you can with YouTube, this can help demonstrate your test videos better as Vimeo doesn't do as much compression.
Quote from: christo on January 28, 2014, 04:00:25 AM
Most of the pages on this thread show people running the RW test from ML , and basing conclusions off that. As i just explained, im averaging like 30 mb/s, varying from 29.3 to 34 or so.. this is nowhere near the 60 mb/s it's advertised at. I'm not understanding why it's a proper testing method for others but not in this case, can you elaborate?
The only card for me that writes 1280x720@24fps continuously until the card runs out of space without dropping a frame for close to 32GB is one that's rated 95MBps, I happen to be using SanDisk Extreme Pro version. I've tried the 45MBps ones and they came up about 1MBps too slow to write according to the above mentioned spec. I've never tried the 60MBps ones, so I can't comment on those (although you would think they would be able to write the 37.5MBps or so needed for continuous 720p@24fps). You could always film at the next lower resolution and upres in post without any worries, but I'm not sure how the PinkDotRemover tool handles resolutions other than 720p normal and at 3x crop, which it does very well for both of these.
Also, for some reason the card writes faster when filming then it ever does in the ML card speed tests that I've done, so I would be cautious as to relying on those results for final determination of the cards ability to film 720p@24fps RAW continuously.
Quote from: bubsiec on January 31, 2014, 07:30:13 PM
I don't use the MLV I use regular RAW both are offered in magic lantern.
First I take all the raw files and put them on my desktop in a folder.
Second pass the raw file folder through " Pinkdotremover " which will override the orignals. So keep another copy elsewhere before using Pinkdotremover! Also when you use it and press convert you will not see anything happening, which is OK, DON'T TOUCH IT! It will let you know when complete.
Third pass the overidden raw file folder through " BATCHelor_3.0_Alpha3 ". It will create your DNG files.
Forth is the tricky part, I open the files in Adobe After Effects. I hit the import tab then click on the first DNG file of the sequence, then click sequence in the same import box.
Fifth Adobe Camera Raw (ACR) will open which will let you do any color corrections you need to do. Once done hit OK.
Sixth is now sending it to render. Render it at settings Best, and Lossless. Render will take the longest of steps. But worth it.
Voila !!
Now you have and avi lossless file which you can edit freely AND do color corrections if needed again.
I concur, my work flow is exactly the same. You can see some of my videos here: https://vimeo.com/jamesdesira (https://vimeo.com/jamesdesira)
Quote from: jimmyD30 on February 02, 2014, 05:19:42 AM
For a better presentation with a test of this nature I would suggest using Vimeo, even with a free account you can control the quality better than you can with YouTube, this can help demonstrate your test videos better as Vimeo doesn't do as much compression.
Hey Jimmy, sorry I beat you to it. ;) lol, I do have a vimeo plus account, I just happened to upload from Youtube first and made that post while Vimeo was rendering.
I will be doing a lot more tests coming soon.
Nice workflow!
The reason I mention MLV is because it allows you to record sound also, to my knowledge the regular RAW modules do not allow this, whereas MLV you can extract a WAV file also. It seems like I can mimic your workflow but just do the beginning differently (using mlvdump to get the RAW files etc)
EDIT: not 100 % sold on rendering AVI files either, I think something like DNxHD might be better to work with in premiere (again just preference here, but my PC is 3 years old and not built for multimedia so i need to save resources where I can)
Quote from: christo on February 03, 2014, 06:40:01 PM
The reason I mention MLV is because it allows you to record sound also, to my knowledge the regular RAW modules do not allow this, whereas MLV you can extract a WAV file also. It seems like I can mimic your workflow but just do the beginning differently (using mlvdump to get the RAW files etc)
Yeah, I like MLV for the audio aspect of it too, especially for syncing to external recording. Not sure what's available for it as fas as post production goes now, but when it first came out there was no conversion apps for OSX platform, that's the main reason I stuck with the legacy RAW version. Also, not sure if MLV with audio on causes the 650D to take a performance hit with regard to 1280x720@24fps continuous recording capability.
I agree with you about outputting as AVI, early in the post process anyway (I don't know enough about it to say yea or nay really), but I do know you can't go wrong exporting RAW as lossless or ProRes 4444 for archiving then comverting into other formats as the need arises.
Quote from: christo on February 03, 2014, 06:40:01 PM
EDIT: not 100 % sold on rendering AVI files either, I think something like DNxHD might be better to work with in premiere (again just preference here, but my PC is 3 years old and not built for multimedia so i need to save resources where I can)
Quote from: jimmyD30 on February 04, 2014, 12:37:29 AM
I agree with you about outputting as AVI, early in the post process anyway (I don't know enough about it to say yea or nay really), but I do know you can't go wrong exporting RAW as lossless or ProRes 4444 for archiving then comverting into other formats as the need arises.
AVI is a editing lossless format, ProRes 4444 and DNxHD are great formats but after rendering them a few times you begin to degrade the footage as they are lossy formats. AVI can get several passes before it loses quality. AVI also prints image information on each individual frame which aids in better editing.
Yes depending on your machine AVI might not be feasible since files can be large.
As far as MLV over legacy RAW yes the camera does suffer a bit when recording with MLV, I personally use an external recorder for all my work and have a clapper board with a small crew.
Everyone's situation is different, just continue to make quality material, no matter how you get there!
Quote from: bubsiec on February 04, 2014, 03:11:15 AM
AVI is a editing lossless format...
Nope AVI is a container.
Quote from: sivencov_v on January 09, 2014, 08:14:49 PM
dear friends! anyone else have flash with speed 95mb/s ? I would like to hear feedback from the owners? I want to buy such a vehicle, but I think worth it to take or not?
P.S. sorry for my English )
Hey, was just shooting some RAW and repeatedly I wasn't getting continuous 1280x720@24fps, so I went to an older build and now I'm getting continuous all day long!
Try 2013-12-21 nightly build, that's December 21, 2013 or even try a day before and a day after, cause I can be off a 1/2 day due to time zones.
Give that one a shot and tell me what you think.
EDIT: Also, try formatting your cards exFAT at 128KBs, less headers to write than default size of 4KBs, considering each frame is about 1 MB (8 blocks) there won't be much waste.
I'm having trouble understanding whether or not it is possible to record audio while recording RAW videos.
If it is, could someone please let me know the step by step process how to do so. I'm quite new to Magic Lantern.
Thanks!
Quote from: timkev on February 06, 2014, 12:26:26 PM
I'm having trouble understanding whether or not it is possible to record audio while recording RAW videos.
If it is, could someone please let me know the step by step process how to do so. I'm quite new to Magic Lantern.
Thanks!
I know that you can record raw video and audio using the newer MLV recording format instead of the older RAW format. First you have to make sure you are using a build that offers it, one of the nightlies, not the older alpha build (unless a newer alpha or a beta build is now available which includes it, then you can use that). Then you need to turn on a few of the modules that don't get automatically loaded when using magic lantern. Also, there are different apps needed for post processing mlv then what you would normally use for the older raw format without audio.
I'm just giving you some high-level of info here, because I know for sure all the nitty-gritty details are readily available in previous post and other threads, just google 'magic lantern mlv recording format' and I'm sure you'll find your way, here's a good place to start though: http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=7122.0 (http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=7122.0)
I can manage to record 720p for a maximum of about 2 and 1/2 mins on the 650D using a genuine Sandisk extreme pro with 95MB/s write speeds. The Sd contoller on the camera is for sure the limiting factor and shows on average a maximum speed of 36/7 MB/s whihc is right at the edge for 720p recording. Its still a great feature to have though and 2 min clips are fine for my needs.some videos shortly
My main problem with the videos I have shot seem to be aliasing and noise issues.
I've also done a couple of short videos for showing how to install ML and the RAW features on the 650D, 600D and 700D. Hope these help someone. It took me hours to figure it out :)
RE: davocork
You can eliminate aliasing/moire by using digital 3x crop mode (when it's practical), see my video here: https://vimeo.com/jamesdesira (https://vimeo.com/jamesdesira)
Also, see my post above for a different build and card format that will give you 720p@24fps raw continuous, plus make sure you set Canon auto-shutoff to never when recording raw, as the camera doesn't detect usage in this mode.
Hi Jimmy, thanks for that, i will try the 3x crop tomorrow. Do you get the same aliasing and moire artifacts too in your vids (non crop)? In my vids it makes the vids pretty well unusable - its really bad..
I am guessing any of the vids i see which look good on youtube/vimeo are also shot in 3x crop mode?
I did try your build recommendations on your older post but still couldn't get 24p continuous. I also did the exfat format (and 128 header) and can record over the 4GB limit but it normally drops a frame and stops by 5 or 6 GBS. I just think the SD controller is at the absolute max it can cope with.
Quote from: davocork on February 16, 2014, 01:08:44 PM
Hi Jimmy, thanks for that, i will try the 3x crop tomorrow. Do you get the same aliasing and moire artifacts too in your vids (non crop)? In my vids it makes the vids pretty well unusable - its really bad..
I am guessing any of the vids i see which look good on youtube/vimeo are also shot in 3x crop mode?
I did try your build recommendations on your older post but still couldn't get 24p continuous. I also did the exfat format (and 128 header) and can record over the 4GB limit but it normally drops a frame and stops by 5 or 6 GBS. I just think the SD controller is at the absolute max it can cope with.
Some of my videos were shot in crop mode (all were shot as raw), but the ones that weren't I did not experience much aliasing/moire, mostly due to the subject matter I would imagine though. The amount of moire is completely dependent upon the subject you are shooting, objects with fine, closely spaced lines/patterns of any sort will cause moire, like a window screen or a roof top with shingles, etc. some DSLR videographers consciously try to avoid shooting these types of objects.
Aliasing is something different and any DSLR camera which uses line skipping (which I believe are all) will have it, the reason you don't get aliasing with ML digital 3x crop mode is because there is no line skipping in that mode.
No question the camera is near it's limit at 36/37MBps, that's why to get continuous raw at 720p@24fps you have to employ every tweak possible, like those I mentioned plus most everything else with ML needs to be turned off, especially all the global draw stuff. Also, when we talk about 24fps, we mostly really mean 23.976 (ML may display 23.973 or something) and that little bit of difference might make it work.
Hi Jimmy, thanks for the great info! Its really helpful. I'm gonna do a full test on crop mode etc tomorrow and get back to you.
I got some good news today though;
I did a quick test today on my 650D. I managed continuous 720p Raw recording for as long as I wanted. The difference was I used raw_rec instead of mlv_rec !
So to clarify raw_rec allows continuous non stop recording but mlv_rec will stop after about 2 mins in my experience.
Yeah, I was going to mention that also, but I wasn't sure if you were using MLV because you didn't mention anything about audio. I had the same experience, RAW works continuously but MLV doesn't for 720p@24fps.
The MLV format is really usfl for me cos of its sound capability. Since most of my shot are really only v short i'll probably continue to use MLV a lot
my raw video despite whatever white balance setting i use, turns out very warm. I only converted to .dng files for now, but i wanted to know if there is a way to fix that since I guess it could be fixed in adobe after effects but is this normal?
Quote from: anakin316 on February 17, 2014, 08:08:15 AM
my raw video despite whatever white balance setting i use, turns out very warm. I only converted to .dng files for now, but i wanted to know if there is a way to fix that since I guess it could be fixed in adobe after effects but is this normal?
Hello, when using any ML RAW format (probably all raw formats) no white balance is applied nor picture style. I'm not a raw expert, but basically raw is a dump of the sensor information without any processing (or very little anyway) by the camera, so everything you want to do to the video style needs to be done in post. But, many videographers will take a reference pic/image of something pure white in the environment they are shooting video to help set up the correct white balance in post considering every light source emits a different color temperature (even sunny days compared to cloudy days), especially fluorescent lights.
You can certainly browse this forum or google for more info regarding raw video color correction and the color temperature of light.
so when you shot your train video did your original video look very warm?
I have to say not really, I did adjust the white balance a little bit in post due to the overcast day, but I'm guessing because the scene didn't really have any warm colors to begin with it didn't have a warm tone to it. I don't know what your post processing work flow consist of, but shooting raw will almost always require color correction unless you are gong for some kind of artistic look to your video.
If you look at my Snow Fall video comparing raw to h.264 you can notice that the raw has a greenish tone to it, which could have been accounted for in post, but that wasn't the point of the video, so I just applied a very light amount of color correction to both videos for additional comparison reasons.
But you can readily see the difference in color tones between raw with no in-camera color processing and the h.264 which although I shot it flat (cinema picture style), still had some in-camera color processing done to it like white balance and picture style being applied to it.
well what I have noticed and read is that when using raw2dng, the dng files turn out to be around 6200K and with a +66 tint. Apparently the wb settings and the picture style settings are not taken into account when shooting raw. So I just wanted to know if it was the same for everyone since on this thread, no one talked about it.
Yes. Raw is indeed raw. You can apply any picture style you want in post with a far better output
Thanks jimmy and nanomad for clearing my doubts. Happy Shooting!!!
hi 650D guys. i have been shooting mlv raw with my canon 550D.it can records 1152 X 432 continous. i m thinking of upgrading to 650D since it can write 40mb/s. can anyone advice me if i should buy this camera or not
Used 50D would be a better choice if you can do without the 650D's display option.
Quote from: Walter Schulz on February 27, 2014, 03:54:28 PM
Used 50D would be a better choice if you can do without the 650D's display option.
[/quote
i need for mlv raw and not raw.50d is good for raw but there is no point of shooting mlv raw with 50d since it cant record audio.
anyway thanks
is there any chance of getting rid of red/green dots sooner or later? sold my 550D.very disappointed. i think magic lantern is best for 550D. more options like audio control n it gets clean raw.
Hello every Ml users,
I just have install ML in my 650D and im doing the first steps to now better how to use in the best way this magnificent program!
Im trying film in RAW but it is strange our i dont understand how it work.
I have follow a few steps to activate Raw Video,
Modules ->load modules now.. :
and activate
ETTR.MO - Off
file_MAN.MO - OFF
PIC_VIEW.MO - Off
RAw_REC - Ok
now in menu MOVIE I SET
Resolution - 1280x720
ASpect Ration - 16:9
Preview - Auto
Digital Dolly - off
frame skipping - off
card warm-up - off
small hacks - off
and playback off too
In Movie Mode On when I press LiveView button to record, show the frames count / expected, Time, file name, 36 MB/s, 20ms idle
Can anyone tell me some tips to make this video raw definition work better?
PS: I just can film with this settings 02:10 and then show me 1 skipped frame, why show me this info?
best regards
Is any one getting 1280x720 continuous mlv? I'm only getting exactly 1:50 seconds of footage with a san disk extreme 80mb/s uhs-1 class 10 32gb card. Is there any way to get 720p continuous mlv? Would a 90mb/s card help or am i already over killing it because of the controller speed limit?
Thanks guys.
Quote from: edge11 on March 17, 2014, 10:16:55 AM
Is any one getting 1280x720 continuous mlv? I'm only getting exactly 1:50 seconds of footage with a san disk extreme 80mb/s uhs-1 class 10 32gb card. Is there any way to get 720p continuous mlv? Would a 90mb/s card help or am i already over killing it because of the controller speed limit?
Thanks guys.
So far as I have seen, no one is getting continuous raw using MLV for more than 2 mins or so at 720p. The non-audio version of raw (the original ML RAW) can deliver continuous raw ad infinitum using fast SD cards (95 MBps) formatted exFAT. The max in-camera SD write speed has been determined to be about 41 MBps for this camera, so that's the limit and usually requires a fast SD card (rated 95 MBps) to meet such write speeds as the card's rating usually denotes the read speed with about 45-60 MBps actual write speeds.
Ah i see.
So i returned my san disk extreme 80mb/s uhs-1 class 10 32gb card and got a san disk extreme pro 95mb/s uhs-1 class 10 32gb card (it was $10 more and might have).
Whats the procedure for exFAT? Do i just format my card as exFAT and then the proceed as usual, or is there an extra step?
thanks guys.
Also, would any one be kind enough to share their workflow?
Quote from: edge11 on March 24, 2014, 03:56:58 AM
Do i just format my card as exFAT and then the proceed as usual, or is there an extra step?
thanks guys.
Also, would any one be kind enough to share their workflow?
Yeah, I just use a windows machine and format the card exFAT with 128 KB block size (only use this large block size with cards you will use raw video or else you will waste a lot if space).
See my ML RAW work flow videos here: https://vimeo.com/jamesdesira/
@jimmyD30:
Can you explain what the 128 KB block size does, and why you should only use it for raw video? Obviously it gives a better performance, but whats the downside?
Writing a file with 128 Kbyte on a medium with 512 byte block size: 256 write operations have to be handled.
Writing a file with 128 Kbyte on a medium with 128 Kbyte block size: 1 (one) write operation.
Less overhead.
If the card is used to store small data files there will be unused disk space allocated by each file.
Writing a XML with 1 Kbyte -> 128 Kbyte allocated.
127 Kbyte unusable for other files.
Not an issue when used within a cam IMO.
Ciao
Walter
Quote from: jimmyD30 on March 26, 2014, 05:33:58 PM
Yeah, I just use a windows machine and format the card exFAT with 128 KB block size (only use this large block size with cards you will use raw video or else you will waste a lot if space).
See my ML RAW work flow videos here: https://vimeo.com/jamesdesira/
I haven't been able to get it to work.
The card doesn't take the firmware update like it does when i have it to fat32
I'm following the instructions from page one of the 650d magic lantern thread.
Works 100% fine with fat32 doesn't work at all for me in exFAT.
any one know what i am doing wrong or have any suggestions as what i can do to make it happen?
You have to make the card bootable with eoscard.
So is there a difference between mlv and raw rec? I know raw dosent record audio but are the workflows different? Is one easier? Can anyone point me in the right direction to where I can find an up to date workflow for raw post?
Hi,
I'm a newbie to ML and have for the past few weeks been reading through the many threads.
I have the 650D and Installed ML however I'm having some Issues:
I purchased a Transend 90MB/s ultra 32gig USH-1 Write: 55,4MB/sec.
The only Module I have loaded is raw_rec.mo set initially set to 1280x720 these are my only settings in ML
Raw-Rec enabled
After about 10sec I get an error 'movie recording stopped automatically' nothing was saved to the memory card.
I then under Movie tab I reset the Raw video to 640x360 I do not get any error, however nothing again was saved to the memory card.
If I record with the canon firmware 1920x1080 @24 there are no issues.
I guess It could be the memory card or more likely be user error in the way of setup.
Any help in identifying the root cause of the issue would be greatly appreciated. Including cannon forware settings and also ML settings.
I guess If it's the card which I purchased from Amazon ( Not 3rd party seller) I'll dispatch it back to them.
Andrew
Quote from: Andre2000 on April 03, 2014, 12:33:31 PM
Hi,
I'm a newbie to ML and have for the past few weeks been reading through the many threads.
I have the 650D and Installed ML however I'm having some Issues:
I purchased a Transend 90MB/s ultra 32gig USH-1 Write: 55,4MB/sec.
The only Module I have loaded is raw_rec.mo set initially set to 1280x720 these are my only settings in ML
Raw-Rec enabled
After about 10sec I get an error 'movie recording stopped automatically' nothing was saved to the memory card.
I then under Movie tab I reset the Raw video to 640x360 I do not get any error, however nothing again was saved to the memory card.
If I record with the canon firmware 1920x1080 @24 there are no issues.
I guess It could be the memory card or more likely be user error in the way of setup.
Any help in identifying the root cause of the issue would be greatly appreciated. Including cannon forware settings and also ML settings.
I guess If it's the card which I purchased from Amazon ( Not 3rd party seller) I'll dispatch it back to them.
Andrew
Use the latest nightly, try mlv_rec instead of raw_rec, set the camera to 960x540 and get back to me.
HI,
I download the latest build which was April 2nd. I noticed the disable all modules was enabled by default.
I loaded the mlv_rec then set under Movie tab: RAW Video to 960x540. Got different results after 6 seconds I get frame skip but no file is saved. Another time instead of the red camcorder logo in rhe top right hand corner I get a green logo that seems to record for at least 30 seconds but no file on playback. So no file in ML up to this point is saved to the memory card.
Thanks for your help.
Andrew
How do you look for the file? Canon playback button?
Correct.
Also when I press the ML menu button ( cannon trash) It states recording in progress. The red recording light on bottom right of camera is illuminated.
Andrew
Strange thing is the files are on my memory card once I connect to my PC but will not open.
In addition Adobe after affects will not open the file which is a *.RAW
Andrew
I removed ML via the update firmware via canon interface.
Then followed Installation procedure from scratch, Updated to 4th April nightly build.
Recorded another file though this time I enabled mlv_playback as well as mlv-rec. I recorded a 30 second file. When I press canon preview It states preparing then display reads 'files ends prematurely during block header'
I'll try anything that won't brick my camera and should result in a resolution.
Is the latest nightly build proven to be working at least to record and playback?
Thanks again
Quote from: Andre2000 on April 03, 2014, 03:07:22 PM
Strange thing is the files are on my memory card once I connect to my PC but will not open.
In addition Adobe after affects will not open the file which is a *.RAW
Andrew
I thought you said there WAS no file... :p
Anyway of course it doesn't open a RAW file. That's why there's all those "RAW to DNG" programs out there. You should probably watch a couple of tutorial videos and check out a few of the tutorials here in the "RAW post processing" section.
As for your card... Is the file space shrinking? Because... if so... I would imagine it's simply saving to a different folder than the one you're looking in. (On my card there was nothing in the DCIM/100 folder because it created a DCIM/101 and then a DCIM/102 folder).
And look in your computer... not on your camera.
Quote from: rainless on April 03, 2014, 03:44:31 PM
I thought you said there WAS no file... :p
Anyway of course it doesn't open a RAW file. That's why there's all those "RAW to DNG" programs out there. You should probably watch a couple of tutorial videos and check out a few of the tutorials here in the "RAW post processing" section.
As for your card... Is the file space shrinking? Because... if so... I would imagine it's simply saving to a different folder than the one you're looking in. (On my card there was nothing in the DCIM/100 folder because it created a DCIM/101 and then a DCIM/102 folder).
And look in your computer... not on your camera.
It doesn't work like a normal Canon video. You shouldn't expect it to... it's in a completely different format. So you don't just record and playback like that. (although with mlv_play module loaded you get sort of a preview in file manager.
Rainless,
Did I say I was a noobie.
Thanks for the good advice, Seems the files may well have been good. I'll read the ML user manual, slow down a little and take my time to work through any Issues.
Thanks again.
Andrew
Whilst the video records fine at 960x540, It will not record without the frame stopping error at 1280x720. Which I presume translates to it cannot write to the card fast enough. Unless there is another reason including set up on the canon firmware or the ML.
My card supposed to accept a write speed of around 55.4MB/s. Just wondering where the bottleneck might be.
This is the card I purchased:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Transcend-Ultimate-Class-UHS-I-Memory/dp/B0085T0VXY/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
Andrew
Quote from: Andre2000 on April 03, 2014, 04:55:41 PM
Whilst the video records fine at 960x540, It will not record without the frame stopping error at 1280x720. Which I presume translates to it cannot write to the card fast enough. Unless there is another reason including set up on the canon firmware or the ML.
My card supposed to accept a write speed of around 55.4MB/s. Just wondering where the bottleneck might be.
This is the card I purchased:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Transcend-Ultimate-Class-UHS-I-Memory/dp/B0085T0VXY/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
Andrew
Maximum write speed for your camera is 40mbs. There's a chart linked-to frequently in this raw video section (and it's probably a sticky as well) that details all the write speeds of the various cameras. For example my 600D is limited to a 21mbs write speed. So it doesn't matter how fast your card is if your camera isn't fast enough to write to it.
Rainless,
Thanks again for your insight. I guess I got lots of information to digest, yours was very relevant.
Andrew
Quote from: Andre2000 on April 03, 2014, 05:31:16 PM
Rainless,
Thanks again for your insight. I guess I got lots of information to digest, yours was very relevant.
Andrew
Meh... I always felt like "people helping people" was the whole point to a tech forum. :)
Quote from: Walter Schulz on March 29, 2014, 10:58:58 AM
Writing a file with 128 Kbyte on a medium with 512 byte block size: 256 write operations have to be handled.
Writing a file with 128 Kbyte on a medium with 128 Kbyte block size: 1 (one) write operation.
Less overhead.
If the card is used to store small data files there will be unused disk space allocated by each file.
Writing a XML with 1 Kbyte -> 128 Kbyte allocated.
127 Kbyte unusable for other files.
Not an issue when used within a cam IMO.
Ciao
Walter
Exactly... Why I recommend 128KB moreso with using RAW is that each RAW 720p frame is almost 1 MB in size, so you only write 8 blocks of data per frame. If you were to format 4096 Byte block size (the default and most commonly used) then you would need to write roughly 250 blocks of data per frame with each block consisting of its own header and other components along with the data. Using a larger block size allows you to eke out every last bit of performance in order to help get 720p RAW continuous and when formatted exFAT which allows over 4 GB file size you can literally fill the card with one continuous shot however large the card. Now managing a huge file in post, well that's something you need to consider depending upon the post processing resources available to you :-)
This is admittedly a starters question. I'm really just getting into raw video. I'm using mlv on my T4i and what I'm noticing/reading is that when I record the video, it's actually cropping the frame on the live view and apparently the video to a smaller square in the middle. Is there anyway to turn this feature off so that the 1280x720 you're recording isn't just a center crop of a 1080 video so that I'm able to record the full screen? Thanks!
@SongsByHamilton: No. Raw Just reads out a certain area off the whole sensor and writes the image on the card without anything done to it.This means that there is a added crop factor to raw videos.
In normal video it uses what is called line skipping to process the image of the whole sensor into a single video. This is partly what causes moiré patterns.
This is not possible with raw due to camera limitations of processing power.
Another limitation is, that the controler of a T4i can only write just fast enough so that we are able to record 720p. Unfortunately the camera is not able to provide more write speed. This can not be fixed in the future since this is a hardware problem.
Still the 720p video will be way sharper and will have a much higher dynamic range than normal video.
@DK, Thanks for getting back to me! I appreciate the information. The continuous recording isn't a problem I've got the 95 MB/s cards so they write fast enough to get the continuous 720. What I'm wondering though is how everyone compensates for the cropping of the video. It takes the recording from the middle and cuts off everything else that it should be recording and puts a black area around it. Is the only option to move the camera back further to compose the scene the same way you normally would? Whats happening is if I position the camera on the tripod and sit down to record after composing the shot, what I end up with is a zoomed in version of my face which isn't what I should be getting. So it looks more so that it's just recording a smaller area and blowing it up in camera. Thanks again for any info!
I compose the shot right after I switched on raw. I just set up everything with the black bars on the display, so nothing is cut of or zoomed in.
Basically the raw video is like zooming in a bit. So you don't necessarily need to go back you can use a wider lens, if it still fits your visual style.
If the screen is to small with black bars on it, I suggest using a viewfinder, or a small external monitor to get a better view.
ah I see. Alright thanks for the info DK. Do you happen to know if this would still be an issue on a full frame like the 5D3 or 6D? I've been considering either of those and if that would solve this issue it might be what makes me pull the trigger.
i am so disappointed using magic lantern after buying 650D.now i cant control audio and unlike other camera it gets pink dots while shooting raw which takes double time in workflow.
Quote from: SongsByHamilton on April 08, 2014, 03:46:59 PM
ah I see. Alright thanks for the info DK. Do you happen to know if this would still be an issue on a full frame like the 5D3 or 6D? I've been considering either of those and if that would solve this issue it might be what makes me pull the trigger.
5d mark iii is the best for shooting raw. there is no issue which u mention above
Quote from: andy kh on April 08, 2014, 04:01:20 PM
i am so disappointed using magic lantern after buying 650D.now i cant control audio and unlike other camera it gets pink dots while shooting raw which takes double time in workflow.
Yeah, the pink dots are due to the 650D's hybrid focusing system (phase and contrast detection is utilized), which offers faster and more precise auto-focusing, but affects the ML RAW output as such.
That's the trade-off for that 40mbs SD card controller. :)
Fortunately there's all kinds of software available for removing the pink dots from the 650D.
It's always better to save up a little bit more and get a 7D or a 5Dmkii though. You're talking about 200-300 bucks but a UNIVERSE of difference.
Quote from: rainless on April 09, 2014, 11:45:14 AM
That's the trade-off for that 40mbs SD card controller. :)
Fortunately there's all kinds of software available for removing the pink dots from the 650D.
It's always better to save up a little bit more and get a 7D or a 5Dmkii though. You're talking about 200-300 bucks but a UNIVERSE of difference.
And the last software versions I used for removing the pink dots worked pretty good, except one worked better for normal mode and another worked better for digital 3x crop mode. Maybe there are newer versions, but it looked like the development on those apps was petering out the last I looked a while back.
You can get 5DM2 for a decent price used on ebay or wherever, but personally I'm looking to get the 5DM3 except they're still a little pricey. I'm thinking they'll come down in price (at least a little I hope) once the 5DM4 comes out, but if you consider Canon's release cycle for the 5D it probably won't be until next year at the soonest.
Quote from: jimmyD30 on April 09, 2014, 12:09:19 PM
And the last software versions I used for removing the pink dots worked pretty good, except one worked better for normal mode and another worked better for digital 3x crop mode. Maybe there are newer versions, but it looked like the development on those apps was petering out the last I looked a while back.
You can get 5DM2 for a descent price used on ebay or wherever, but personally I'm looking to get the 5DM3 except they're still a little pricey. I'm thinking they'll come down in price (at least a little I hope) once the 5DM4 comes out, but if you consider Canon's release cycle for the 5D it probably won't be until next year at the soonest.
5D3 price drop? Forget it.
You'll be waiting forever for that 5D4 to drop the 5D3 price. I haven't even heard a 5D4 rumored. They could easily stretch out the mk iii another 2-3 years.
No... if you need raw video at higher rez now and you can't afford a 5D3, then your best bet is the 5D2 or the 7D. If you can afford to wait until the 5D4, the whole point in having a 5D3 would be irrelevant because there'll probably be a whole SLEW of cameras that can record raw video by then.
Hell... You can already get a Black Magic Pocket for about the same price as a 5D2 or 7D (and not much more than what you spent on that 650D) So it's not like you're out of options. :)
>:( :( :o :-[ :-\ :'(
So many emotions...
shot with canon 650D in mlv raw
Quote from: jimmyD30 on April 13, 2014, 05:53:05 PM
>:( :( :o :-[ :-\ :'(
So many emotions...
Then of course there's the Panasonic GH4 coming out later this month http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1028453-REG/panasonic_dmc_gh4kbody_lumix_dmc_gh4_mirrorless_micro.html
...which shoots 4K at 1500 bucks as if it were no big deal at all.
No... by the time the 5D mk iv comes out I absolutely won't be thinking about a 5D mk iii...
Yeah, my friend is getting the GH4, but 4k what? H.264? I'll pass...
I'd take 4k H.264... if they had a patch that allowed us to do it continuously on the 5D mk III.
The point is this is just a $1500 panasonic. This raises the bar for all the other manufacturers. It's going to be tougher and tougher for Canon and Nikon now to release a camera that DOESN'T have 4k. Because sometime during the lifespan of the next gen of Canon and Nikon... 4k is going to be the standard.
(And the sooner they have 4K in a Canon DSLR the sooner we can have a 5k ML raw)
I guess it's what you plan on using it for... Home videos, school plays, weddings, ok h.264 is fine. But for filmmaking, doesn't cut the mustard IMO. I've seen and have done my own native h.264 vs ML RAW and there really isn't a comparison, raw is tremendously better. I've even compared h.264 1080p vs raw 720p upressed to 1080p and the raw was just blew away the native h.264.
See comparison here: https://vimeo.com/85974454
The drawbacks of h.264 for fillmaking are just too overwhelming to consider it a high value option, variable bit rate compression, low dynamic range, embedded picture style, etc.
As far as the GH4 which has a four thirds sensor vs full frame in the 5D, you will get images that have a shallower depth of field, greater dynamic range, and better low-light sensitivity with the larger sensor of the 5D, this is simply due to the laws of physics as it pertains to light waves, not the camera so much... What the camera does with those light waves is another story which is why raw is so desirable, because with raw the camera does just about nothing to them, of course sensor quality being another factor in the equation. So taking all this into consideration, for filmmaking anyway, I don't see h.264 video and the smaller sensor on the GH4 as being worthwhile option even with 4K.
Of course this assessment is simply from a technical point of view, not quality of content.
Yeah but the canons don't NATIVELY shoot in raw. And what you get on a canon raw shoot is far from guaranteed. So that's the trade'off unless you get a black magic pocket where the raw IS guaranteed.
And you're forgetting my point: 4k raw is where we're headed... sooner rather than later. (Sony could probably do that now with a firmware update.)
Yes, Canon does not natively shoot raw, but this is a ML forum and raw is what we are talking about, else we would be discussing this in a Canon forum.
So far for me raw has worked out well on the 650D, but other 650D users have had some hiccups. But as far as the 5D goes, professionals are relying heavily on their ML raw features on a daily basis and feature length films have been made using solely a 5D with ML RAW, so I can't agree with you that it's far from being guaranteed. ML RAW works, especially on the 5DM3.
Now Black Magic has it's own issues as far as RAW goes, and if you compare any BM and even most RED cameras to a 5DM3 using raw, the 5D delivers better images. I'm not going to go into detail of those comparison here for two reasons, one, this is a 650D thread, and two, you can find such comparisons elsewhere on the web.
I certainly agree with you that 4K is where the industry is heading, but right now the only viable viewing medium is a movie theater as there really are no mass produced 4K televisions available to speak of, and so if the theater is what you're aiming for, there are simply too many disadvantages of a 4K compressed image from a crop sensor to make sense right now for such a medium.
Let me say I've enjoyed our discussion on this matter and will be glad to read your response, but I won't reply any further to this specific topic any more, NOT anything to do with you, just thinking the moderators may not appreciate this lengthy of an off thread-topic discussion ;-)
What are you kidding? I'm sure we've bumped them up at least three notches on the Google keyword search! :P
Back to the 650D thing though. I can conclude the whole thing on two notes: nice buffer, but there's a reason why they went from the 650 to the 700 so quickly.
Yeah, coming out with the 700D so soon after the 650D really perplexed a lot of people. If you do a side-by-side comparison of the two there's little difference or improvement with the 700D.
Here's a breakdown where the reviewer calls it a tie between the two: http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon-EOS-650D-vs-Canon-EOS-700D
What's your opinion on why they came out with the 700D so quickly?
Quote from: jimmyD30 on April 16, 2014, 02:00:39 AM
Yeah, coming out with the 700D so soon after the 650D really perplexed a lot of people. If you do a side-by-side comparison of the two there's little difference or improvement with the 700D.
Here's a breakdown where the reviewer calls it a tie between the two: http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon-EOS-650D-vs-Canon-EOS-700D
What's your opinion on why they came out with the 700D so quickly?
I think the 650D was rushed to market in the first place. I remember it came out about a week or two after I got my 600D and I was mad as hell... then was an immediate recall because the grip was giving people skin rashes (that made me feel a little better) http://www.techradar.com/news/photography-video-capture/cameras/canon-recalls-eos-650d-cameras-says-faulty-grip-could-cause-skin-rash-1092239
That's just what was going on for the OUTSIDE of the camera. On the inside there were all these weird little sensor issues and other issues associated with the AF... http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/50717250
I think there was more wrong with the camera than people knew about... but CANON knew of course. So they decided to quickly release the 700D. Exactly like what Nikon did with the D600 and almost immediately replacing it with the D610 (which I didn't even realize had happened until I went to the camera shop last month.)
Quote from: rainless on April 16, 2014, 09:58:52 AM
I think the 650D was rushed to market in the first place. I remember it came out about a week or two after I got my 600D and I was mad as hell...
Type: Announcement date
450D: 23 January 2008
500D: 25 March 2009
550D: 8 February 2010
600D: 7 February 2011
650D: 8 June 2012
700D: 21 March 2013
In fact time gap between announcements of 650D and 600D is the largest in xxxD lineup since 450D came up the horizon.
Quote from: Walter Schulz on April 16, 2014, 10:21:43 AM
Type: Announcement date
450D: 23 January 2008
500D: 25 March 2009
550D: 8 February 2010
600D: 7 February 2011
650D: 8 June 2012
700D: 21 March 2013
In fact time gap between announcements of 650D and 600D is the largest in xxxD lineup since 450D came up the horizon.
Yeah I'm aware of that. But the distance between the 650D and the 700D was the shortest... which is what we're talking about.
which build version should I install for the raw?
Quote from: Silverfin on April 22, 2014, 10:40:41 PM
which build version should I install for the raw?
I'd go with the latest nightly.
How do you guys solve the pink dots with the newer MLV format?
I can't get PinkDotRemover to work on my mac with the MLV format
Quote from: Aborgh on April 27, 2014, 12:46:32 PM
How do you guys solve the pink dots with the newer MLV format?
I can't get PinkDotRemover to work on my mac with the MLV format
Hello, the Pink Dot Issue has nothing to do with the RAW video format (raw or mlv), it has to with the unique focusing system the 650D and a few other canon cameras use known as Hybrid Focusing (uses a combination of contrast and phase-difference, which makes it very fast and accurate, but introduces the pink dots to ML RAW video).
As far as pink dots being embedded in ML RAW video, this will probably never change, as I don't foresee ML devs trying to remove pink dots in-camera for raw video as that wouldn't be considered a unified solution, which is a primary aim for this dev community regarding the ML project (and rightly so IMO).
Don't know what you mean by "can't get it to work". As far as getting the PDR Tool to run, if it's a java based app (which I believe it is), make sure you have Java JRE or SDK installed.
If the app is running, but not actually removing the pink dots, make sure you are using the correct resolution video (I think it only works for 720p, but not 100% sure) and note whether your are shooting 1x or 3x crop mode, there are two separate tools, one for each format. Also there is a Chroma Smoothing app available in which the video resolution and crop mode would be irrelevant, but not sure it works as well as the PDR Tool.
I would strongly suggest reading the entire thread(s) for pink dot removal, as there are a few quirks with each of the apps and you will only discover them after reading the entire thread (however long it is :-)
EDITED: Also see @andy kh response below.
Quote from: Aborgh on April 27, 2014, 12:46:32 PM
How do you guys solve the pink dots with the newer MLV format?
I can't get PinkDotRemover to work on my mac with the MLV format
pink dot remover wont work with mlv. first you wil have to convert to raw. or you can use mlvmystic if u want to convert mlv to dng. make sure you check chroma smooth.
Quote from: andy kh on April 27, 2014, 02:11:48 PM
pink dot remover wont work with mlv. first you wil have to convert to raw. or you can use mlvmystic if u want to convert mlv to dng. make sure you check chroma smooth.
Thank you for posting additional correct info, I never tried it with MLV :o
Quote from: jimmyD30 on April 27, 2014, 01:20:09 PM
Hello, the Pink Dot Issue has nothing to do with the RAW video format (raw or mlv), it has to with the unique focusing system the 650D and a few other canon cameras use know as Hybrid Focusing (uses a combination of contrast and phase-difference, which makes it very fast and accurate, but introduces the pink dots to ML RAW video).
As far as pink dots being embedded in ML RAW video, this will probably never change, as I don't foresee ML devs trying to remove pink dots in-camera for raw video as that wouldn't be considered a unified solution, which is a primary aim for this dev community regarding the ML project (and rightly so IMO).
Don't know what you mean by "can't get it to work". As far as getting the PDR Tool to run on a Mac, if it's a java based app (which I believe it is), make sure you have Java JRE or SDK installed.
If the app is running, but not actually removing the pink dots, make sure you are using the correct resolution video (I think it only works for 720p, but not 100% sure) and note whether your are shooting 1x or 3x crop mode, there are two separate tools, one for each format. Also there is a Chroma Smoothing app available in which the video resolution and crop mode would be irrelevant, but not sure it works as well as the PDR Tool.
I would strongly suggest reading the entire thread(s) for pink dot removal, as there are a few quirks with each of the apps and you will only discover them after reading the entire thread (however long it is :-)
EDITED: Also see @andy kh response below.
Sorry for the lack of info :)
I can get PDR to work correctly, it starts and seems to process the pictures, although it does not remove the auto-focus points on the dng's.
I convert MLV to dng and then use PDR but it is not removing the dots. Seems like the tool is not useable anymore...
Quote from: Aborgh on April 27, 2014, 03:14:12 PM
I convert MLV to dng and then use PDR but it is not removing the dots. Seems like the tool is not useable anymore...
MLV is not usable on 650D, because it's slower. PDR works fine for resolutions which are the multiples of 4. For better performance use x16, eg 1536x640 for cinemascope.
Just for comparison:
resolution MLV_rec time RAW_rec time
1536 x 642 23 sec
1536 x 640 83 sec
1568 x 656 32 sec
MLV is for big brothers. 650D feels better with raw_rec.
mlv is not that bad for 650D. you can shoot@1472 X 616 continous. everybody wants to record audio as well in thier camera especially film makers like me.
Yeah, I like to shoot 720p@24 fps raw and you can't with mlv on the 650D, ergo my less than complete answer to @Aborgh above... Although I can appreciate the mlv sound feature for at least syncing video with external recording and I guess using the in camera audio itself if recorded with external mic, as the internal audio with built-in mic is nothing to speak about other than for syncing to external recording, which is actually highly desired for some run-and-gun type filmmakers who don't always use a clapboard.
I recently upgraded to 5DM2 and so now using MLV :)
I'd say journalists wants to record sound in-camera more often than filmmakers. Filmmakers used to have external recorders )) But anyway, in order to PDR work properly, you need 4x resolutions (1536 x 640 or 1568 x 656 works just fine with my modified raw_rec). You may change mlv_rec by yourself and compile, or ask some of the developers to add some resolution choices into the builds.
Another option is obviously update the PDR tool according to res. changes, but again, enough java for me )
i use the audio recorded in my camera only for syncing with audio recorded with external recorder or for doing ADR. it saves a lot of time in post production so i feel its important recording audio in camera
Quote from: Aborgh on April 27, 2014, 12:46:32 PM
How do you guys solve the pink dots with the newer MLV format?
I can't get PinkDotRemover to work on my mac with the MLV format
If I were you I would really keep trying to figure out what's wrong with the PDR Tool not working. I know I had some trouble at first too. I mean even things like some of the app settings you can select were backwards or didn't do anything (like selecting EOS-M didn't work for EOS-M cameras, but the 650D setting did and some video resolutions didn't work as well as others because the focus points are hard coded). And even though some things in the app were a little quirky, development kind of petered off and new versions weren't released with the fixes, we just kind of picked up the work arounds in the threads.
Also, which version are you using? 0.8 was the latest last I checked, but it's tricky to find the download. To help narrow down what's what, I suggest you try shooting RAW (not mlv) at 720p and see how the tool works, that's the scenario which seemed to yield the best results for me. Taking this approach of process of elimination will help us help you. I know it can be aggravating and time consuming, but taking a step-by-step approach with these kinds of things works well, especially in an online help setting.
And take it from a guy that's been developing apps for over 25 yrs, please include ALL relevant info when asking for help, why? Two reasons...
1) We need that info to better help you and it won't take 6 posts to get it (things like Operating System, App Version, Camera Model, Installed ML Version and Settings, Video Details, just to name a few!).
2) Forum folks are tired of reading such posts without this info included and end up not even bothering to reply rather than go through this back and forth info gathering for the dozenth time.
I'm not trying to knock you, you're a filmmaker, not a software developer, I recognize that, just trying to advise you on how to get better help in resolving your dilemma :)
i don have any problem with PDR
all pink dots are remove very well. this is my first mlv raw video shot wit 650D. this video was made just to see how PDR n audio works..
Quote from: andy kh on April 27, 2014, 06:18:51 PM
i don have any problem with PDR
all pink dots are remove very well. this is my first mlv raw video shot wit 650D. this video was made just to see how PDR n audio works..
Sorry @andy kh, my response was meant for @Aborgh, I'll update my previous post :-\
EDITED: By the way, video looks great!
I have a quick question, is this normal that all of my recorded raw videos are stretched? Can I fix that via magic lantern settings? Should I pick different resolution, aspect ratio?
Is 1080p selected in the canon menu?
hi, Yes 1080 24 . Saludos.
Hi all, nice to be hear.
I'm not being very successful with raw video on the 650d.
The card is a Sandisk extreme pro 95mb/s.
I keep getting crashes (see pic) or when it does work the playback just stops after a couple of secs and the camera turns off.
Also, how do you edit the raw movie files? Vegas refused it.
Sorry if these have been discussed before as I'm new to the whole thing.
Cheers,
Mike
(http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn183/spottydog10/crash_zps76957684.jpg)
http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?board=54.0
Hi Walter,
Thanks for that, there's a lot of reading there.
Is there step by step work flow instructions anywhere?
Thanks,
Mike
Anybody advise me on the crash?
Thanks
Mike
Hi all!
First of all, big thank you to the whole team for doing such a great job on developing magic lantern for canon 650D. It is good to know, that you don't have to have canon 5D to be part of the community ;)
I do have a quick question: is it possible to remove pink dots from the 50fps footage from 650D? I managed to record a 30-sec clip on 50fps (720) but because the footage is squashed the pink dot remover seems to fail to remove the dots. Or is it possible to resize the dng's to the right resolution and then process it with pink dot remover?
It would be a bomb to have the possibility of shooting short clips with 50fps.
Big thanks in advance!
J.
Helpful forum.
Quote from: Jacu on May 19, 2014, 11:07:22 AM
Hi all!
First of all, big thank you to the whole team for doing such a great job on developing magic lantern for canon 650D. It is good to know, that you don't have to have canon 5D to be part of the community ;)
I do have a quick question: is it possible to remove pink dots from the 50fps footage from 650D? I managed to record a 30-sec clip on 50fps (720) but because the footage is squashed the pink dot remover seems to fail to remove the dots. Or is it possible to resize the dng's to the right resolution and then process it with pink dot remover?
It would be a bomb to have the possibility of shooting short clips with 50fps.
Big thanks in advance!
J.
Nope, but chromasoothing seems to solve the pink dot problem regardless of resolution.
Hey guys!
I'm trying to record some raw video on my 45MB/s SDHC card and it works but not as well as it's supposed to. When using a 95MB/s card (SDHC as well) it works a lot better and I even get better results than most people even though the 650D has a speed limit around 40-50MB/s, right? That seems to be because most 45MB/s cards are actually 10-45MB/s cards. Still some people get great results with 45MB/s cards, almost as good as 95MB/s. Have I simply choosen a bad 45MB/s card that rarely gets up to its max speed or is there anything I can do about it?
I've read here http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5780.25 (http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=5780.25) that A1ex has a method for exFAT formatting cards which I can't find. If I got this right exFAT with 128 KB is supposed to increase write speed. Don't know if I'm doing something wrong but it rather decreases write speed for me.
I've also found that .raw is a lot better than .mlv: I get more than twice as long recording time!!! Is there anything I can do to improve mlv recording or will .raw be better until mlv is fully developed?
SD card rating is for read speeds (close approximation anyway), write speeds are much slower. I'm using 95MBps cards to get the most out of the 650D, 45 MBps rated cards definitely will NOT write fast enought to get continuous 720p@24fps raw out of the camera even though the write speed limit for the camera is like 37-41MBps.
I've read where a slightly slower card, 65/75/85MBps (I forget which) did work, but barely and it depended upon the copy you got, some worked, some didn't. I know the 95MBps cards are expensive, but they're really the only ones that will be guarenteed to work to get continuous 720p@24fps out of the camera.
And yes, I have the same experience with RAW vs MLV, the audio aspect of MLV will not allow continuous 720p@24fps and probably never will.
Quote from: jimmyD30 on June 08, 2014, 12:50:41 PM
45 MBps rated cards definitely will NOT write fast enought to get continuous 720p@24fps raw out of the camera even though the write speed limit for the camera is like 37-41MBps.
I don't know what you are doing but I have 3 Sandisk 45MB/s rated Cards and with all of them it is flawlessly possible to record 720p24 until the card is full.
That's impossible unless you have REALLY small cards, because they only write at no more than 25 MBps (this is my testing AND SanDisk's own spec reports) and continuous 1280x720@24fps requires 37.1 MBps. So I'm not sure if you're referencing the correct info or are your cards only like 128MB in size?
If they are real small, then yes, you can write continuously until the card is full of course for like 30 secs because the camera buffer will allow for it :D
Quote from: jimmyD30 on June 08, 2014, 09:56:36 PM
That's impossible...
Confirm these cards (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/828326-REG/SanDisk_SDRX3032GA21_32GB_SDHC_Memory_Card.html) are just fine for 720p continuous. Their write speeds benchmarks in ML test about 40 MB/s (controller limit)
Manufacturer's write speed claim is 45 MB/s, which is true (confirmed on usb 3.0 card reader)
Quote from: Rewind on June 08, 2014, 10:43:11 PM
Confirm these cards (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/828326-REG/SanDisk_SDRX3032GA21_32GB_SDHC_Memory_Card.html) are just fine for 720p continuous. Their write speeds benchmarks in ML test about 40 MB/s (controller limit)
Manufacturer's write speed claim is 45 MB/s, which is true (confirmed on usb 3.0 card reader)
Read more carefully, SanDisk says "Read/Write speeds up to 45MB/s" , yes, the read part does go up to 45MBps, not the write speed, sorry, but the devil is in the details. I own these exact cards and tested them in camera and with USB 3.0 and no such luck, write speeds 30-35 MBps all day long. I do realized different copies vary, but not by that much.
Quote from SanDisk site: http://www.sandisk.com/products/memory-cards/sd/extreme-uhs-1-45mbs/
"45 MB/s Read/Write Speed for Faster Performance and Downloads
With read speeds as fast as 45MB/s, this card unleashes the full shooting potential of your advanced camera or DSLR."
Note how at first they combine the statement about 'Read/Write speeds of up to 45Mbps', then they qualify that statement by saying 'With read speeds of up to 45 MBps...', the they NEVER mention write speeds again, only as a combined statement with Read Speeds, subtle, but meaningful legal difference (to avoid lawsuits for false advertising).
This is common advertising gimmick to trick the consumer into 'believing' what they wish were true, but really in fact isn't.
UPDATE: I just re-tested my 45MBps SanDisk 16GB cards, in camera and USB 3.0 card reader, my results:
USB 3.0 card reader: 43.9 MBps Read / 37.5 MBps Write
In Camera: Read 41.7-43.5 MBps / Write 35.7-37.5 MBps
So, my apologies, I don't remember getting this high of write speeds, BUT I do know they did NOT work for continuous 720p@24fps RAW in my camera with FRAME SKIPPING=OFF.
Quote from: Rewind on June 08, 2014, 10:43:11 PM
Confirm these cards (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/828326-REG/SanDisk_SDRX3032GA21_32GB_SDHC_Memory_Card.html) are just fine for 720p continuous. Their write speeds benchmarks in ML test about 40 MB/s (controller limit)
Manufacturer's write speed claim is 45 MB/s, which is true (confirmed on usb 3.0 card reader)
The new yellow cards are working perfectly too.
http://www.amazon.de/SecureDigital-Capacity-Speicherkarte-Frustfreie-Verpackung/dp/B00422J0CG/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1402427368&sr=8-3&keywords=sandisk+16gb
So now we have SRM memory interface working with raw_rec module.
It gives us additional 2x31 MB of buffer memory for recording.
Thanks to mk11174 for finding STUBS and for Dmilligan for making changes to modules.
Some quick results at 23.976 fps:
Resolution Old rec. time no SRM (GD off) New rec. time with SRM (GD on)
1568 x 656 (2.39:1) 32 s 53 s
1600 x 672 (2.38:1) 18 s 32 s
1728 x 720 (2.40:1) 7 s 12 s
So we have x1.7 recording time increase even with Global Draw on
So Guys, which one is better ? A1ex Raw2DNG with chroma smoothing or PDR ?
I have tried it both, but i don't see any difference. But With Raw2DNG cs2x2 it makes the workflow more simple
is there any case that Raw2DNG with chroma smoothing will create artifact in a picture?
Quote from: Rewind on July 09, 2014, 05:02:55 PM
So now we have SRM memory interface working with raw_rec module.
Which build are you using because there are some failed nightly builds.
Quote from: spider on July 21, 2014, 06:03:16 PM
Which build are you using because there are some failed nightly builds.
That was unified from July, 8. I've edited raw_rec according to Dmilligan first changes (https://bitbucket.org/dmilligan/magic-lantern/commits/2c86608a549a7a3b1e85fd17b9acd8ed9214d8c0) and compiled. That changes were not in nightlies.
Mk submitted the stubs for 650d
Can't wait to install ML on my t4i
I found with 600d that using the Sandisk Extreme Pro cards (write 90 mb/s), that I was able to get a 23.3 mb/s continuous write, which was about 2.3 mb/s faster than was expected.
Has anyone tried using Sandisk Extreme Pro (write 90 mb/s) with anamorphic (2.39) 1728 x 723 @ 24 fps??? Its about 80% of a 1280p anamorphic frame., so up res is not that big. The equation requires about 42 mb/s, and perhaps with the very fast cards the SD controller can support a continuous write???
PS: My Lexar 32GB 400x SDHC were 20.0 mb/s write to the decimal. I could get 1152x433 which requires 19.9 mb/s continuous write, but it skipped frames around 40-45s at 960x540 which requires 20.7 mb/s.
We just shot the entire series of the First Five Years @ 1280x720 24fps and many takes were well over several minutes. We used the Sandisk Extreme Pros.
If you want to see it, I posted it in the "Share your Videos" section of this forum: http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=12998.0
Quote from: AgentJJ on August 14, 2014, 09:13:00 PM
We just shot the entire series of the First Five Years @ 1280x720 24fps and many takes were well over several minutes. We used the Sandisk Extreme Pros.
I saw episode 1, what a cool thing. You made the 650D shine! I like the set photos too.
China ball lights, LED lights, nice to see the full indy lighting treatment.
My constructive comments:
I liked the raw/colours, and the 720p frame size shined (it seemed very TV like full size on my 27" screen). Nice pace but I would like to see some non-dialogue driven shots. Perhaps physical comedy and clowning?
If you head out doors to a new location, I would like to see a few more establishing shots worked in. The shots seemed very dialogue driven (heads).
The vocal audio was very loud compared to the ambient sounds, I think out doors it should be a little more mixed in level else it starts to sound studio dubbed (personal taste perhaps?).
Great stuff!!!
So how big is a 1280 x 720 frame? Mine are apparently 1272 x 712 (according to Raw Therapee and Sony Vegas).
Is this correct? Can it be changed to be the exact size? Vegas seems to have a hard time scaling this.
using nightly.2014Sep01.650D104
Thanks,
Andy
Hello Everyone,
I have browsed a lot of message in this topic I but did not found any answer to my problem.
It is simple : I can not record 1280X720 25fps in continous with raw_rec.so on my Canon 650D.
I have a scandisk SD card Extreme Pro 32 Go at 95 MB/s and exFAT formatted
My ML firmware is Nightly.2014.March22.650D104 (ok, it is a litte old, but did not find any reason that is too old for continous recording).
The Modified Page shows me :
Global Draw OFF
FPS Override OFF
RAW Video ON, 1280x720
I can record 26-27 second maximum. After that my Canon close the miror (no crash, but liveview mode is stopped). I have to turn OFF and turn ON the power button. The video file is on the SD card, the dng frames are correctly extracted. The problem contanstly occurs everytime I record more than 27 seconds.
Thanks by advance for your help,
@akprodr
I saw this problem on Raw Therapee version 1.4 (windows plateform). But RT crashs to much on my machine, so I use Camera Raw and PhotoShop to develop my images, and the jpg size is correct = 1280 x 720. I think the problem come from RT. I do not know why ? May be because there is no metadata in the outputfile file if you use raw_rec.so ?
Set auto power off to off or longer eg. 10Min
Thanks a lot Spider, it works ! I got continious raw recording ...
Hello,
This is my first real world try with raw video in the 650D. I used raw2dng_cs2x2 to get rid of the pink dots, and it did an excellent job despite the resolution. I recorded at 1344x672 which gave me continous recording and a few shots in 1600x800 but this only gave me 10 seconds or so.
I had seen a lot of tests of raw quality, but needed some skin tones, real world shooting conditions, not only leaves and that stuff! You can see it here:
The process is a bit tedious, being the worse converting to dngs because of the time needed, but the result in image quality and the control over the image that you get from raw, is simply amazing. It really hurts to see the h264 now!!
What rig did you use for underwater shots? Nice stuff. Some of the skin tones were a bit pinky, have you tried the the Marvel picture styles 3.3, 3.4 or the flaat 11? Its just for those H264 shots, you might find it helps.
ShootMeAlready,
I used an old Ewa Marine soft case I had for my Canon XH-A1. All I could do with it is press record out of the water and then dive in! You can't operate the camera easily inside that case. It was my first attempt at underwater video and I definitely need a lot of more practice!
I edited the video in a day and a half, including all the proccess for the raw archives, so I had not time to really tweak the files a lot in camera raw. I wanted to be in time for Neumannfilms "Summer In" contest. That's why I coudn't pay all the attention to details as I would have wanted.
I recently read that for big magazines and advertising agencies, skin tones MUST contain more yellow than magenta or they wouldn't publish a picture (talking about fashion, beauty shots, ads, etc). Which, translated to our RGB world should read as more green than blue for a skin tone to be "pleasant". I will try this concept from now on!
In raw video, picture profiles don't apply as you know, but for the h264 I have used cinestyle a lot. It's a great tool but I find myself using the neutral profile with contrast all the way donw most of the time now. Sometimes cinestyle gives me very noisy footage, but I haven't determined in which situations that happens. I don't have time to do all the tests I would like to!
Thanks for your comment!
Ok to get more green than blue.
Marvel cinestye ver 3.4 adds slight green to skin good for northern sun, sounds like what you want. The Marvel ver 3.3 pic style adds slight orange which is good for southern sun. Simlaar's flaat_11, actually supports 11EV peaks, and adds slight yellow to skin, good for indoor lighting. The trick is to get a proper white balance else the pic style never looks right. I also found you need to center exposure EV=0, as I like to use Tv priority when I dont need the shallow DOF in the clip. If exposure is not right it impacts your H264 since there is less recovery room in post, and the right exposure helps get the right colour (ie. a red looks like a richer darker red, where as overexposed looks like there's yellow hue and the red seems off). H264 is much more difficult to work with colour hue IMHO. BTW the Marvel and Simlaar stuff is free, google is your friend.
Hello! Boys, try to take off Raw on the 650d at Iso400 noise is strongly noticeable. At Iso800 so much. Possibly do I do that not so??
Hello. I would also boast of its RAW video, shot on 650D, the picture very much, but a little spoiled video stabilization, following time plan without stabilization program to make a video.
(P.S. Sorry for my English - translation Google translator =))
ONEfromTWO never tried those ISOs with raw, so I cannot help you. What about lower ISOs? are they looking fine in raw?
Hello, this is my last video, recorded with a t4i.
My workflow was as follow: shoot everything with a lot of care of not clipping any highlight in the focus points area (the damned pink dots), use batchelor3 with raw2dng_cs2x2 to extract the DNGs, develop them in After Effects with Adobe Camera Raw and exported a clip with all the videos in Black Magic's 4:4:4 10bit codec. Then I edited it in Premiere Pro, added a LUT and some grain... whoa! Takes a lot of waiting for all those operations, but I love the end result!
I cant get my T4i to record raw. I installed MAGIC LANTERN .
do i have to install any other firm ware or software.
Frank
Bronx NY
Module tab -> Enable MLV_REC.mo *or* RAW_REC.mo -> Restart cam -> Movie tab -> Enable and configure RAW/MLV recording.
andrewespuni
What lenses have you used for Land Cruiser vid? It looks amazing!
Hello, I am new to the whole raw video think. I just update newest nightly built on my T4i and I am trying raw for the first time. The quality what I am getting from my T4i is not quite close compare to what I have seen here or youtube, so I know that T4i can do better.
Workflow:
resolution 1472x828
I used raw2dng_cs2x2.exe for converting raw to DNG and for removal of pink dots. Than I used after effect to generate video sequence in avi loos less format.
The first video is just terrible its avi, straight from AE without any corrections in camera raw. There is a lot of noise and those lines on the edges, its just awful.
Here is just screen shot from wm player, because after upload to youtube it wasn't that visible
(http://s28.postimg.org/e577nt8zh/hrany.jpg)
The second one is little bit better. I used the same process as on the first one but from AE I took it premiere and export as H.264 HD for youtube. Its better but still not as good as would expect.
So here is my question, what am I doing wrong ? Is there some set up before shooting what I should do or something in the workflow ?
And second question, I am using SD card SanDisk Extreme 80 MB/s, will it help if I format it on exFAT ? And what is the highest resolution in which I can get continuous shoot at least 20 second on T4i and which SD card I need for it ?
Thanks for any help!
dreamARTz, sorry for the late reply. I used my Tokina 11-16 2.8, cheap but great Canon 50mm 1.8 and Samyang 85mm 1.4 (the old one, not the cine one). Thanks for your kind words!
Hi guys. What is the situation with "ML" for 650D (T4i) ?
Completed the development?
How to work with RAW?
1) Fine
2) As long there is a maintainer: Nope! And lucky we are!
3) Use ExFAT file system. Post-process is quite the same for all cams supporting RAW/MLV.
Hi
I am shooting 768 x 462 on my 650D and need to use the PINK DOT REMOVAL tool.
I have run it straight out the box and the RAW file when I look at it in MLRawViewer is still showing the dots.
Does anyone know what I have to do to get it to work ok?
Cheers
Mat
ues raw2cdng
I shot a whole Music video on the 650D.
Looks pretty amazing I think.
https://youtu.be/gMYpZOzeaWQ
Hi everyone !
I'm new here and just new ML user. I got a 650D/T4i and 18-135mm Canon STM, for the moment i was photographer only. This is my portfolio https://www.flickr.com/photos/toinebzx/
I have a question :
Can i use a 128Go SD card as this one ?
http://www.amazon.fr/Komputerbay-Digital-Extended-Capacity-vitesse/dp/B00CX8SJDM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1453241293&sr=8-1&keywords=128Go+sd
or
256Go as this one ?
http://www.amazon.fr/Komputerbay-Digital-Extended-Capacity-vitesse/dp/B00CX8SJDM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1453241293&sr=8-1&keywords=128Go+sd
Which one could you advise for 1920x720 :
45kb/s is enough ?
90kb/s is better ?
150kb/s ?
How many minutes can i record on 32, 64 or 128 in 1920x720 ?
Please, excuse my poor english and thanks for your answers.
Hi everyone,
I had "ML" on my T4i/650d I use the modules raw_rec and mlv_play. When I start to record my camera said "early stop (14) didn't make it to estimated record time." after many research I think the problem became from my flash memory card. I use a SanDisck ultra 80mb/s Sdhx 1 "10". some people said "use a SanDisck Extrem pro 90-95 mb/s" you can see this flash memory card here http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007NDL54C/ref=as_li_qf_sp_asin_il_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=B007NDL54C&linkCode=as2&tag=tbonestech-20&linkId=XSZ7NG7EQP5GXQAX
if I used this Flash memory card did you the problem gone ?
sorry for my english.
Probably not, what resolution and framerate are you recording in?
2 problems.
1. sometimes the dngs gets fickering . also, 2 when overexposing i get hot pixels here and there in the overexposed (clipped parts). eaven with 2x chroma smoothing.
mostly in clipped whites and black.
mlv producer
is there a remedy for this?
Bonjour
Serait-il possible de connaitre les réglages à effectuer sur ML pour enregistrer une raw video la meilleure possible?
Merci d'avance !!!
Croco.
Hello
Could you Tell me the configuration in ML to record in raw video as the Best as possible ?
Thanks
Croco.